Re: JP Weigle 2017 Concours de Machines Bike

[Samuel McCune]

Hello all,

I posted this link in another thread due to thread drift. Why don't we keep the conversation regarding this in it's own thread, rather than confusing things with Igor's thread about his new (and very nice) bike.

Here's the link to the previous document, posted to help answer Greg's request for info on what the Concourse build might cost.

JP Weigle 2017 Concours de Machines Bike

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1G_2_8R9zbWsg6h6LmAHexIlkmwKIDaeIMMw5_ysJ7xc/edit?usp=sharing

Scott,

To answer your question: feel free to modify the spreadsheet. I was actually just marking which parts were modified. Anything you can do to make it more accurate would be great. Your proposed methodology sounds perfect.

Sam

New Haven, CT

On Fri, Mar 9, 2018 at 2:57 PM, Scott Arenz <scott...@gmail.com> wrote:

Sam, great job with the spreadsheet. As someone more familiar with the lower range of the classic components market, it's fascinating to see a list of what goes into the best of the best. 

However (and I know you just took a quick stab at it), I'm guessing the estimates for Peter's labor to modify the components are low. For example, my guess would be that for the Concours crankset there were several hours if not more than a day of layout, drilling, chamfering, re-profiling, and polishing.

It might be useful to create another column titled "Estimated Labor Hours", which would then be multiplied by an hourly rate for a final dollar amount of labor cost per component. I'm happy to add it if you don't mind the change.

Scott

Atlanta, GA

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[Scott Arenz]

Good idea to break this out of the other thread! We've got the spread sheet pretty well fleshed out now, with wild guesses for labor for known parts customizations, and reference links for parts costs. (I still wonder if my estimates are low, as I haven't much experience with this level of metal work.) If anyone has better estimates, feel free to input them, which then will update the estimated final bike price.  

Scott 

in Atlanta, thinking about drillium...

On Friday, March 9, 2018 at 3:19:36 PM UTC-5, Samuel McCune wrote:

Hello all,

I posted this link in another thread due to thread drift. Why don't we keep the conversation regarding this in it's own thread, rather than confusing things with Igor's thread about his new (and very nice) bike.

Here's the link to the previous document, posted to help answer Greg's request for info on what the Concourse build might cost.

JP Weigle 2017 Concours de Machines Bike

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1G_2_8R9zbWsg6h6LmAHexIlkmwKIDaeIMMw5_ysJ7xc/edit?usp=sharing

Scott,

To answer your question: feel free to modify the spreadsheet. I was actually just marking which parts were modified. Anything you can do to make it more accurate would be great. Your proposed methodology sounds perfect.

Sam

New Haven, CT

On Fri, Mar 9, 2018 at 2:57 PM, Scott Arenz <scott...@gmail.com> wrote:

Sam, great job with the spreadsheet. As someone more familiar with the lower range of the classic components market, it's fascinating to see a list of what goes into the best of the best. 

However (and I know you just took a quick stab at it), I'm guessing the estimates for Peter's labor to modify the components are low. For example, my guess would be that for the Concours crankset there were several hours if not more than a day of layout, drilling, chamfering, re-profiling, and polishing.

It might be useful to create another column titled "Estimated Labor Hours", which would then be multiplied by an hourly rate for a final dollar amount of labor cost per component. I'm happy to add it if you don't mind the change.

Scott

Atlanta, GA

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[Greg Achtem]

Quite the eye opener. Thank you for putting this up. I wonder if some of the players will take note and chime in. 

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[Samuel McCune]

Has anyone been able to identify the headset on the Concours bike? I looked at the BQ issue that listed all of the parts on the bike and it did not include the headset. Most of the parts that were fabricated by Peter were listed as such. I think the front brake cable hanger is the notable exception. This leaves me wondering why it wasn't included?

-Was it an existing headset that has been very highly modified and couldn't be attributed to one "maker"?

-Is it a Compass prototype Rinko headset that hasn't been announced yet?

-Was it simply overlooked?

Is anyone able to shed light on this? I just sent a note to BQ to inquire, but I thought I'd post here too.

Thanks,

Samuel McCune

New Haven, CT

On Friday, March 9, 2018 at 5:27:41 PM UTC-5, Greg Achtem wrote:

Quite the eye opener. Thank you for putting this up. I wonder if some of the players will take note and chime in. 

On Friday, March 9, 2018, Samuel McCune <samuel...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello all,

I posted this link in another thread due to thread drift. Why don't we keep the conversation regarding this in it's own thread, rather than confusing things with Igor's thread about his new (and very nice) bike.

Here's the link to the previous document, posted to help answer Greg's request for info on what the Concourse build might cost.

JP Weigle 2017 Concours de Machines Bike

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1G_2_8R9zbWsg6h6LmAHexIlkmwKIDaeIMMw5_ysJ7xc/edit?usp=sharing

Scott,

To answer your question: feel free to modify the spreadsheet. I was actually just marking which parts were modified. Anything you can do to make it more accurate would be great. Your proposed methodology sounds perfect.

Sam

New Haven, CT

On Fri, Mar 9, 2018 at 2:57 PM, Scott Arenz <scott...@gmail.com> wrote:

Sam, great job with the spreadsheet. As someone more familiar with the lower range of the classic components market, it's fascinating to see a list of what goes into the best of the best. 

However (and I know you just took a quick stab at it), I'm guessing the estimates for Peter's labor to modify the components are low. For example, my guess would be that for the Concours crankset there were several hours if not more than a day of layout, drilling, chamfering, re-profiling, and polishing.

It might be useful to create another column titled "Estimated Labor Hours", which would then be multiplied by an hourly rate for a final dollar amount of labor cost per component. I'm happy to add it if you don't mind the change.

Scott

Atlanta, GA

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[Brad]

A couple of possiblities.
The René Herse demontable bikes and some others from the late 40's had a braised extension above a standard threaded steerer tube to allow for quick removal of the fork while maintaining threaded headset capability.
Another possibility is that it is an assemblace of parts- a bottom headset cup facing up with a another style pushing down.  Perhaps an old stronglight model modified.

[Jinuk Shin]

Does anyone have a pair of those skewers?  Seem light but I'm a bit worried about safety.

[Igor Belopolsky]

I do not but I'm going to get them. Ahh, little weight savings..

[Samuel McCune]

Brad,

The Weigle Concours bike definitely has a tube brazed into the steer-tube. It's a 1930's style ahead stem. The headset is threaded.

I'm no encyclopedia of bicycle components but most of the headsets that look similar to the Concours bike that I've seen are French steel headsets. This one looks aluminum and possibly sealed bearing. I'm befuddled and intrigued.

Still looking.

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[Steve Palincsar]

And while you're at it, you might want to look into some major weight savings: there's this "Eat Bacon, Don't Jog" thread going on RBW that all the posters are swearing by...  ;-)

-- 
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia 
USA

[Mark Guglielmana]

Don't knock bacon! 

;-)

[Greg Achtem]

IMHO it’s a mashup. I’m guessing a couple of different Stronglights. The lower is for sure riding on needle bearings. Crown race (drilled!) floating bearing race (it has to be due to the drilled crown race) and then a French style knurled upper. 

There are a few photos from both sides on Peter’s Flicker and no evidence of added bits to aid tightening with an Allen wrench as he has done in the past.  Maybe the Japan trip?

Jan? Peter? Spill the goods. 

[Sukho Goff]

In the past 18 months I knocked a solid 9071 grams off of my bike "set up" by eating more bacon (as a garnishment on top of huge salads) and eating less sugar (and things that turn into sugar in my body).

Sukho in PDX

[Reed Kennedy]

Nice work Sukho! I suspect I started with more to spare, but I've managed to shave off 22503 grams in the last 22 months myself.

Or, as I like to joke: These days I weigh less carrying my bike loaded with camping than I used to weigh in my birthday suit.

Not saying it'll work for everybody, but it sure did work for me. Thanks Grant!

When folks worry over the weight of my 650b x 48mm tires, I just smile...

Best,

Reed

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[Rick Shelton, Woodstock GA]

The Weigle Concours bike checks all the boxes and is a work of art, something to behold.

Since I’ll never own a bike such as this, I would love to know the color (RAF code?). Anyone have knowledge or a best guesss?

Rick Shelton
Woodstock, GA

[Matthew J]

Peter typically mixes his own colors.  Doubt very much the color is off the shelf avaialble.

[mitch....@gmail.com]

On Thursday, March 15, 2018 at 7:23:08 AM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:

Peter typically mixes his own colors.  Doubt very much the color is off the shelf available...

 As much as I appreciate Peter's amazing work already, is it possible I'm still underestimating him?

--Mitch

[Matthew J]

>  As much as I appreciate Peter's amazing work already, is it possible I'm still underestimating him?

Well I sure did - once.  Chosing the paint for my Coast a while back, the well regarded painter Johnny typically uses actually had access to a Weigle in a light green color I hoped to duplicate.  Painter ultimately cried uncle after several mix tries and we went with a nice platinum instead.  

Peter is on his own plateau.