One for the Sydney Tram Museum folk

[Mal Rowe]

Sydney Tramway Museum has the only operational Melbourne Z1/2 type tram
- and it is in the original orange.

Here's a pic which may be an official MMTB photo of the car in fairly
new Bourke St Mall.

Mal Rowe who likes orange and yellow trams

[David McLoughlin]

Mal wrote:

> Sydney Tramway Museum has the only operational Melbourne Z1/2 type tram - and it is in the original orange.

When I first saw that tram at Loftus, about 2011, I marvelled that older Zs were still in daily service in Melbourne. IIRC even Z number 1 was still in service.

[TP]

The Z1s are younger than the Gothenburg M29 trams that they were originally derived from, let alone the similar and 15 years older Tatra T3.  Both of the latter are still in front-line service, with the T3 still being built new using components from the original trams. The only reason the Z1s are in museums is because of the usual Melbourne failure to follow through decisively on modernisation and upgrading, preferring to throw trams on the scrap-heap and buy new ones (fewer of them of course because the government won't fork out for the number actually needed). The Zs could have been rebuilt with low-floor sections and run as coupled sets to address capacity issues.

The M29's successor, the M31 from 1985, is meanwhile being modernised for further service. It's hardly worth pointing out that these are of the age of the Melbourne B class, which initially missed out on being low-floor, then missed out on being modernised with low-floor inserts.

https://railway-news.com/skoda-commences-gothenburg-tram-modernisation-project/

Tony P

(who thinks that local knowledge gets undermined by indifferent state governments)

[Mal Rowe]

On 16/01/2025 12:57, 'TP' via TramsDownUnder wrote:
> The Z1s are younger than the Gothenburg M29 trams that they were
> originally derived from, let alone the similar and 15 years older
> Tatra T3.

The Z1/2 were based on the M28 - all of which are withdrawn.

The information provided from Sweden was out of date and incomplete
resulting in major re-design being required by Com Eng.

They were built between 1975 and 1979 and refurbished 20 years later
between 1995 and 1999.

They are electrically and mechanically completely different to the Z3 trams.

The last was withdrawn in 2016 after around 40 years of service. (pic
attached)

Mal Rowe who reckons the more recent refurbishment of the later Z3s
could have been limited to fewer trams.

[David McLoughlin]

Mal wrote:

> The Z1/2 were .... built between 1975 and 1979 and refurbished 20 years later between 1995 and 1999. The last was withdrawn in 2016 after around 40 years of service. (pic
attached)

It is sobering for me to reflect that, as a child of Melbourne of the 1960s and 1970s brought up on the various pre-1956 W models, the Z1s were "my" new trams. And now all of them are retired, with perhaps one of them (111) in a museum. Fortunately, I am not a museum piece yet myself, despite being older than trams I always regarded as being new and enjoyed riding whenever in Melbourne.

[TP]

It was certainly a breakthrough for the image of trams in Australia and, in Melbourne, on a par with the refreshing Harris trains.  But then they did silly things like try front door-only loading.

Tony P