Salsa Journeyman allroad bike

[satanas]

https://salsacycles.com/bikes/journeyman/journeyman_sora_650

The most interesting part may be the fork; usually Salsa forks are available separately, sooner or later. There are other builds; 700c or flat bars can be had too.

Later,
Stephen

[jack loudon]

It's amazing that you can get a bike like this for US$900 to $1100.  Nice frameset and decent components.  I have a moderately fancy 'allroad' bike but the Journeyman is probably 98% as capable for a fraction of the cost.  

Jack

[Igor Belopolsky]

I wish it was steel but if this bike existed when I bought my Diverge...I would not have bought my Diverge

[jack loudon]

I've never owned an aluminum road bike (only a couple of mountain bikes w/suspension) but have heard that recent alu frames are not as harsh.   

[Scott Henry]

Aluminum is almost as tune-able as carbon.    You can purchase whatever you prefer.  

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[Nick Favicchio]

The price on these is wild. That's a lot of bike for the price.

Masi Randonneur?
The new Rawland?

Market is definitely growing for broke folks :). Good stuff.

[John P]

Saw this in a store:

https://www.rei.com/product/122463/co-op-cycles-adv-31-bike

-John

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[Harald Kliems]

Also nice to see that they're putting the 46/30 FSA cranks on there. Maybe there is hope that not everyone is moving to 1x or staying with regular compact cranks.
 Harald.

[Kevin M]

Nice price, but I am pretty skeptical that an entry level aluminum bike is going to be anything other than heavy and harsh-riding. Salsa doesn’t really have a reputation for compliant rigid framesets.

[Adem Rudin]

Since this is still a 9-speed group, 1x is not really an option unless you want to really restrict gearing.

On that topic, I'm really amused that the "gravel/adventure" bike trend has basically re-invented the 90's NORBA-geo hardtail mountain bike, complete with 9-speed group - just with drop bars this time. The tires on the 650b models are wider than what I had on my full-squish XC bike ~15 years ago. The only thing missing from this build is a 46/34/24 triple.

-Adem Rudin

Mountain View, CA

(PS poking through shimano's product catalog, the new Sora FC-R3030-CG crankset is a 5-arm 110/74 triple? Yessss)

[Greg Walton]

"the "gravel/adventure" bike trend has basically re-invented the 90's NORBA-geo hardtail mountain bike, complete with 9-speed group - just with drop bars this time"

Kinda but not really.  Similar on the 71/73 angles and big tire volume, but there are major differences.  Compared to NORBA, the bottom bracket drop is massive (70mm+ on many) vs 30mm, and chainstays are typically 44mm vs the short NORBA 425mm.  The stack/reach on the "all road" bikes are evolving to high/short, vs NORBA's low/long.  

The 9 speed models on the market today are largely a concession to hitting a price point - Shimano's lowest priced groups are 8/9 speed.

Greg

Seattle

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[Adem Rudin]

Bottom Bracket: Remember, BB drop is a ->frame<- spec, not a ->bike<- spec. If you really want to compare geometry between bikes with different rim diameters and tire widths, we should be comparing BB *height*. The Journeyman has tires that are a good 20mm (or more) larger in radius than what you'd find on an older 26" wheeled MTB, so we're talking about less than 20mm of difference in BB height - not 40mm or more.

Reach/Stack: Again, those are ->frame<- specs. Your contact points on a drop bar end up further out and lower relative to the top of the head tube, when compared to where they'd end up with a flat bar, so you need to design the frame with more reach/stack to end up with the same body position on the bike.

-Adem

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[jack loudon]

Kevin said: "I am pretty skeptical that an entry level aluminum bike is going to be anything other than heavy and harsh-riding"

Jack replies: I'm pretty sure the alu bike will be lighter with the same components, and the big tires should go a long way toward cancelling out any frame harshness.  I'm wondering if aluminum frames still deserve the bad reputation they have, especially when used with fatter tires.  I've never owned an alu road frame, so this is just honest curiosity.

[Alex Wetmore]

Salsa doesn't publish frame weights, but it is unlikely that a budget aluminum frame is going to be light.  Since aluminum is generically about 3x weaker than steel and about 3x lighter it really doesn't build much lighter frames until you get into exotic alloys (or at the budget end where cheap steel frames are made with thick and heavy tubing).

Stiffness affect ride quality in more ways than just basic comfort.

alex

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From: 65...@googlegroups.com <65...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of jack loudon <jwlo...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2018 9:50:51 AM
To: 650b
Subject: [650B] Re: Salsa Journeyman allroad bike

 

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[Eric Keller]

I was impressed they managed to get a bike with an aluminum frame and carbon fork up to 26 pounds (medium size).  I guess a lot of it is the low-end components.  

On Tue, Mar 20, 2018 at 1:13 PM, Alex Wetmore <al...@phred.org> wrote:

Salsa doesn't publish frame weights, but it is unlikely that a budget aluminum frame is going to be light.  Since aluminum is generically about 3x weaker than steel and about 3x lighter it really doesn't build much lighter frames until you get into exotic alloys (or at the budget end where cheap steel frames are made with thick and heavy tubing).

Stiffness affect ride quality in more ways than just basic comfort.

alex

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From: 65...@googlegroups.com <65...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of jack loudon <jwlo...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2018 9:50:51 AM
To: 650b
Subject: [650B] Re: Salsa Journeyman allroad bike

 

Kevin said: "I am pretty skeptical that an entry level aluminum bike is going to be anything other than heavy and harsh-riding"

Jack replies: I'm pretty sure the alu bike will be lighter with the same components, and the big tires should go a long way toward cancelling out any frame harshness.  I'm wondering if aluminum frames still deserve the bad reputation they have, especially when used with fatter tires.  I've never owned an alu road frame, so this is just honest curiosity.

On Monday, March 19, 2018 at 2:01:08 PM UTC-7, Kevin M wrote:

Nice price, but I am pretty skeptical that an entry level aluminum bike is going to be anything other than heavy and harsh-riding. Salsa doesn’t really have a reputation for compliant rigid framesets.

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[jack loudon]

Alex said: "Salsa doesn't publish frame weights, but it is unlikely that a budget aluminum frame is going to be light."

The Salsa site does list complete bike weights, so maybe the frame weights can be inferred.  The Journeyman and Vaya are pretty comparable bikes except one is steel and the other aluminum.  A 55.5 cm (700C) Journeyman with alu frame/fork and Claris components weighs 25-11.  A 54 cm Vaya with steel frame/fork and Tiagra components weighs 27-0.  The steel Vaya is a smaller frame size with higher-end components yet weighs 1-1/4 lb more than the alu Journeyman.  The Vaya has a 10 sp cassette (vs 8) and slightly larger tires so that could account for some of the difference.  I don't much care for aluminum frames and would love to be proven wrong, but do not believe a low-end steel frame will be lighter low-end aluminum.  Just my opinion :)

Jack

[Dave Johnston]

It's pretty cool that they offer a flat bar version in case you want to install Albatross, Jones or any of the cool bars that need flat-bar brakes and shifters. You might want to size up for the longer top tube if you go that route.

-Dave J

[Eric Daume]

The flat bar version has different geo, with a longer top tube.

Eric

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