Solar or More Batteries
J.R. Peacock
Mark J Wilme
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Bill Jarvis
JR,
Do you mean that your two house bank batteries are 65AH rating, so that you have an installed house bank of 135AH?
If that is the case your usable capacity is only about 40AH. That is not even enough to run just your fridge 24 hours a day!
You really need to do a full energy budget for your boat covering everything that you use in at least 24 hours. Include everything, you radio, your instruments your gas solenoid any navigation lights including the anchor light, any entertainment equipment you use. You have already reduced a lot of these by converting to LED’s but they still use power.
Add up all those ampere hours. You house battery bank needs to be at least three times that total or your batteries will have very short lives.
You also then have an idea of how many ampere hours you need to put back in with whatever charging source you chose. Remember that a 20W solar panel will only put that out with full sunshine and that means only a few hours per day. 20W would be 1.75A for those few hours lets’ estimate 5 hours on Lake Michigan. That would only restore about 8 ½ Ampere hours. With two of them about 17 AH or enough to run your fridge 3 ½ hours!
Living off the grid for three weeks take a lot more planning.
Bill
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J.R. Peacock
or or
George Harris
Sent from my iPad
Mark J Wilme
davidcfletcher
Kidd, James
I also have this set up with two 135W panels on my 473, and I live on a mooring with Adler Barbour running all season.
Works very well.....
James
James A. Kidd
Kaydon Regional Manager
Northeast Office
617-448-2575
Jk...@Kaydon.com
________________________________________
From: benetea...@googlegroups.com [benetea...@googlegroups.com] on behalf of davidcfletcher [davidcf...@rogers.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2015 11:25 AM
To: Beneteau Group
Most all of Beneteau's boats with Adler Barbour, fight energy consumption. You can do all the little things which all make a difference however the unit is going to consume the vast majority of the electrical consumption at anchor. Mine runs about 50 percent of the time. I FIGURE 60 AMP HOURS A DAY AT THE VERY MINIMUM.
To make everything work well at anchor figure 400 amp hours in a battery bank and 60 to 80 amp hours input per day in warm weather. The only issue with the Honda is it takes a long time to get the last 15 percent into a 400 plus amp bank. Storage and noise.
Solar panels work well at pushing in the last 15 percent. AGM batterys are great. They cost more.
Two 140 watt panels and a good MPPT charge controller will keep you happy. Don't skimp on the wire size and buy a good controller you will be happy.
Just turn them on at anchor and forget about it.
Sent from my Samsung device
-------- Original message --------
From: Mark J Wilme <mark....@gmail.com>
Date: 2015-05-19 09:53 (GMT-05:00)
To: beneteau-owners <benetea...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: {Beneteau Owners} Solar or More Batteries
Our's isn't bubble wrap its a custom blanket that we had made from a vendor ad in the back of Points East or Windcheck.
Mark Wilme
Mark....@Gmail.com
+1 (508) 826 5607
On Tue, May 19, 2015 at 9:15 AM, George Harris <gharr...@gmail.com<mailto:gharr...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I've been following Mark's approach with the fridge for years- with a block of ice under a basket and bubble wrap over it's incredible how efficient that is- I also run the fridge only one hour out of four, that saves 60+ amp hrs a day. The fridge is what kills your battery bank.
George Harris
av Sophia
Sent from my iPad
We added capacity to our house bank. We now have 450Ah in the house bank and our fridge is our biggest draw. We mitigate this consumption by
1. Keeping the fridge full
2. Adding block ice to provide thermal mass
3. Using a thermal blanket on top of the fridge
4. Using a day cooler for water etc to reduce openings
Even with all that we still need to charge when at anchor for > 2 nights and we use an EU2000i to do that and a Charles 50A three stage charger.
Mark Wilme
+1 (508) 826 5607<tel:%2B1%20%28508%29%20826%205607>
www.linkedin.com/in/markwilme<http://www.linkedin.com/in/markwilme>
On Mon, May 18, 2015 at 3:29 PM, J.R. Peacock <jr.pe...@gmail.com<mailto:jr.pe...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hey All -
Happy Sailing season!
Have an Oceanis 351 in Lake Michigan and usually do a 2-3 week trip. We generally tend to anchor out as much as possible but this year are planning to stay put in one area on anchor for about a week. For that reason we are finally starting to think about power consumption and how to prolong/refill our power for that timeframe.
I realize we could fire the engine up every day and motor around for an hour or so but I want to explore other options to see how much they would cost. I am not sold that a wind Generator would be a good option for us as we will be trying to find a protected place to anchor and thereby eliminating wind.
Leaning towards one of the following:
1. Just get a couple more batteries to add to the house bank
2. Get Solar - not sold on permanently mounting the panels atop the boat as we are on dock the rest of the summer. Looked at maybe getting a couple of the foldable ones that are about 20Watts a piece from goal zero. Anyone use those?
We currently have 2 batteries in the house bank at about 65A a piece. Could we add two more? Obviously eventual recharge time would be doubled.
From a power consumption standpoint I started a spreadsheet but the main items will be:
1. Adler Barbour fridge - estimating this at 5Ah when running full and between 1.8-2.4Ah when cooled and intermittently turning on and off. We are also contemplating doing some additional insulation to the outside of the fridge to see if that helps. Any thoughts on that?
2. Occasional macerator for the toilet. We will do most of our toilet action on land.
3. We are all LED inside and will be converting our anchor light to LED this summer
4. We will have 3 iPhones that will need charging
5. A car stereo that we put in to play music that I need to track down the power consumption on
6. Usual pumps - bilge and fresh water
Any general feedback or thoughts? Should we just turn on the motor and recharge?
J.R.
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Captain Guy
Mark J Wilme
Dave Ellens
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Scott Cates
There have been some great responses to your question. I'll add my two cents as a guy living 24/7 in the tropics on mine. But first, I want to thank you for the phrase "toilet action"... I'm trying to work that into a conversation!
Your problem is temporary. 1 week. Here is how I'd prioritize my dollars for this situ.
1. Block ice or dry ice plus a day cooler for beverages. Done. We keep bottles of water and adult beverages in the bottom of our freezer as thermal mass.
2. Does the fridge or freezer need servicing? It's a closed system and therefore should not...but...After chasing fridge issues for several months, best advice and result I had personally was having a technician completely vacuum the refrigerant and replace it. Vacuum was key. If they simply service, they will likely add some air to the system which doesn't show until after the tech leaves...in most systems a little air is no big deal, but these systems are tiny and a little air can get it out of whack easily.
3. Just run your main engine. It's muffled to your neighbors and makes hot water.
4. Watch for thiefs. Turn the navigation system off at night...use a handheld gps or app for anchor alarm. Turn the radar AND scanner off when not needed. Keep the inverter off unless needed. My wife and kids are always plugging something in to recharge... Grr.
Everything next is overkill for a week:
4. Honda generator. Relatively quiet. Run it in the morning to recharge when the anchorage is awake and the easily offended are less so. Nice to have at the house when the power goes out as part of an emergency preparedness kit.
5. Capacity. Can't go wrong with more batts. Actually, this should go before a generator.
6. Solar. Magic. Benefit in your scenario is that you can leave your boat unplugged at the marina for the remainder of the year and always have batts topped off for the bilge pump, but less issues with shore power stray voltages. I have 560 on top the arch. The biggest amp eaters on our boat are the fridge and freezer followed by all the electronic recharging for two teens and parents and lastly the toilet action of the electric heads. (I'm not sure really about the last one...just felt compelled to include it.) We still operate at a net loss daily, but we run our 5kw generator every 4th day to make water and that gets us back to 100% on the 1000 amp AGM house...works for us.
7. Wind. Don't do it. I don't care how "quiet" people claim they are...most aren't after some use. I move when one anchors upwind of me.
Anyways, have a great time on the lake!
Scott
--
christopher WALTER
Bill Jarvis
The question is “do you want a freezer or a refrigerator?”
Bill
From: benetea...@googlegroups.com [mailto:benetea...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher WALTER
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2015 7:10 PM
To: benetea...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: {Beneteau Owners} Solar or More Batteries
I own a B361 that I keep in the BVI year round. My Alder Barbour would run almost constantly, and use about about 90 amps a day. I finally took out the alder Barbour freezer thermostat which uses 5 amps per hour, and replaced it with a refrigerator thermostat that uses 2 amps per hour, and my daily consumption is about 20 amps per day. The downside is it kicks in At 34 degrees and cuts out at 28 degrees. Now I am trying to see if I can get it to kick in at 32 and out at 26 degrees. Another live aboard in the islands with a B361, told me he solved his problem by installing a cutout switch that goes off and on every 20 minutes. Good luck with your boat
Captain Guy
On May 18, 2015 2:29 PM, "J.R. Peacock" <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','jr.pe...@gmail.com');> wrote:
Hey All -
Happy Sailing season!
Have an Oceanis 351 in Lake Michigan and usually do a 2-3 week trip. We generally tend to anchor out as much as possible but this year are planning to stay put in one area on anchor for about a week. For that reason we are finally starting to think about power consumption and how to prolong/refill our power for that timeframe.
I realize we could fire the engine up every day and motor around for an hour or so but I want to explore other options to see how much they would cost. I am not sold that a wind Generator would be a good option for us as we will be trying to find a protected place to anchor and thereby eliminating wind.
Leaning towards one of the following:
1. Just get a couple more batteries to add to the house bank
2. Get Solar - not sold on permanently mounting the panels atop the boat as we are on dock the rest of the summer. Looked at maybe getting a couple of the foldable ones that are about 20Watts a piece from goal zero. Anyone use those?
We currently have 2 batteries in the house bank at about 65A a piece. Could we add two more? Obviously eventual recharge time would be doubled.
From a power consumption standpoint I started a spreadsheet but the main items will be:
1. Adler Barbour fridge - estimating this at 5Ah when running full and between 1.8-2.4Ah when cooled and intermittently turning on and off. We are also contemplating doing some additional insulation to the outside of the fridge to see if that helps. Any thoughts on that?
2. Occasional macerator for the toilet. We will do most of our toilet action on land.
3. We are all LED inside and will be converting our anchor light to LED this summer
4. We will have 3 iPhones that will need charging
5. A car stereo that we put in to play music that I need to track down the power consumption on
6. Usual pumps - bilge and fresh water
Any general feedback or thoughts? Should we just turn on the motor and recharge?
J.R.
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dbg...@mindspring.com
How was the battery capacity arrived at 65 AH, is that the net available ? It is glaring small capacity, especially when same size batteries can be had that have rated capacities several times that.
Review your battery capacity, along with the energy audit... as example Interstate Battery makes group size 24 batteries ( small )( std wet cells ) that are rated at 140 AH, with the next larger popular sizes reaching into the 200+ AH capacity... do your homework, battery sales are lead by price not by capacity,
Load you fridge full a day or more a head ( except for last minute perishables ) to chill all the contents to the normal operating temp... ( think of how long it takes drinks to chill in the home fridge... it is many hours )... this way the fridge needs only to maintain temperature ( not chill) which saves a day or more of run time to get everything to temp... possibly eliminating the need for block ice etc
Mark J Wilme
J.R. Peacock
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