Stucco & Rain Screens?

[mrkozz]

Hoping this is still an OK place to ask this questions.

We need to use Stucco on a project (just consider it a MUST, long story), but has anyone used Stucco well in the PNW, Who do you use?, and is there a need or ability to ventilate it?  

Having not considered it for projects in the past and it's long history of failure in our region I am struggling to find competent and proven ways to detail this assembly.   We are trying to get 3" of exterior insulation on a new residence with Stucco Siding and attempting to ventilate the assembly properly. 

Suggestions?
Thanks!

[Graham S. Wright]

There was this article:

http://www.buildingsciencelabs.com/moisture-exterior-insulation-pacific-northwest/

-gw

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[Albert Rooks]

I’ll add this just incase it’s relevant:

If STUCCO can be a Lime Plaster, then an alternative way that we are working out is the typical thin coat applications used widely in central europe. The common practice is a 4 to 7mm thick coat over woodfibre insulation or cork. I’ve personally looked at the materials and layering closely as well as walked european buildings. To me, it makes far more sense than the thick layer back ventilated approach.

The basics are:

A thin coat directly over the exterior cork/woodfibre insulation (We’ve settled on cork since we have the right series of partners in place that will support and warrant). The lime is vapor open, does not act as a reservoir since it’s (thin coat), and therefor doesn’t hold and accumulate moisture below the layer that needs to be ventilated. The finish is a silica paint and easy to maintain.

It’s already in our plan to do a building. We’ve imported the initial sample mixes and applied them on a test wall. Looks good and uses simple domestic skills.

I’ve attached a spec sheet.  There are more technical docs.

Best,

Albert. (Small Planet)

[Cory Hawbecker]

I know they're poison words, but EIFS has come a long way since the many horrible failures of the past. I've used a Dryvit system that has a built-in fluid applied membrane behind EPS insulation, then they put a thin coat of acrylic plaster over the top. The fluid applied is a little rough, so it facilitates drainage, but not ventilation. If you can set it up to dry inwards, that could be a solution. If that freaks you out, which i can understand, I've also done a stucco over lath and roofing felt, fastened to plywood. The plywood is held off the external insulation to create a ventilated cavity. No failures yet. :)

cory

[Misterkozz]

Thanks Cory!

  This is super helpful.   I know other climates use these products a lot more than we do here in the PNW.  Seems like a bit of a chicken & egg up here.   Not a lot of folks do it so there is not a lot of it getting done & done well, so failures outshine the good outcomes maybe??

I think the EIFS technique with EPS seems to be the way I have seen folks do it the most around here.  The fact that the stucco is often painted as if it is a regular concrete wall seems to freak me out too.   I get that the stucco material itself is vapor open, but then after layers of latex paint gets applied it seems that you are asking for trouble somewhere along the way.

We will keep plugging away on this.

Thanks for the info, Cory!

Scott

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[Misterkozz]

Thanks Albert!

  This looks like another really great product!   Or, I guess an historic product used in a new technique.  

Looks like this is a super low, or no, maintenance product when completed.  The stucco I’m familiar with is generally close to an inch thick and more a concrete based material instead of the lime plaster.   It get painted (elastomeric latex acrylic paint general, to try and hide the inevitable cracking) and always seems risky...in our climate at least.

What is your price point on this looking like?  Always looking for exterior products that will last forever!

Thanks,

Scott

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<SecilVit_CORK_board.pdf>

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[Albert Rooks]

Hi Scott,

The last I looked at pricing, it wasn't too much. I think the materials for a 2500ft2 project were about $2500.00 or so. There are two or three coats with an embedded mesh. Then paint. The labor looked fine since they are thin coats.

Best,

Albert.

Sent from my iPad

[Cory Hawbecker]

 Dryvit is an acrylic coating not dissimilar from latex... and it's thick like 20 coats of paint. I don't know the numbers, but I suspect that the whole assembly is not very vapor open, especially if you want to put it over 3-4 inches of EPS. Hence my comment about drying inwards. Good luck!

[Mike Fletcher]

Hi All,

I have spoken to the Atlas Polyiso  Rep about this EFIS situation and his reply is attached below. He would also like to  join this google group.  How can he join this google group?  Are there any more spots available at the PH conference?

ALSO Atlas has a new CI product which you can check out on this link.  Would love to know what PH folks think? Please let us know.

http://wall.atlasrwi.com/products/commercial/energyshield-ply-pro/

It is used all the time on the roof top and now for CI.  R-value is fantastic and no more guessing where your stud is hiding.

Mike Fletcher

206-409-1684

_______________________________________________

Greetings,

 

My name is Justin Rasmussen and I work for Atlas Polyiso insulation and have a business contact with a Tech Rep for Parex USA.  Parex is a stucco system provider.  The man who can help answer a lot of questions on stucco in the NW is Larry Millspaugh with Parex,  Feel free to reach out to him directly by phone or email.  He will gladly help answer any questions and provide insight.  His contact info is: 206-234-3866 or email: larry.mi...@parexusa.com 

 

Can you get me in the group?

 

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Thank You,

 

Justin Rasmussen

NW District Sales Manager

Atlas Roofing - Commercial Roofing / CI Wall Board

(206) 226-4187

jrasm...@atlasroofing.com

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 12:37 PM, Cory Hawbecker <coryha...@gmail.com> wrote:

 Dryvit is an acrylic coating not dissimilar from latex... and it's thick like 20 coats of paint. I don't know the numbers, but I suspect that the whole assembly is not very vapor open, especially if you want to put it over 3-4 inches of EPS. Hence my comment about drying inwards. Good luck!

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[Carol Volpe]

Hi Mike

By any more spots, do you mean for attendees or vendors?  I'm sure there is for both. 

See you there. 

Carol Volpe 

 

Carol 

Pardon the typos, I'm all thumbs today. 

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