THE TOYIN FALOLA INTERVIEWS: A CONVERSATION WITH JONATHAN HAYNES, PART 2
Toyin Falola
A Conversation with Professor Jonathan Haynes
(Part 2)
Biography
Jonathan Haynes is interested in how literature, film, and other arts are related to the cultures and societies that produce them. At first, English Renaissance Literature was the main focus of his studies, till his attention shifted to film, literature and African studies. Since the early 1990s, he has closely followed the growth of the Nigerian film industry. He came to Long Island University’s Southampton College in 1998 and to the Brooklyn Campus in 2004. In 2001-2002, he was the founding director of the West African Center of the Friends World Program (now LIU Global) in Kumasi, Ghana. He has also taught at the American University in Cairo (Egypt), Tufts University, Albion College, Bennington College, and Columbia University. Four times he has been a Fulbright Lecturer in Nigeria (at the University of Nigeria-Nsukka, Ahmadu Bello University, the University of Ibadan, and the University of Lagos); and he was a guest professor at the University of Cologne in Germany. He has been a keynote speaker at conferences at the University of Johannesburg, Humboldt University in Berlin, and at half a dozen Nigerian universities and film festivals.
PART A
The Interview
Toyin Falola
(6) You have argued in one of your books that each genre in movies generally is multifaceted and has its own peculiarity. Give us a review into the film genres and their attachment to social, historical, and cultural realities as well as how future scholars of Nollywood may recognize the genres.
Jonathan Haynes
As I say in the preface to Nollywood: The Creation of Nigerian Film Genres, I understand genre to be a messy business. My general understanding, which descends from Wittgenstein and is I believed the most prevalent one among academics, is based in the notion of “family resemblances”: if works share enough features in common, it makes sense to discuss them as a “kind.” In my chapters on campus films and films set in the Nigerian diaspora, I include tables that show common elements among numerous films: plot elements, themes, character types, settings, and so on. Sometimes a single feature marks a film as belonging to a specific genre, as a king enthroned in a grass-thatched village signals a cultural epic. But I don’t believe one inflexible generic grid can be imposed on the whole film culture.
Genres are all produced historically and change in history. Sometimes they change very slowly: the genre of tragedy was invented in ancient Athens in the 5th century BC, and the basic boy-meets-girl comic plot in the next century. They are still going strong, often in very much the same form. Others, like the Nigerian vigilante film, came and went very quickly around 2000 but made a great impact. Romantic comedies were a form that Emem Isong seemed to have almost to herself for a decade or more, and I write about why Nigerian society seemed to have relatively little interest in that genre; but then the multiplex cinemas opened, with their audience of young people out on dates, and rom coms became one of the most popular forms.
In my book, it’s the relationship of genre to history that interests me most. Here my premise is that the stories we want to hear over and over (with variations) are the ones we feel to be essential or that speak powerfully to the particular moment we are in. Genres change (or don’t) because our problems change (or don’t). My basic argument is that Nigeria created its own system of genres, out of its own resources, for its own reasons, and in response to its own needs. (An important corollary: using foreign (e.g. Hollywood) genre terms to describe Nollywood films is a big mistake.) Half the point of each of my chapters is to describe a Nigerian genre (such as “get rich quick” films, family films, crime films, village films, comedies, and political films); the other half of the point is to make an historical argument about why and how the genre arose when it did. Together, the chapters are meant to provide at least a sketchy history of Nollywood, and to provide glimpses of Nigerian social history during the period the book covers.
Toyin Falola
(7) Nollywood’s business model is now in a monumental crisis. There are several problems that are hindering the growth of the movie industry in Nigeria, can you identify the cogent ones?
Jonathan Haynes
Nollywood’s business model has pretty much always been in crisis…. Nollywood was born out of the crisis that destroyed Nigerian celluloid film production and staged theater and damaged television production, and it was born out of the resilience and imagination that created the world’s first major all-video film industry, based in aging (and so discounted) analog cassette technologies. Nigerians are good at coping with crisis because they’ve known so much of it.
The global media business model is also lurching from crisis to crisis, even as it is increasingly consolidated. The way the pandemic is upending the relationship between theatrical release of films and streaming is only the latest example of a rapid, seismic shift.
Within this context, where admittedly it is not comfortable to try to make a living or make investments, I think Nollywood’s prospects have never been better. The original Nollywood model, based on the sale of discs, keeps chugging along, but now it is supplemented by more dynamic—and much more heavily capitalized—sectors: the multiplex cinemas, satellite broadcasting, terrestrial broadcasting (which is greatly expanding as Nigeria slowly converts from analog to digital), and internet streaming. There is a lot to say about each one of these sectors. Let me venture some general statements about the big picture:
a. Nigerian media dominate the national media space and are firmly established as the regional media hegemon across most of Africa.
b. An alliance between Nigerian creativity and South African capital and technology, in the form of the satellite broadcasting conglomerate Naspers/DStv/MultiChoice/Africa Magic, created that regional hegemony, but Nigerian media are now also courted by the French, the Chinese, the Americans, et al.
c. So there is and will be plenty of work for Nigerian filmmakers, though most of that work is very badly paid, as it always has been. Nigerian filmmakers are not good at negotiating for themselves, and the structures of ownership always need to be worried about.
d. All this foreign capital has not led to the imposition of a single foreign cultural model. Internet and satellite broadcasting depend on aggregating various audiences, so many niche film cultures are liable to have a continued existence. At the same time, only blockbusters bring dramatic levels of profit, which means producers are always looking for ways to make crossover hits.
e. To take one particular bright spot, there is now a raft of Nigerian films on Netflix, several of which were too advanced in their aesthetics or culture to be successful on any of the platforms within Nigeria. Netflix showcases a number of Nigeria’s brightest talents on the international stage. This is good—probably better, in fact, than anything that has ever existed in Nigeria before. (I’m not ignoring the problems of the present, as I say this—I’m remembering how bad the past was.)
Photo: African Studies Association 2017 Annual Meeting, Chicago: Author Meets Critics Roundtable on Nollywood: The Creation of Nigerian Film Genres, with Onookome Okome, Moradewun Adejunmobi, Brian Larkin, and Ken Harrow
Toyin Falola
- Nollywood represents the nation’s multiethnic and linguistic complexities. How does the industry contribute to critical multiculturalism?
Jonathan Haynes
The dynamics in play are vast and complex, and Nollywood’s role isn’t determining or simple. But it certainly is influential. As a form of national mass culture, it doubtless has contributed to the decline of Nigeria’s myriad “traditional” cultures, which is a quiet, slow-moving cultural catastrophe of gigantic proportions. But the division, from the beginning, of Nigeria’s video film industry into Yoruba, Hausa, and English-language branches shows the continuing relevance of Nigerian languages. When Africa Magic added an Igbo channel to its satellite bouquet, it was a tremendous stimulus to the production of Igbo-language films and other kinds of content, which shows that the effect even of transnational media structures isn’t simple. In Benin City, a small but steady stream of films is being produced in Bini/Edo, and there is some level of production in a number of other languages. Maybe Nollywood’s greatest gift to Nigeria and to Africa is the sense that self-representation through filmmaking is within everyone’s reach, and this has an ethnic/linguistic dimension.
I’ve always seen Nollywood as primarily a national form, the direct inheritor of the Nigerian Television Authority’s project of creating an image of the nation through serials with multicultural casts speaking a multilinguistic stew that was pungently Nigerian. The rise of the multiplex cinemas to the commanding heights of Nigerian film culture has intensified the commercial pressure to have multicultural casts: the producers are sure to cast Igbos and Yorubas and other ethnicities in a film so that it will find audiences in as many neighborhoods as possible.
I’ve been watching the rising tide of Nigerian Pidgin (or Naija, as some are now calling it) with great interest. It provides a way of being Nigerian without identifying with a particular ethnicity (or social class), and it indicates a specific location in the broad context of Africa (West Africa, at least) and its diaspora. Musicians and standup comedians and maybe radio personalities have perhaps been pushing this development even more than Nollywood has, but in films the normal mode now is regular codeswitching, with the heteroglossic Pidgin at the center of things. The old debates about what the language of African cinema or African literature should be now seem out of date.
Toyin Falola
- What other African national or regional cinemas have emerged in addition to Nollywood? What are the important distinctions and commonalities among them?
Jonathan Haynes
A whole lot is going on! Far too much for me to stay on top of. Nollywood’s history has always been intertwined with that of its Ghanaian twin, the first born. I’m often disappointed by South African films, but there is a powerful and sophisticated media apparatus there. Kenya has “Riverwood,” Tanzania has “Bongowood,” Uganda has its thing… these last examples were inspired by Nollywood and in many cases Nigerian actors and other filmmakers came to help jump start the local scene.
But Nollywood is not the only model for an African video film industry. Alessandro Jedlowski argues against technological determinism through an elegant comparison of the video film industries in Nigeria, Cote d’Ivoire, and Ethiopia. In Cote d’Ivoire, the television infrastructure was strong and the feature filmmaking infrastructure was weak, so serials never lost their primacy even outside the broadcast environment. In Ethiopia, there was a strong tradition of cinema-going, so the primary mode has remained films made on video and projected in theaters rather than a market in discs. In African film scholarship, Ethiopia has suddenly emerged from obscurity: its films and film culture were and are in Amharic or other Ethiopian languages and not in English or French, which contributed to its isolation. Ethiopia’s recent economic boom has greatly increased its film production, and its opening to the world, economically and politically, has encouraged the recent burst in interesting academic work about it (see Cine-Ethiopia from Michigan State UP). Let’s hope the recent political problems aren’t too much of a setback to this promising industry.
Toyin Falola
- A great deal of research has been written on women actors and technical workers in the Nollywood film industry. What do you think about how these women are perceived and treated as opposed to other women in film industries?
Jonathan Haynes
Nollywood films reflect the society they come from, and Nigerian society is undoubtedly extremely patriarchal and sexist. But, arguably, Nollywood is a better place for women to work in than Hollywood is. The range of female characters is much broader in Nollywood—actresses do not have to conform to a certain body type, and there are lots of parts for older women, as there are not in the US. In the old days, when I asked directors and producers who their target audience was, they would tell me it was market women. They were the customers who had the price of a film tied up in their wrappers at the end of the week, when, often, their husbands were out of work or their salaries had been rendered nearly worthless by inflation. The whole family might watch the film—often the husband pretended to be reading the newspaper—but the woman chose it. The situation in northern Nigeria was the most dramatic: respectable women did not go to cinemas and so were mostly excluded from film culture, but the “home videos” were tailored for their situations. The more they were secluded, the more addicted to films they became. People referred to the new medium of video films as “women’s films.”
Behind the camera, men have always outnumbered women, but some of the most powerful and influential writers, directors, and (particularly) producers have been women. At the beginning there was Amaka Igwe, who was always quick to point out how important the example of the television pioneer Lola Fani-Kayode was to her. Then the line runs through people like Emem Isong and Peace Anyiam Osigwe to Mo Abudu and Mary Remmy Njoku (the last two being the most powerful producers in Nigeria), and the women who created and run the most important film festivals, and filmmakers like Kemi Adetiba, Tope Oshin, and many others.
I repeat: American women in Hollywood don’t wield power on this level. Nigerian women have created for themselves the capacity for self-expression through the film industry. I don’t mean to minimize the reproduction of sexist attitudes in Nollywood films or the prevalence of sexual depredation in the industry, but I think on balance Nollywood is more part of the solution than part of the problem.
Toyin Falola
- Your book shows the inner workings of the history of Nollywood, and you put forth a convincing argument about why the films produced by the industry should be given more attention. Based on your enthusiasm, is it correct to say that there is a sort of Nigerianism in you?
Jonathan Haynes
Well… yes. I’d been in a lot of other places before I first arrived in Nigeria, but something special clicked right away, an avid curiosity and general fascination. It’s an elective affinity, maybe a case of opposites attracting. After nearly thirty years of being in Nigeria or thinking about it pretty steadily even when I’m on my own continent, certain Nigerian things have seeped into my experience of the world.
And it matters that I was educated as an Africanist in Nigeria. I was already established as an academic when I first arrived, but I had no training or background in African studies. That happened during my years as a Fulbrighter on the campuses of University of Nigeria-Nsukka, Ahmadu Bello University, the University of Ibadan, and the University of Lagos. and all the other places I passed through. By 1991 Nigeria’s universities had already been devastated by SAP, but enough was left that I absorbed something of the dream that had built them, and I had the privilege of learning directly from a lot of immensely impressive people: Obiora and Ada Udechukwu, Chika Okeke-Agulu, and Sylvester Ogbechie at UNN, Raufu Mustafa, Kate Meagher, Jibo Ibrahim, Charmaine Pereira, and Tanimu Abubakar at ABU, Harry Garuba, Dapo Adelugba, Niyi Osundare, Femi Osofisan, and Hyginus Ekwuazi at UI, Duro Oni and Hope Eghagha at UNILAG and Odia Ofeimun who would pop up anywhere along the Lagos-Ibadan axis…. I’m just scratching the surface here, and I’m leaving out many of my closest friends. My point is that a very consequential part of my education happened in Nigeria, at the hands of Nigerians, and as a result I was formed at least partly as a Nigerian intellectual. I’ve published three books in Ibadan because Ibadan is where you’re supposed to want to be published, abi no bi so? During the long gap between my third and fourth Fulbright’s, invitations to Nigerian conferences and film festivals kept alive my connections with Nigerian academics and also kept my research alive, as I would extend my trips to meet with filmmakers. Those invitations were the material precondition for my big Nollywood book.
Photo: With actor Hafiz “Saka” Oyetoro, Lagos, 2018
Toyin Falola
Thank you very much
Photo: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, 2012: with film directors Kunle Afolayan, Mahmoud Ali-Balogun, Zeb Ejiro, Bond Emeruwa, and festival organizer Maria Pereira
PART B
INTERVIEW ANALYSIS AND REFLECTIONS BY TOYIN FALOLA
Nigeria's Group Identity and Self-Definition in Nollywood
In this second part of the analysis, the focus is more on Nollywood itself and its major contribution to Nigeria's nation state-building in groups, self-identity, and other capacities. In this part, Haynes discusses the complexities attached to genres and the politics they play in categorizing Nollywood. He also discusses the problems Nollywood faces and its outlook on the economic business model in the country; the appraisal of women in Nollywood and the apparent reflection of the society; the contributions of Nollywood to cater to various linguistic and ethnic dimensions of the country; and lastly, the help of Nollywood to other African film industries.
Over the years, major movie producers in Nigeria have proven their ability to create, re-create, reflect, refract, and re-present. The movie industry has also shown its importance to society because it concerns itself with politics and other realities as it explores the socio-political, historical, and cultural experiences of the Nigerian people. Movie producers cannot be detached from these realities; they draw inspiration from these experiences which invariably leads to the identification and definition of the Nigerian state. However, it is important to note that different regions and nations have their peculiarities concerning film genres and how multifaceted they are. In Haynes’ response to the categorization of genres in movies, he notes that Nollywood is peculiar. The worldwide template for genres in films may not necessarily work for Nollywood as it comprises distinctive subcategories of cultures or peoples with their identifiable worldviews and belief systems. Moreso, socio-political phases and different movements, especially the history and cultural imprints, have influenced the variations of movies in Nigeria, leading to its categorization as different from Hollywood. Hence Nollywood genres are of varied sources and orientations. This implies that beyond the general view of Nollywood films, regional, national, and ethnic-specific characteristics are worth examining in their own right. However, new scholars should be observant and focus on defining movements and history and the Nigerian state's cultural peculiarities to understand and carefully place different Nollywood genres. It is not news that Nigeria is plagued with the lingering effects of imperialism, which is a history held in common across the region. History, ethnicity, and culture have undeniably made Nollywood a productive sector. One can also say that one of the indelible consequences of this is the major significant socio-historical moments in the country. Therefore, Nollywood has developed radically in quantity, and it has become a force to be reckoned with. The thematic preoccupations of Nollywood movies differ from Hollywood as it moves from genre to history.
Haynes further discusses the long-standing problems of Nollywood. The major sufferers are the producers, Nigeria as a country, and even talented creatives in the country. As noted by many social observers, Nollywood has elevated Nigeria's economy in many ways and has provided numerous employment opportunities to hundreds of people in the world of tourism. Also, Nollywood movies portray the dynamic Nigerian culture, though many can debate whether this leads to stereotyping of Nigerian men and women. Arguably, Nollywood has impacted Nigerian culture and other African cultures, which has made many countries in the West want to tap into the industry's wealth. The industry has been a pillar for preserving and transforming Nigerian culture and has made many renowned film producers want to be part of the enterprise. However, the Nigerian state is not helping, as stated by Haynes, and the government is not negotiating properly to make the environment comfortable for all major stakeholders in the industry, including not taking advantage of potential profits from international bodies who would have done the same if they had the opportunity. Another major problem noted by Haynes is the “selling out” and migration of the best actors and movies from the Nigerian scene, as most of the best movies from Nigeria are now more suited for the international stage rather than the Nigerian space. For instance, Netflix is now gaining major ground and creating a stable strand for Nigerian movies on the site. It is important to note that Netflix developed the “Netflix Naija” brand and website, mainly for films from the country. This development has had a largely negative effect on the country's economic sector, swinging good movies away from the Nigerian space. Also, filmmaking in Nigeria is not appropriately regulated and controlled, which is the major reason for the low quality of some Nollywood films. There is a lack of standard quality control mechanism, which has resulted in the loss of confidence by audiences, as most people prefer to watch Hollywood and Bollywood movies. Overall, this could be less worrisome if there are standards to attain before movies are distributed to the general public and would be beneficial to the quality of movies produced in the Nigerian film industry.
On the other hand, Nollywood is top-rated globally and has led to the offshoot of other cinema structures in Africa. Haynes looks at Nigerian movies and how major ones have portrayed Nigerians as patriotic people and are very culturally attuned as well. Consequently, the understanding of language and culture to the indigenes of Nigeria is so paramount and they seek to preserve its heritage, such as the language of pidgin and cultural wears. Also, since Nollywood's existence, other African cultures have started to promote their languages and cultures through film, which has helped develop movie industries in many other African countries. Thus, in Haynes' view, Nollywood is a trailblazer and sets standards for home and abroad.
Another important point to note in Jonathan Haynes's interview regards how women are presented in Nollywood. Haynes’ states that women in Nollywood are praiseworthy and self-expressive against their other counterparts in Hollywood. In his view, Haynes notes that women's presentation and redefinition are generally portrayed as solutions more than problems. However, it is important to note that scholars and movie critics cite major problems with the portrayal of women more generally in Nollywood movies, for instance, the issue of patriarchy. Patriarchy is a deep-rooted societal ideology almost as old as time. By mental, social, and cultural conditioning, women are divided into two extremes. On one hand, there is the quiet variation of womanhood in most Nollywood movies where the woman is not allowed to question or protest any issue that directly or indirectly concerns her. Also, the contributions of these women to matters arising in such movies are majorly insignificant. On the other hand, women are mostly presented as victims rather than industrious character of the modern world. As noted by Shaka and Uchendu (2012:4), “women, from infancy, are victims of patriarchal socialization which conditions them mentally and physically as willing slaves of men; as a recreational facility to men; or as an ornament or a piece of artwork to be viewed and admired.” As a result, major films centered on women in Nollywood get their inspiration from different stereotypes about women from cultures in the country. And it has been established that the media draws from cultural stereotypes in its depiction of women.
However, Haynes notes that the portrayal of women in Nollywood is better in terms of visual aesthetics and cultural codes than it was in the past. Even though the Nigerian state is highly patriarchal and sexist, women in Nollywood are flourishing more than their counterparts, especially in Hollywood. The Nigerian women who are major stakeholders, from actresses to women movie producers, are given more opportunities, and they do not encounter issues such as body shaming or the pressure to conform to a certain body type. In other words, most women in the Nigerian movie industry have opportunities and a level playing field to succeed on the same level as men in the same industry, if not more than men more generally. Also, another variation of Haynes's discussion relates to regional film production. According to Haynes, Northern women are mostly secluded to their homes, but they still participate as audience members as they are glued to their TVs and contribute to the sector's viewership.
Most importantly, Nollywood is filled with industrious women from the 1990s, from Amaka Igwe to Kemi Adetiba. These women are major carriers of the Nollywood industry, and they are well known internationally for producing great movies that contributed to bringing more women into the movie sector. As a result, Haynes says, women in Nollywood are treated better than other women in Hollywood and the like.
Finally, Haynes’ commentary on the film industry's contribution to the effective multiculturalism of the multi-ethnic state of Nigeria is important as well. He notes that the film industry has played a major role in promoting the country’s major and minor languages through both major movies and short films by the Nigerian Television Authority (NTA). Based on the most recent population census in Nigeria, there are close to two hundred million people living in Nigeria divided into different ethnic groups with their own regional peculiarities on language, culture, and other major features, which is also applicable to other nations in the world too. Based on these, however, there are cultural similarities in Nigeria with languages that the film industry has tackled and shown to an even wider audience. In Nigeria, language can be considered a major difference between ethnic groups because people use their traditional languages; however, short and long films cast all major ethnicities as characters in the movies as they speak their languages and not in English to communicate with the audience. Concerning this, the movies' themes are centered on communalism and solidarity among ethnicities promoting the One-Nigeria mantra. In addition to this, pidgin-English is even employed in these movies for other communication purposes. As a result, Haynes's notion is that of critical multiculturalism and promoting diversity in Nigeria through film. Thus, despite cultural diversity, Nigerians appreciate the beauty of each other's culture and we witness a sort of melting of cultures from different groups to yield a positive impact on cultural integration. In other words, there is an urgent need for the inhabitants of the country to allow for cross-culturation between various cultures as it would help in uniting diverse groups together and help in the promotion of unity and avoidance of cessation. This has been able to stand due to the major contributions of Nollywood films and the significant contributions of short films by NTA, which is even wider.
In conclusion, Haynes offers his scholarly opinions on Nollywood movies by examining the prevalent disorder of city life in Nigeria and Africa, and how the works in Nollywood embodies the rich history of the Nigerian socio-cultural realities. It is pertinent to state that every individual comes to this world without having stereotyped notions about groups, culture, history and the likes. Notions that are untrue are ingrained in each citizen consciously or unconsciously during their formative years can be damaging in cementing or creating long-lasting relationships among diverse cultures, such as the country of Nigeria and even in most countries in Africa. As a result, Haynes encourages the Nollywood film industry to produce movies that are championing the unity and togetherness of different groups in the country and movie producers should project a positive Nigerian image in their movies to international and home audiences, which in a way, will correct erroneous beliefs about Africans and Nigerians abroad.
Oluwatoyin Vincent Adepoju
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