Assemblies - SIPS

[Brett Holverstott]

Hi folks,

I'm curious what people's experience is with SIPS building. I am put off by the high embodied energy of the foam, but I want to be sure I know what I am rejecting.

How does it cost compare in your experience?

How does it compare for simplicity and ease of installation?

For comparison, I prefer a cellulose double-wall with the load bearing wall and sheathing (air-barrier) on the exterior. The PHIUS literature considers this scheme "risky" probably because 1) it requires exterior rigid insulation to avoid condensation risk and 2) it requires lots of penetrations in the air barrier.

However, I am looking for the most affordable AND lowest embodied energy system. I am familiar with the various assemblies used by H+H.

Thoughts?

Brett

[Linda Whaley]

Have you checked out Build Smart?  These were designed by Adam Cohen, a CPHC on the east coast.  http://buildsmartna.com/

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[Brett Holverstott]

That's awesome!

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[Joe Giampietro]

Brett,

There is a new product out that makes a good permeable sheathing with an integral air barrier - DensElement for GP.  The system is warranted with a Prosoco liquid applied treatment at joints and fasteners.  

This is the combined air barrier and weather barrier.  Best to put the structural sheathing to the inside of the double stud wall to make the assembly vapor open more to the exterior.  My opinion is that this addresses condensation risk at the outside sheathing, but you may want a WUFI analysis run to check.  Use rain screen siding system to promote drying on that exterior plane.

DensElement is a joint effort of Georgia Pacific and BEI - Building Envelope Innovation - originator of Wet Flash.

My preferred wall assembly at present.

Joe Giampietro

206.618.1546

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[Mike Fletcher]

Thanks Joe!  I might step in in a day or so and introduce myself.   I really want to see some of the replies first.

BtW in an earlier mail from Brett to the PH group he mentioned how thankful he was for the networking.

I was the guy that showed NEST (our contractor) that Brett was looking for work.

Call that "the circle of life"

[Daniel Roy]

One thing that may not be well known is that GP is owned by Koch Industries, a company which is the antithesis of everything we are trying to accomplish in the Passive House community.  Try Goggling Koch Industries and see what pops up on the first page.  Things like being 14th worst polluter in the country on Polluters Watch.  Also they are the key contributor to the global warming denier crowd and ALEC, which is sponsoring nation wide legislation at the state level to defeat environmental programs.  This is why as a CPHC, I boycott all products from GP and anything else associated with Koch Industries if at all possible.  I hope this is helpful info and it is not intended to start a political storm, but rather to start a dialog on being cautious on which products we use in building a Passive House.  My wife and I live in a beautiful Passive House that completely avoided GP and with the PV we have, now have a net negative carbon footprint.  

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Dan Roy

 

508 388 7557

[Carol Volpe]

Dan,

Thank you for your comments.

I'm with you completely concerning the amount of damage the Koch Industries has caused and continues to cause but  to say they are the  "antithesis of everything we are trying to accomplish in the Passive House community (PH C)" is painting all they touch with a broad brush which then taints even those products or materials that support PH C principles and values as equally bad.  

Our challenge as individuals and as a group (PH) with strong values is: how to do we support beneficial investments and discourage or eliminate destructive environments?

I do not believe in the strict approach of voting with our dollars. Can I buy an ethical gasoline? Can I go with a cable company that isn't rapacious? How about a cell phone not made by virtually indentured workers?  Voting with dollars won't work because those whose behaviors should change already have most of the dollars. A market-democracy is what *they* want because it defines the rules in *their* favor.

Bernie Sanders has shown that we can buy our own politicians. We just need a laser focus like the NRA to force our elected representatives to toe the line that is compatible with our values... we just need to focus on a smaller set or singular value (like the NRA).

The situation before us at this moment -- in this conversation -- are two products which help us achieve our goals. 

We have allowed ourselves to  

Can we as a community or as individuals support the political change that has the hope of making the most impact and still support the PH best practices using products and materials that offer the most quality, durability, efficiency, comfort, health and safety?

As for the products Joe recommended "DensElement is a joint effort of Georgia Pacific and BEI - Building Envelope Innovation - originator of Wet Flash,"  

I highly recommend you get to know Mike Fletcher (GP Rep) and Tom Schneider (BEI). Both have been big supporters of PH and PHnw since its inception.  They continue to push the building industry in the direction of PH and all that it stands for. I believe you'll experience Mike and Tom as high integrity individuals who  genuinely believe they can be the change they (and you) seek in the world.

Best,

Carol Volpe

 

[Hayden Robinson]

Daniel,

 

Congratulations on your carbon-negative passive house! And thanks for the background on GP—I’m a fan of well-informed choices.

 

Hayden

[Hayden Robinson]

Carol,

 

I find a lot of wisdom in what you’ve written. Consumer choices often occur in a not-black-and-white zone. Inevitably, well intentioned people will weigh different factors differently. I think you, Joe and Dan have all provided great information for all of us to consider.

 

Hayden

 

From: passive...@googlegroups.com [mailto:passive...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Carol Volpe
Sent: Thursday, July 7, 2016 10:20 AM
To: Passive...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Assemblies - SIPS

 

Dan,