Looking for help getting iVim set up

[Eric Weir]

I'm struggling trying to get iVim setup on my iPad. I wish there was a way to put problems and questions to a community of experienced users.

Most immediately are the walls I’m running into in trying to import my .vim folder and my .vimrc. The iTunes method won’t work because the file picker in iTunes doesn’t display invisible files and there seems to be no option to force it to do so. The iVim command “:idocuments import” seems to work with files but not folders.

Help appreciated.

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Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net

"(I)t is important that awake people be awake... the darkness around us is deep."

- William Stafford

[Lifepillar]

On 29 May 2019, at 00:53, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:

I'm struggling trying to get iVim setup on my iPad. I wish there was a way to put problems and questions to a community of experienced users.

Most immediately are the walls I’m running into in trying to import my .vim folder and my .vimrc. The iTunes method won’t work because the file picker in iTunes doesn’t display invisible files and there seems to be no option to force it to do so. The iVim command “:idocuments import” seems to work with files but not folders.

I feel your pain, that’s much harder than it should be.

TLDR: prepare your .vim folder in your computer exactly as you want it in iOS, open Finder, press Cmd-Shift-. to show invisible files, drag the .vim folder into iVim using iTunes Files Sharing. iTunes *does* copy dot files even if it never shows them. iTunes will even prompt you if you want to replace an existing .vim folder (iTunes UI sucks, I know).

Long explanation:

Folders may be imported easily, actually:

- with :idocuments, type `:idoc import`, then in the Files app find the folder to want to import (which you should have made available through Files in advance, e.g., by putting in your iCloud Drive), tap on Select, choose the folder and tap on Open. It works just fine for me. Files UI sucks in a stellar way, btw.

- Using iTunes, go to your device > File Sharing > iVim and just drag&drop your files/folders. Dot files/folders are copied even if they stay invisible in iTunes.

You may create and delete *visible* files and folders from the Files app (whose UI is total crap, did I say that?).

This is all well and good for the documents you want to *edit* (e.g., the files of the C project you’re working on). But it’s no good for your configuration files, which should go into .vim. Any method you use will copy data into /path/to/your/app/in/your/device/Documents (or Documents/Files or Documents/Inbox), but you cannot copy *inside* Documents/.vim (because .vim is invisible in your apps and in iTunes). Besides, you cannot move or copy stuff around with netrw, because iVim cannot fork. So, the best strategy I can think of is what I have suggested above: prepare your .vim folder in your computer then import it into iVim using one of the methods described above.

It would be much better if iVim used a different location for Vim configuration, e.g., `vim` instead of `.vim`.

As for getting further assistance with iVim, I strongly suggest that you contact iVim's author on GitHub (https://github.com/terrychou/iVim). In my experience, he is responsive and helpful.

Life.

[Lifepillar]

On 29 May 2019, at 10:27, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

On 29 May 2019, at 00:53, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:

I'm struggling trying to get iVim setup on my iPad. I wish there was a way to put problems and questions to a community of experienced users.

Most immediately are the walls I’m running into in trying to import my .vim folder and my .vimrc. The iTunes method won’t work because the file picker in iTunes doesn’t display invisible files and there seems to be no option to force it to do so. The iVim command “:idocuments import” seems to work with files but not folders.

I feel your pain, that’s much harder than it should be.

TLDR: prepare your .vim folder in your computer exactly as you want it in iOS, open Finder, press Cmd-Shift-. to show invisible files, drag the .vim folder into iVim using iTunes Files Sharing. iTunes *does* copy dot files even if it never shows them. iTunes will even prompt you if you want to replace an existing .vim folder (iTunes UI sucks, I know).

If fact, there’s a better way: in netrw, move the cursor to .vim and press R to rename .vim without a dot (or, if .vim doesn’t exist yet, create a `vim` directory by pressing d). Now the folder will be visible in Files and iTunes. Copy/move/delete/update the files you need then go back to netrw in iVim an rename it back to `.vim`.

Btw, is its utter ugliness, Files allows you to perform all basic file system tasks. For instance, to copy a file/folder, long tap the folder then release, to show a menu to Copy, Move, Delete, etc… To paste a file/folder, go to the target location, the long press the screen and choose Paste.

Hope this helps you get going,

Life.

[aro...@vex.net]

We tend to get fixated on automating procedures. Most of the time, if
they're recurring jobs, it's worthwhile. Sometimes, if the file is small
and the copy/move procedure is sufficiently gruesome, it's simpler just to
type it into the destination. The "wrong" way can be less trouble.

[Eric Weir]

> On May 29, 2019, at 4:27 AM, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> I feel your pain, that’s much harder than it should be.

Thanks much for your response. Glad to hear I’m not the only one who thinks it’s hard.

> TLDR: prepare your .vim folder in your computer exactly as you want it in iOS, open Finder, press Cmd-Shift-. to show invisible files, drag the .vim folder into iVim using iTunes Files Sharing. iTunes *does* copy dot files even if it never shows them. iTunes will even prompt you if you want to replace an existing .vim folder (iTunes UI sucks, I know).

Cmd-Shift causes invisible files and folders to be displayed in Finder. It doesn’t work with the Finder file-picker as used by iTunes. I don’t see how to copy files if I can’t select them.

> Folders may be imported easily, actually:
>
> - with :idocuments, type `:idoc import`, then in the Files app find the folder to want to import (which you should have made available through Files in advance, e.g., by putting in your iCloud Drive), tap on Select, choose the folder and tap on Open. It works just fine for me. Files UI sucks in a stellar way, btw.

I put my .vim folder in iCloud Drive using Finder on my MacBook. It shows up there on the MacBook. It doesn’t show up in iCloud Drive accessed through the Files app.

> ...you cannot move or copy stuff around with netrw, because iVim cannot fork.

I’ve noticed this. I don’t know what it means, but why is it necessary to cripple netrw this way? Is it related to Apple’s sandboxing of apps?

> As for getting further assistance with iVim, I strongly suggest that you contact iVim's author on GitHub (https://github.com/terrychou/iVim). In my experience, he is responsive and helpful.

Thanks for the suggestion. I’ll check it out.

[Eric Weir]

> On May 29, 2019, at 9:12 AM, aro...@vex.net <aro...@Vex.Net> wrote:
>
> You received this message from the "vim_use" maillist.
> Do not top-post! Type your reply below the text you are replying to.
> For more information, visit http://www.vim.org/maillist.php

Somehow I managed to delete the content of your second response. I thought that was impossible, but it seems to be what happened.

Anyway, I wanted to thank you for the suggestion of renaming the .vim file in netrw. After doing that I was able to get the process of importing the contents of my .vim folder into the renamed folder started via Dropbox accessed through the files app. Then I renamed the folder back to .vim.

I say I “got the process started.” It’s been over an hour and it seems to be still going on. At this point the contents of my bundle folder have only been partially copied. Or maybe it’s just stopped without copying all the contained folders and files.

[Eric Weir]

> On May 29, 2019, at 2:18 PM, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> Anyway, I wanted to thank you for the suggestion of renaming the .vim file in netrw. After doing that I was able to get the process of importing the contents of my .vim folder into the renamed folder started via Dropbox accessed through the files app. Then I renamed the folder back to .vim.
>
> I say I “got the process started.” It’s been over an hour and it seems to be still going on. At this point the contents of my bundle folder have only been partially copied. Or maybe it’s just stopped without copying all the contained folders and files.

Finally after several tries and start-overs I believe I’ve got my entire .vim file onto my iPad by accessing Dropbox from the Files app on the iPad. Also copied over my vimwiki folder.

Now I just have to get it all working. For that I’ll have to relearn vim. I got so comfortable with my MacVim setup on my MacBook that I’ve altogether forgotten how i got it. With time. And a lot of hand-holding from folks here. FWIW I’m not a programmer. Just a writer.

So thanks for the help. Would not have gotten even this far without it.

[Eric Weir]

> On May 30, 2019, at 9:12 AM, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> Now I just have to get it all working. For that I’ll have to relearn vim. I got so comfortable with my MacVim setup on my MacBook that I’ve altogether forgotten how i got it. With time. And a lot of hand-holding from folks here. FWIW I’m not a programmer. Just a writer.

I tried running Vundle. Tons of error messages, “cannot fork” prominent among them. Is there any hope for this or any other plugin manager—Vim-plug?—in iVim?

[Eric Weir]

> On May 29, 2019, at 1:46 PM, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>> On May 29, 2019, at 4:27 AM, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> ...you cannot move or copy stuff around with netrw, because iVim cannot fork.
>

> I’ve noticed this. I don’t know what it means….

What does it mean? Is there anyway around the limitations it poses?

[Lifepillar]

> On 29 May 2019, at 19:46, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>
>> On May 29, 2019, at 4:27 AM, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>> I feel your pain, that’s much harder than it should be.
>
> Thanks much for your response. Glad to hear I’m not the only one who thinks it’s hard.
>
>> TLDR: prepare your .vim folder in your computer exactly as you want it in iOS, open Finder, press Cmd-Shift-. to show invisible files, drag the .vim folder into iVim using iTunes Files Sharing. iTunes *does* copy dot files even if it never shows them. iTunes will even prompt you if you want to replace an existing .vim folder (iTunes UI sucks, I know).
>
> Cmd-Shift causes invisible files and folders to be displayed in Finder.

Yes, that is the goal.

> It doesn’t work with the Finder file-picker as used by iTunes. I don’t see how to copy files if I can’t select them.

What I meant is, drag the .vim folder *from the Finder* into iTunes.

>> Folders may be imported easily, actually:
>>
>> - with :idocuments, type `:idoc import`, then in the Files app find the folder to want to import (which you should have made available through Files in advance, e.g., by putting in your iCloud Drive), tap on Select, choose the folder and tap on Open. It works just fine for me. Files UI sucks in a stellar way, btw.
>
> I put my .vim folder in iCloud Drive using Finder on my MacBook. It shows up there on the MacBook. It doesn’t show up in iCloud Drive accessed through the Files app.

As I had explained a bit further in my previous message, :idoc import is good for importing documents you need to work on, not for .vim.

>> ...you cannot move or copy stuff around with netrw, because iVim cannot fork.
>
> I’ve noticed this. I don’t know what it means, but why is it necessary to cripple netrw this way? Is it related to Apple’s sandboxing of apps?

Yes, iOS apps cannot launch other processes in the system. AFAIK, netrw uses `mv` and `cp` programs to move/copy files, and iVim is not allowed to use them. Renaming files does not fork a different process, but uses an internal function, so it keeps working in iVim.

Glad you’ve (almost?) got your setup into iOS with the renaming trick.

Happy Vimming!
Life.

[tria...@gmx.com]

Den Torsdag den 30. maj 2019 skrev Eric Weir:

> I tried running Vundle. Tons of error messages, “cannot fork” prominent among them. Is there any hope for this or any other plugin manager—Vim-plug?—in iVim?

don't know if this is a Vundle problem. I use pathogen and just move the <plugin>.vim file into ~/.vim/plugins/, restart vim and it works. Be sure to download the raw version of the plugin code.

//meine

[Eric Weir]

Thanks, meine. Not sure you were aware, I encountered the problem running iVim on an iPad. Seeking help specifically with that.

Wondering, since iVim can’t fork, if any plugin manager will work.

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Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net

"You keep on learning and learning, and pretty soon
you learn something no one has learned before."

- Richard Feynman

[Eric Weir]

> On May 30, 2019, at 1:28 PM, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> I’ve noticed this. I don’t know what it means, but why is it necessary to cripple netrw this way? Is it related to Apple’s sandboxing of apps?
>
> Yes, iOS apps cannot launch other processes in the system. AFAIK, netrw uses `mv` and `cp` programs to move/copy files, and iVim is not allowed to use them. Renaming files does not fork a different process, but uses an internal function, so it keeps working in iVim.

I have no doubt there’s a reason, but curious why the restrictions within sandboxed apps. My naive assumption would be that when apps that are prevented from communicating with other apps operations that are not permitted on the system level would be permitted.

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Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net

"Imagining the other is a powerful antidote to fanaticism and hatred."

- Amos Oz

[Eric Weir]

I have NERDTree in MacVim on my MacBook. Once it was intuitive. It is not now. I working in iVim at this point I would prefer to rely on netrw. When I enter the command “:e .” NERDTree is run.

I’ve commented out the line pertaining to NERDTree in my .vimrc for iVim, but it still runs. How can I stop NERDTree from running and get back to netrw?

In case it wouid help, I’ve attached my .vimrc for iVim.

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Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net

“Man has been a murderer forever.”

- Peter Matthiessen.

[Eric Weir]

> On May 31, 2019, at 9:32 AM, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>> On May 30, 2019, at 1:28 PM, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I’ve noticed this. I don’t know what it means, but why is it necessary to cripple netrw this way? Is it related to Apple’s sandboxing of apps?
>>
>> Yes, iOS apps cannot launch other processes in the system. AFAIK, netrw uses `mv` and `cp` programs to move/copy files, and iVim is not allowed to use them. Renaming files does not fork a different process, but uses an internal function, so it keeps working in iVim.
>
> I have no doubt there’s a reason, but curious why the restrictions within sandboxed apps. My naive assumption would be that when apps that are prevented from communicating with other apps operations that are not permitted on the system level would be permitted.

Somewhere I got the impression that these restrictions don’t apply to Apple’s Files app. That seems not to be the case. I see no provision for creating, deleting, or moving files.

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Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net

"What does it mean...that the world is so beautiful?"

- Mary Oliver

[Eric Weir]

> On May 31, 2019, at 9:32 AM, Eric Weir <eew...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>

>> On May 30, 2019, at 1:28 PM, 'Lifepillar' via vim_use <vim...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I’ve noticed this. I don’t know what it means, but why is it necessary to cripple netrw this way? Is it related to Apple’s sandboxing of apps?
>>
>> Yes, iOS apps cannot launch other processes in the system. AFAIK, netrw uses `mv` and `cp` programs to move/copy files, and iVim is not allowed to use them. Renaming files does not fork a different process, but uses an internal function, so it keeps working in iVim.
>
> I have no doubt there’s a reason, but curious why the restrictions within sandboxed apps. My naive assumption would be that when apps that are prevented from communicating with other apps operations that are not permitted on the system level would be permitted.

I think I understand the rationale for Apple’s sandboxing of apps under iOS, but it sure places severe restrictions on using iOS devices for anything like serious computing. Is there no other way for them to achieve their objective? Are Android devices really less secure?

Seriously considering purchasing an Android table just so I can run Vim Touch and install the Hacker’s keyboard. I once had my full Vim configuration running under them on a 7” Android tablet. I think I could even sync the installation on a tablet with the installation on my MacBook.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA USA
eew...@bellsouth.net