Environments limitation [9.2]

[Richard Sargent]

I am running the 9.2 Environments and it shows me 4 VA Smalltalk Installations.

9.2x86

8.6

9.0x86

9.1x86

I have tried to Edit Installation for the 8.6 one to change its name to 8.6.3 (since that's what it actually is). I am allowed to type into the Name field, but when I click the Done button, the change is not saved.

Any ideas on how to change that? (Short of loading the .dmp file and editting it manually, of course.)

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And from a cosmetics perspective, it would be nice to see the list of installations in a rational order. Newest version to oldest probably makes most sense. Although, the conventional "sort ascending" is also a valid choice.

(As far as I can tell, the order shown simply reflects the sequence of installs I did when moving images from an old machine to this new one.)

[Bob Brodd]

Hi Richard,

Keep in mind that Installations do not always = Releases.  Prior to 9.0, an Installation, such as 8.6 could potentially contain multiple Releases (8.6.0, 8.6.1, etc), so naming  an 8.6  Installation as 8.6.3 could be incorrect. Beginning with 9.0, we stopped layering Releases within the same Installation, so from that point on , Releases and Installations have a 1 to 1 relationship.  Would be nice if we could ignore older versions, but we can't. 

You are correct about the order of the Installations on the VA Smalltalk Installations form, they are just displaying the underlying ordered collection.  I would sort it from newest to oldest as you suggest, much like the Release drop-down list on the Create New Environment form already does. I'll create a development case for that.  I will have to modify the code for both of these lists when 10 comes out as  simple string sorting will throw the 10 Installations/Releases  to the bottom of the list. 

The name change is also ignored when editing existing Installations.   I can look into that one too.

If you really want the Installation to show up as 8.6.3 instead of 8.6 because it only contains the 8.6.3 release, you can do so via Environments.  Remove the 8.6 Installation from Environments (you will have to  remove any environments pointing to it first).  Then add the 8.6 Installation 'by hand' using the Define a new VA Smalltalk Installation Folder button instead of Scanning for new ones. After selecting the path to your 8.6 Installation, change the Name from 8.6 to 8.6.3 , then press Done.  Note that this change will make your Release drop-down list display 8.6.3 (8.6.3) instead of 8.6 (8.6.3).

Thanks for your input!

Bob

[Richard Sargent]

On Tuesday, March 24, 2020 at 1:26:36 PM UTC-7, Bob Brodd wrote:

Hi Richard,

Keep in mind that Installations do not always = Releases.  Prior to 9.0, an Installation, such as 8.6 could potentially contain multiple Releases (8.6.0, 8.6.1, etc), so naming  an 8.6  Installation as 8.6.3 could be incorrect. Beginning with 9.0, we stopped layering Releases within the same Installation, so from that point on , Releases and Installations have a 1 to 1 relationship.  Would be nice if we could ignore older versions, but we can't. 

You are correct about the order of the Installations on the VA Smalltalk Installations form, they are just displaying the underlying ordered collection.  I would sort it from newest to oldest as you suggest, much like the Release drop-down list on the Create New Environment form already does. I'll create a development case for that.  I will have to modify the code for both of these lists when 10 comes out as  simple string sorting will throw the 10 Installations/Releases  to the bottom of the list. 

The name change is also ignored when editing existing Installations.   I can look into that one too.

Thanks. Neither is urgent, but merely jarring.

If you really want the Installation to show up as 8.6.3 instead of 8.6 because it only contains the 8.6.3 release, you can do so via Environments.  Remove the 8.6 Installation from Environments (you will have to  remove any environments pointing to it first).  Then add the 8.6 Installation 'by hand' using the Define a new VA Smalltalk Installation Folder button instead of Scanning for new ones. After selecting the path to your 8.6 Installation, change the Name from 8.6 to 8.6.3 , then press Done.  Note that this change will make your Release drop-down list display 8.6.3 (8.6.3) instead of 8.6 (8.6.3).

Thanks for that tip. I don't *need* to rename the installation, so I won't go through that hassle.

I do have and need my 8.6.3 images, but I was also trying to adopt an 8.6.1 image. Needless to say, Environments "had words for me". It politely told me it didn't have an 8.6.1 installation. What would I need to do to have an 8.6.1 installation and an 8.6.3 installation, simultaneously?

[Bob Brodd]

Hi Richard,

Assuming you have installed 8.6.1 and 8.6.3 in the normal way, they will exist within the same Installation (8.6).  The 8.6 installation will show up on the Installations panel as a single item; however, when you create a new Environment, the Release: dropdown list will show multiple items for 8.6: (861 (8.6) and 863 (8.6).  Do you see these?

Thanks,

Bob

[Richard Sargent]

On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 11:36 AM 'Bob Brodd' via VA Smalltalk <va-sma...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Hi Richard,

Assuming you have installed 8.6.1 and 8.6.3 in the normal way, they will exist within the same Installation (8.6).  The 8.6 installation will show up on the Installations panel as a single item; however, when you create a new Environment, the Release: dropdown list will show multiple items for 8.6: (861 (8.6) and 863 (8.6).  Do you see these?

Interesting. I didn't do this. I was concerned that 8.6.1 might overwrite something from the 8.6.3 install. So, I renamed the 8.6 directory to 8.6.3, installed 8.6.1 in the new 8.6 directory, renamed the new 8.6 directory to 8.6.1 and the 8.6.3 directory back to 8.6.

I guess by doing that, it explains why my attempt to import the 8.6.1 project was rejected for lack of an installation, despite having added the 8.6.1 directory to the list of installations.

For my edification, from what does Environments get the "863" and "861" identification that it cites in messages and in the release drop downlist items you showed for a correct installation of the two? How does it figure out it needs "861" and yet cannot figure out the added environment which holds it? By the way, this is in no way a request for a change, just a search for understanding what artefacts it looks at,

Thanks,

Bob

I do have and need my 8.6.3 images, but I was also trying to adopt an 8.6.1 image. Needless to say, Environments "had words for me". It politely told me it didn't have an 8.6.1 installation. What would I need to do to have an 8.6.1 installation and an 8.6.3 installation, simultaneously?

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[Bob Brodd]

For the older releases prior's to 9.0, the ### designation comes from the newimage### folder names.  So newimage863 translates into 863, etc.

I'm a little unclear on what your second question means.

Bob

[Richard Sargent]

On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 3:14 PM 'Bob Brodd' via VA Smalltalk <va-sma...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

For the older releases prior's to 9.0, the ### designation comes from the newimage### folder names.  So newimage863 translates into 863, etc.

I'm a little unclear on what your second question means.

You can ignore that second question. When I attempted to recreate the scenario, it worked as I had expected it. So I must have screwed something up yesterday.

Curiously, when I searched for Installation Paths to Import, it proposed two for my 8.6.1 installation. c:\Program Files (x86)\Instantiations\VA Smalltalk\8.6.1\ (with a lowercase C: drive letter) and a second one with an uppercase drive letter. Today, I added both and it worked. Yesterday, I think I added only one of the two. Why that would matter, I cannot guess. Windows paths are case-insensitive.

Thanks for your informative answers.

Bob

For my edification, from what does Environments get the "863" and "861" identification that it cites in messages and in the release drop downlist items you showed for a correct installation of the two? How does it figure out it needs "861" and yet cannot figure out the added environment which holds it? By the way, this is in no way a request for a change, just a search for understanding what artefacts it looks at,

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[Bob Brodd]

While setting up tests for your questions, I noticed that too ... I usually don't have to add Installations manually,  so I have not noticed.  I will look into it though.  We do appreciate your feedback ... thanks for  sending them in!

Bob

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