Looking for good gravel roads around the bay area

[ViveLemond]

I'm hoping I can get some assistance with finding good gravel roads to take my all road bike on (with 42 mm tires, no suspension).
I have found good information on the web to be quite elusive. I'm looking for rides that are within, ideally, a 2 Hour drive of Berkeley California. Marin, Sonoma, East Bay if that exist as well.

The next one on my list is the Fairfax Bolinas ridge which I am eager to try, but looking for other similar things.

Thank you in advance for any input, I look forward to the conversation.

[Derek Z]

Have you tried https://gravelmap.com/ ?

I've only used it for the NE but it's an interesting and useful resource here. I've also discovered lots of dirt rides in Ride with GPS' route library:

https://ridewithgps.com/find

Best of luck,

Derek Z in Brooklyn, NY

[Marc Pfister]

On Saturday, May 19, 2018 at 11:24:56 AM UTC-6, ViveLemond wrote:

I'm hoping I can get some assistance with finding good gravel roads to take my all road bike on (with 42 mm tires, no suspension).

Based on my old routes when I lived in the area 20 years ago (not sure of current conditions): 

There's the Big Basin loop: Big Basin Way (236) to Gazos Creek Road to Cloverdale Road to Butano Road to China Grade Road back to 236. You could start at Big Basin Park or in Pescadero. There are a bunch more dirt fire roads that come up from the coast that could be turned into loops but I'm not that familiar with the ones further north on the Peninsula.

I think you could also do something like start in Aptos, take the Aptos Creek fire road up through Nisene Marks to Highland Way, then around on Eureka Canyon back to the coast. I think there's some new trail connections on the north side of that Highland/Summit road area that could boost the mileage. You could also cut out of Nisene Marks at Hinkley Basin, take San-Jose-Soquel up to the Skyland area and take Long Ridge road to the bottom of the Soquel Demo Forsest and then take Hihn's Mill Road up to Highland. That detour would give you a lollypop loop to let you climb and descent the Aptos Creek fire road.

In the South Bay a combination of Montebello Road (paved) over the top (dirt) to Page Mill Road and then picking up Alpine Road (dirt at the top) down to Arastradero road, taking a roundabout way through Arastradero Open Space on trails before getting back to Page Mill and then Foothill Expressway looping back. The famous Cupertino Bike Shop would be a good start/finish. You also have opportunities to add more dirt with the trails systems up at the top of the ridge - many of them are old fire roads. You could also climb up from Arastradero Open Space into Foothills Park and out to Page Mill about halfway up. The foothills here have lots of great little backroads so I could recommend a more involved but also more fun way than riding Foothill Expressway.

- Marc 

[Marc Pfister]

On Saturday, May 19, 2018 at 11:24:56 AM UTC-6, ViveLemond wrote:

I'm hoping I can get some assistance with finding good gravel roads to take my all road bike on (with 42 mm tires, no suspension).

On the subject of Peninsula fire road, they were also a favorite of the late Jobst Brandt (I would run into him in the middle of nowhere and he would make fun of our Camelbaks). His "Jobst Rides" are discussed in many places and a little googling might give you some more ideas for dirt roads. His buddy Ray Hosler wrote a book called Roads to Ride (?)  that covered some of the classic backroads, and it looks like he has a blog now with lots more current information.

Back in the day many of the Peninsula mountain roads were minimally maintained and were best on fat slick tires. Seems like San Mateo County was trying to stay away from the dope growers and Hell's Angels. Not sure what the dot-com money has done to them these days.

- Marc

[franklyn]

There are great options right in East Bay. For example, loop road and trails connected to it in Tilden Park, Shell Ridge at My Diablo, and toads through Briones.

Marin county just less than an hour drive away has amazing options also. Old Railroad Grade and many dirt roads on Mt. Tam, the trails at Marin Headlands and Point Reyes, Bolinas Ridge that you mentioned.

Contact me offlist for route

Franklyn

[ViveLemond]

thanks guys.
well, i'll be trying some of these out. My concern is I think a lot of these at points are going to rough/bump out more than i'm going to be comfortable on a all-roadish bike.
it's a tricky game - finding gravel/dirt roads that don't turn into mtb trails. it will be fun to go exploring, and i can always walk if need be.
tomorrow it's going to be a bolinas ridge loop, which will be awesome.

[ViveLemond]

Well...the Bolinas Ridge trail did not go well. It's a rough trail, not a "gravel" road. In my opinion, it's for mountain bikes, not all-road bikes with 42mm tires.
Long story short, I don't think there's a lot viable "all-road gravel/dirt" riding in our area.
Rant below if you wish to continue reading.

Sure, if you're young and strong and don't mind getting beat up, you can do it, but there's a reason why mountain bikes were invented here.
I've lived in this area for 30 years, and am an avid hiker and road cyclist, having only dabbled in mountain biking for various reasons. I know what our trails and fire roads are like - they are rough, rocky, and rutted. So...apparently somewhere else there exists relatively flat gravel/dirt roads, but I don't think they are here in the Bay Area. And even if you find one, it's not going to be linked up to a long network of similar type surfaces, it will probably head into a rough trail at some point.

I'm not down on my bike - Rawland Nordavinden with 650b compass baby shoe pass els - in fact I love it. On the road down to Bolinas which was bumpy and chopped up it was fabulous and it's versatility shined. But as Clint said, a man's gotta know his limitations, and these bikes have their limits. There are obviously certain paths and such where they will work fine, but I don't think you can look at the map and assume you can link up Mt. Diablo fire roads and such. Again, mountain bikes have progressed from no suspension, to just front shocks, to full suspension for a reason! But I'll keep researching true fire/gravel roads in the Sierras and other places, as the idea of a long ride on a relatively smooth gravelish road sounds just wonderful, I hope to find one some day.

[CMR]

I respectfully disagree! I suggest trying low pressure tubeless if possible on your set-up. I sold my mountain bike and enjoy the mountain bike trails in the bay on my cross bike. Mountain bikes were invented here but the full suspension modern rigs are much more suited to crazy rooty east coast single track, in my opinion the bay is really great for fat tire rigid riding. Sure this is not Utah gravel roads, but we have terrific fire roads all around the Bay Area. Check out Marin headlands, china camp and anywhere the folks at Rivendell suggest around Walnut Creek.

Happy riding!

Chris

Berkeley, CA

[Joe Bunik]

Oh c'mon, Marc! Ray wrote 'Bay Area Bike Rides'-- while it was that
Grant Petersen guy who authored both volumes of 'Roads to Ride'.

You're right that Ray was Jobst's buddy though, and he's still getting
out there in those lovely South Bay hills:
https://rayhosler.com

=- Joe Bunik
Walnut Creek, CA

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[franklyn]

My wife, who is new to trail riding and doesn't like to do any type of descending off road, can ride up Old Railroad Grade on 38mm Soma B-line tires. The Headlands are about the same. I found that many trails on Mt Tam are ridable with 42mm tires. 

Franklyn

[Hunter Ellis]

The old Caz loop in Sonoma County is 50 miles, 4500 feet of climbing, 3.5 dirt descents, and probably 40% dirt/ 50% barely trafficked backroads/10% roads. My favorite ride in Sonoma County and totally do-able on 42's (be careful on the old caz descent though, and bring a change of socks!)

Can be broken up into smaller segments--just Willow Creek, for instance.

You can also ride from Fairfax over the woodacre grade and hook up with the Sam Taylor bike path, which has some gravel for a while, then over the Olema Ridge and south on 1 to 5 brooks trailhead. Then you can ride up Stewart trail to the top of the ridge on a perfect gravel road. 10 miles or so, 1300 feet of climbing, and you can either camp at Glen camp or fly back down . The descent is a perfect pitch for 42's

check out onionvelo on Instagram, they ride a lot of neat-looking roads  in the east bay.

You can head up to the Mendocino National Forest and ride some really long gravel loops, just stay away from the ATV's. Clear Lake to Bartlett Springs to the Reservoir and then back on hwy 20 is a great loop.

The fire road up and down mt st helena is nice. The fire road up and over Annadel (Santa Rosa) is nice, even though there's only an hour or two of riding for a road bike up there. Add in howarth park and some paved sections in Fountaingrove and you've got yourself a day.

+1 to those south coast loops, Cloverdale road is amazing as is pescadero and the old stage roads, but I didn't find any gravel...

One day I want to get up to northeastern CA near Modoc county and just take the forest service roads for miles and miles and miles....

[Marc Pfister]

On Monday, May 21, 2018 at 1:04:16 PM UTC-6, Joe Bunik wrote:

Oh c'mon, Marc! Ray wrote 'Bay Area Bike Rides'-- while it was that
Grant Petersen guy who authored both volumes of 'Roads to Ride'.

I blame youthful indiscretion and the inhalation of too much Gazos Creek moon dust.

- Marc 

[ViveLemond]

thanks everyone for all of your encouragement and route advice.

[Adem Rudin]

ViveLemond, I'm not surprised you had issues with Bolinas Ridge - that's a pretty rough trail; I felt pretty beat up riding the length of it on my rigid mountain bike with 2.3" tires. There are certainly a lot of smoother fire roads in the bay area. That said, they're generally all extended/steep climbs/descents... you'll be disappointed if you're looking for flat gravel.

I'm mostly familiar with the Peninsula/Santa Cruz Mountains, and I second Marc's suggestions here. I prefer to start in Pescadero, climb Butano, and head to the Big Basin park HQ for lunch (easy mode: China Grade to 236. Fun mode: Johansen to Middle Ridge). Then I take Gazos Creek Road from Big Basin back west towards the coast, and take either Cloverdale or Highway 1 back to Pescadero. I often ride that loop on 44mm Snoqualmie Pass slicks; I've even had a friend join me on 28s before. Montebello and Alpine are great dirt roads as well. Most of Russian Ridge OSP is doable with 40mm-ish tires, although you'll just ride loops - it doesn't "go" anywhere. 

Steven's Canyon is a little more singletrack-ish, but good as well. Old Haul Road is about the smoothest/flattest fire road I'm aware of on the peninsula, although you'll do a lot of paved climbing to get there and back out.

Closer to Berkeley, all of the stuff on the Marin Headlands between Sausalito and the ocean is really well graded; wide and smooth. Even Coastal View Trail north out of Muir Beach is probably road-bikeable. The trails on the south side of Mt. Tamalpais are well graded, but kind of rocky - I've definitely dented a rim flying down Railroad Grade with WTB Nano 40C tires. Good for climbing with skinny tires, though, and then you can descend on pavement.

-Adem Rudin

Mountain View, CA

On Sunday, May 20, 2018 at 9:42:05 PM UTC-7, ViveLemond wrote:

[Hunter Ellis]

Those rides sound amazing! It would be cool if we each organized a “I’m gonna do this dirt ride this weekend” series, so if we were motivated and interested we could tag along and learn some new routes around the Bay Area. Anyone interested, or is that too ambitious?

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[Reed Kennedy]

On Mon, May 21, 2018 at 6:06 PM, Hunter Ellis <hunterf...@gmail.com> wrote:

Those rides sound amazing! It would be cool if we each organized a “I’m gonna do this dirt ride this weekend” series, so if we were motivated and interested we could tag along and learn some new routes around the Bay Area. Anyone interested, or is that too ambitious?

Several of us do something similar over on the Bay Area Rivendell Riders list: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/bay-area-rivendell-riders

Contrary to the name of the group most of us don't (currently / always) ride Rivendells. The rides posted are generally BOBish in flavor, but the last one was actually a full-on mountain bike ride at Skeggs! The majority were on full-boing MTBs for that one. The ride before that was a road tour of North Bay cheesemakers. The next one is going to be a gravel ride up Old Railroad Grade to the West Point Inn at the top of Mt Tam for their June 17th pancake breakfast. 

In short, it's a nice list where local folks who appreciate practical bikes plan rides. Feel free to join!

Also keep an eye out for the June 23rd and 24th campout I'll be announcing in a day or two. I planned it with some advice from Adem, and while it's mostly pavement it does feature the full length of Old Haul Road. 

More soon, but here's a teaser:

Best,

Reed Kennedy

San Francisco, CA

 

On Mon, May 21, 2018 at 5:57 PM Adem Rudin <adem....@gmail.com> wrote:

ViveLemond, I'm not surprised you had issues with Bolinas Ridge - that's a pretty rough trail; I felt pretty beat up riding the length of it on my rigid mountain bike with 2.3" tires. There are certainly a lot of smoother fire roads in the bay area. That said, they're generally all extended/steep climbs/descents... you'll be disappointed if you're looking for flat gravel.

I'm mostly familiar with the Peninsula/Santa Cruz Mountains, and I second Marc's suggestions here. I prefer to start in Pescadero, climb Butano, and head to the Big Basin park HQ for lunch (easy mode: China Grade to 236. Fun mode: Johansen to Middle Ridge). Then I take Gazos Creek Road from Big Basin back west towards the coast, and take either Cloverdale or Highway 1 back to Pescadero. I often ride that loop on 44mm Snoqualmie Pass slicks; I've even had a friend join me on 28s before. Montebello and Alpine are great dirt roads as well. Most of Russian Ridge OSP is doable with 40mm-ish tires, although you'll just ride loops - it doesn't "go" anywhere. 

Steven's Canyon is a little more singletrack-ish, but good as well. Old Haul Road is about the smoothest/flattest fire road I'm aware of on the peninsula, although you'll do a lot of paved climbing to get there and back out.

Closer to Berkeley, all of the stuff on the Marin Headlands between Sausalito and the ocean is really well graded; wide and smooth. Even Coastal View Trail north out of Muir Beach is probably road-bikeable. The trails on the south side of Mt. Tamalpais are well graded, but kind of rocky - I've definitely dented a rim flying down Railroad Grade with WTB Nano 40C tires. Good for climbing with skinny tires, though, and then you can descend on pavement.

-Adem Rudin

Mountain View, CA

On Sunday, May 20, 2018 at 9:42:05 PM UTC-7, ViveLemond wrote:

Well...the Bolinas Ridge trail did not go well. It's a rough trail, not a "gravel" road. In my opinion, it's for mountain bikes, not all-road bikes with 42mm tires.
Long story short, I don't think there's a lot viable "all-road gravel/dirt" riding in our area.
Rant below if you wish to continue reading.

Sure, if you're young and strong and don't mind getting beat up, you can do it, but there's a reason why mountain bikes were invented here.
I've lived in this area for 30 years, and am an avid hiker and road cyclist, having only dabbled in mountain biking for various reasons. I know what our trails and fire roads are like - they are rough, rocky, and rutted. So...apparently somewhere else there exists relatively flat gravel/dirt roads, but I don't think they are here in the Bay Area. And even if you find one, it's not going to be linked up to a long network of similar type surfaces, it will probably head into a rough trail at some point.

I'm not down on my bike - Rawland Nordavinden with 650b compass baby shoe pass els - in fact I love it. On the road down to Bolinas which was bumpy and chopped up it was fabulous and it's versatility shined. But as Clint said, a man's gotta know his limitations, and these bikes have their limits. There are obviously certain paths and such where they will work fine, but I don't think you can look at the map and assume you can link up Mt. Diablo fire roads and such. Again, mountain bikes have progressed from no suspension, to just front shocks, to full suspension for a reason!  But I'll keep researching true fire/gravel roads in the Sierras and other places, as the idea of a long ride on a relatively smooth gravelish road sounds just wonderful, I hope to find one some day.

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[Joe Bunik]

hi Hunter, all

I'd definitely interested in joining a small working group dedicated
to the search of such, and in fact have often joked about forming a
Northern California corollary to the SCAR (SoCal All Rounder) gang.
We'd be NOCAR, of course!

For most of my life I've poured over maps and researched the areas I
live / travel through, and a lot of that has been here in California--
I've seen some interesting nooks and crannies, that's for sure. The
obvious confound in this thread is, here in the urbanized Bay Area you
just aren't going to "discover" any contiguous stretches of
old/grey/dead/forest roads that haven't been mentioned already. And
apologies, but I consider the Tam / MMWD roads to be some of the best
options we have going around here.

So, where does that lead? I'm aware of a good number of candidates
further afield, but they require at the least an hour++ of car travel
to get to. Up north, Lake and Colusa counties have interesting areas
that I've barely scratched (as well as some real banjo festivals).
Down south, Monterey and San Benito counties also have worthy and
known suspects. But, any of those will easily eat an entire day, let
alone the staging problems posed by out-and-back / loop / vs. shuttle
riding. And for certain, the Sierras may be the promised land for what
we're looking for here-- I suggest studying up on the USFS forest maps
for teasers (just make sure you bring enough water).

Maybe the best idea is to go for overnighters this summer out in the field.

=- Joe Bunik
Walnut Creek, CA

On 5/21/18, Hunter Ellis <hunterf...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Those rides sound amazing! It would be cool if we each organized a “I’m
> gonna do this dirt ride this weekend” series, so if we were motivated and
> interested we could tag along and learn some new routes around the Bay
> Area. Anyone interested, or is that too ambitious?

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[Hunter Ellis]

My idea was like a "here's a ride i like to do near where I live, anyone who's interested show up at X at Y time and I'll show you"

Still, I think Joe is right that there are places to be explored further afield. The entire Mendocino National Forest stretches from Clear Lake to the Trinities, and is riddled with dirt roads...but from some unfortunate experience, most of these are impassable with extreme gradients, so care must be taken when looking at maps and planning routes. I've also had my water  

I'm pretty ignorant of Marin, East, and South Bay dirt roads and would be willing to drive an hour or so to get to a nice starting point (life permitting, etc). But I know I'm a lot less likely to drive to mt diablo, say, and try to figure out a route, than I would be to follow someone who knew we were about to go on a great ride!

Anyway, thanks for the group suggestion Reed, and I still have to discover all the Tam road bike dirt roads...

I'll take anyone who wants to go on some semi-secret dirt in Sonoma County, just let me know when :-)

I like this dirt discovery society that we're workin on....

Hunter Ellis

Cell: 707-583-6583

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[Justin, Oakland]

Bay Area Dirt Discovery Rides

BADD RIDES

It’s like a step below a #MannyRide where you need hiking shoes.

-J

[Joe Bunik]

Ha ha yes,

Manny is def. the reigning king of "Dirt Critical Mass" around here
but what I had in mind probably aligns more with the style of the Jan
/ Compass / Unmeetings riding up in the PNW.

The sort of adventures requiring a bit of pre-planing and research in
combination with actual on-the-ground way-finding / reconnoitering /
and reporting. Yet something less organized and temporal than any of
the SFRandonneur events or brevets!

We should also draw a line (in the dirt, so to speak!) here between
what the original poster was asking and what quickly turns into MTB /
trail riding, at least as we have it here in Northern California. The
categories I'm thinking about include:

type 1) old roads: historic / bypassed / rural
type 2) public lands: USFS / BLM roadways
type 3) closures / roads less traveled: public easements / abandoned
rights-of-way / ranch roads(???)
type 4) roads in name only: fire roads / utility corridors

Type 1 are probably the fewest / shortest of the lot. The best type 2
are furthest out from the Bay Area. Type 3, there are maybe a few rare
gems locally around here. And, Bolinas Ridge is clearly a "type 4",
something they might be able to run a utility pole truck or bulldozer
up but will never see when out on. Fire roads are often the most
decayed and steepest of the bunch, they were never intended for travel
-- although we sure ride them a lot!

I'll work on drafting a list of type 3.
=- Joe

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[Hunter Ellis]

Thanks Joe! I'm excited for the list. Maybe we can make a google doc and add to it as seen fit? 

There's another category, mayube: Private roads that maybe someone has an "in" on. Telephone road that runs from the Nicasio reservoir up to Chileno Valley/Marhsall wall is a good example. I want ot ride it but I'm scared of trespassing. Maybe that's still Cat 3

Hunter Ellis

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[Metin Uz]

Don't be discouraged -- those trails feel impossible with a cross bike at first, but become manageable with repeated exposure. I have seen people on road bikes with 28mm slick tires ride it. San Francisco Randonneurs use Bolinas Ridge on two different 200k mixed terrain rides, one in each direction (it is not even one of the rougher sections). You can see the routes in http://sfrandonneurs.org/route-archive.htm. There are several mixed terrain routes listed; "La Ruta Loca" and "Marin Mountains" use Bolinas Ridge.

On Sunday, May 20, 2018 at 9:42:05 PM UTC-7, ViveLemond wrote:

[William Lindsay]

Joe

You didn't hear this from me, but there may be some 650B list user named Bill Lindsay who will find himself in possession of a house in Arnold, CA.  Rumor has it that his first project will be mapping out a ride catalog of Types 1, 3 and 4.  Then, the house in Arnold, which can't be Air BnB listed and can't be VRBO listed, will instead be made available to 'friends and family' on hopefully reasonable terms to have cycling mini-vacations of that type.  Rumor has it that the comparatively unused rural roads and the roads in name only could yield a legitimate "Calaveras Pass Hunters" movement, at least in the fantasy mind of this Bill Lindsay guy

Arnold to Murphys 14.2miles one way

Arnold to Angels Camp 21.3 miles one way

Arnold to Sonora 32.3 miles one way

Arnold to South Lake Tahoe 77 miles 8100ft climbing one way

Arnold to Yosemite 106 miles 12,075ft climbing one way

East Bay to Arnold 148 miles 10,200ft climbing one way

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

[Joe Bunik]

Bill,

5N20 to 5N02

Checkmate,
Joe

>> On 5/22/18, Justin, Oakland <justin...@gmail.com <javascript:>> wrote:
>> > Bay Area Dirt Discovery Rides
>> >
>> > BADD RIDES
>> >
>> > It’s like a step below a #MannyRide where you need hiking shoes.
>> >
>> > -J
>> >
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[Joe Bunik]

p.s.
beware of any "roads" on Google Maps named "Dozer Line"

[William Lindsay]

Very fun stuff.  Arnold to Grohl is on my list now. 

>> email to 650b+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.

[Joe Bunik]

Not really the Bay Area; it's a 3.5 hr drive to the start-point from
my door :-( -- but, on my to-do list whenever the opportunity arises:

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/18080822
https://blog.sfgate.com/bicycle/2018/02/13/yosemite-by-bike-on-a-secret-car-free-road/

[Justin, Oakland]

Bill really taking N+1 to the Nth degree!
-Justin

[Joe Bunik]

Very prophetic! As I had just replied earlier to Hunter (off-list)
regarding Telephone Rd. … somehow I must have channeled Bill!

NOW WE KNOW BUBBA.

> On Tue, May 22, 2018 at 12:02 PM, Joe Bunik <jbu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Telephone Rd. indeed! I've dug into that one before, seems like
>> someone's ranch. Unless you know Bubba personally, I'm not too sure you
>> want to get to know Bubba… personally!
>
> On 5/22/18, Hunter Ellis <hunterf...@gmail.com> wrote:
> haha exactly! We gotta find more roads like that...where we know Bubba :-)

>

On 5/22/18, Justin, Oakland <justin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Bill really taking N+1 to the Nth degree!
> -Justin
>

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[Bill M.]

I've ridden some fire roads around Arnold, roads 7N08 & 5N52 made a nice shorter loop.  Plenty more to explore up there.  I'd also like to ride Italian Bar along the Stanislaus from Columbia to Twain Harte, what I have seen of it was beautiful.  

Bill

[Joe Bunik]

I thought I was done, but this thread really got me digging up various
legendary roads and routes and other loose ends-- which lead me to
this, a pretty quality collection of tour ideas:

http://northwestcalloop.blogspot.com/

When is summer vacation again?

[Adem Rudin]

Short notice, but if folks are interested in a #BADD ride, I'm gonna be doing that Butano/Gazos Creek ride tomorrow.

Starting in Pescadero from Norm's Market at 10am on Saturday. Look for the dude on the bright pink Black Mountain Cycles monstercross bike, super weirdo dirt drop bars wrapped in blue tape, and an orange handlebar bag. 

Route plan: https://www.strava.com/routes/12714334. Should be roughly 3.5 hours in the saddle, plus lunch and misc stops.

I've seen this ride done on 28mm tires before, but you'll probably be happier on 35mm+. Most of this ride is relatively smooth fire roads, but the upper half of Butano (past the airstrip) gets lumpier with a lot of short/punchy climbs, and the 2.5 miles along Middle Ridge will benefit from some MTB bike handling skills.

Let me know if you plan on attending so we know to look for you.

-Adem

[William Lindsay]

I did a little reconnaissance on Ship Rock Road yesterday.  It was glorious until the road reached a locked gate that not only said "keep out" and "no trespassing" but also had a bumper sticker that read "Gun Control means using both hands".  That was good enough for me to turn back.  The prototype route was going to be a 24 mile loop, but became a 13 mile out and back.  Back to the list....

Bill Lindsay

Sometimes Arnold, CA

On Tuesday, May 22, 2018 at 2:51:45 PM UTC-7, Joe Bunik wrote:

[Adem Rudin]

Update: at a friends request, pushing the start time up to 9am.

[ViveLemond]

Great posts, and I like it.

Thanks for the pic Adem - those are the kind of roads I'm looking for! relatively smooth fire roads,

Joe - like the classifications.

I was on Mt. Tam again yesterday and peeked at the trails/fire roads (we did the Fairfax Bolinas Road up to the summit and back), and talked to some folks heading out on various style bikes.

Those trails are a lot rougher than what's pictured here - so they'd be Class 4 right?

A few thoughts:

- First, does anyone disagree with that?

- I'd call riding on those trails mountain biking, not all-road biking.

As you can sense, I really have no desire to do unsuspended mountain biking. I'm old, my wrists and back can't take it. But I love country roads with little traffic and smoother gravel roads.

Thanks guys!

On Tuesday, May 22, 2018 at 11:46:06 AM UTC-7, Joe Bunik wrote:

[Josh Schaefer]

Aden, what happened to the route on Strava? Says it’s removed. Do you have a link?

Thanks

On Friday, May 25, 2018 at 1:10:35 PM UTC-7, Adem Rudin wrote:

[ViveLemond]

It has been a while since I have participated in my original thread.

I just wanted to add that I have indeed found some fantastic gravel roads completely suitable for my bike in the Marin headlands around Tennessee Valley.
There are some great Road/gravel loops that are truly world-class in that area.

Thank you everyone for all your tips and advice.

[Adem Rudin]

Sorry Josh - I must have pruned that route at some point... try this link: https://www.strava.com/routes/14276049