inference question
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Can I exp3ect from topspin based on:
To derive an instance of Wegdeel with the values mentioned?
Thx Michel
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dprice
On 11 Jun 2020, at 16:26, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Can I exp3ect from topspin based on:
To derive an instance of Wegdeel with the values mentioned?
Thx Michel
Senior Data Scientist
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Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Also the other way round is not successful (having an instance first for Wegdeel
But then I thought....owl:hasValue restriction can only be used on datatypeproperties, right?
I hoped that cls-int1 and cls-int2 would do the job.
So any idea on making this work (in owl) would be very helpful.
Otherwise I have to fall back on shacl (checking or inferencing).
Thx michel
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Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Could we say:
Linking a class in one ontology to another class in another ontology with extra restrictions of the form that an objectProperty has a certain value, are beyond OWL-RL reasoning?
Do we need to go to shacl-af rule for that?
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Verzonden: Thursday, June 11, 2020 6:31 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference question
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/385BE7E7-D986-4239-80AD-B0D5C2567AA6%40topquadrant.com.
Irene Polikoff
On Jun 12, 2020, at 5:00 AM, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Could we say:
Linking a class in one ontology to another class in another ontology with extra restrictions of the form that an objectProperty has a certain value, are beyond OWL-RL reasoning?
Do we need to go to shacl-af rule for that?
Dr. ir. H.M. (Michel) Böhms
Senior Data Scientist
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Verzonden: Thursday, June 11, 2020 6:31 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference question
On 11 Jun 2020, at 16:26, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Can I exp3ect from topspin based on:
<image003.jpg>
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/5c8daf9fb25443078436b3ffdc61796a%40tno.nl.
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Hi David
In 6.3 (OWL-RL grammer) I also found:
equivClassExpression :=
Class other
than owl:Thing |
equivObjectIntersectionOf |
ObjectHasValue |
DataHasValue
equivObjectIntersectionOf :=
'ObjectIntersectionOf' '(' equivClassExpression equivClassExpression { equivClassExpression }
')'
so I hoped that my expression:
owl:equivalentClass [
rdf:type owl:Class ;
owl:intersectionOf (
:DichteDeklagen
[
rdf:type owl:Restriction ;
owl:hasValue :geslotenverharding ;
owl:onProperty :fysiekvoorkomen ;
]
[
rdf:type owl:Restriction ;
owl:hasValue :rijbaan-lokaleweg ;
owl:onProperty :functie ;
]
) ;
] ;
Would fit in that...
Combining an:
equivObjectIntersectionOf and
a
ObjectHasValue
? michel
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Verzonden: Thursday, June 11, 2020 6:31 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference question
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Irene Polikoff
You need to look at the tables that David sent a link to: https://www.w3.org/TR/owl-profiles/#Reasoning_in_OWL_2_RL_and_RDF_Graphs_using_Rules
There is cls-int2 rule in Table 6. If you look in the owlrl-all.ttl file, you will see a SPIN template for each rule in these tables.
<image001.gif>
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Van: topbrai...@googlegroups.com <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> Namens dprice
Verzonden: Thursday, June 11, 2020 6:31 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference question
On 11 Jun 2020, at 16:26, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Can I exp3ect from topspin based on:
<image003.jpg>
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/4a17eb23c632422d95a545ffe1df5983%40tno.nl.
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Still wondering here…
It seems my case is under RL grammer ….
Or … can something be perfectly supported by the grammer (par 6.3) but not supported by amy reasoning rule (par 4.3) ?
Thx a lot!
(I am still hoping I just made a stupid mistake and that it could work directly…)
michel
dprice
Van: topbrai...@googlegroups.com <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> Namens dprice
Verzonden: Thursday, June 11, 2020 6:31 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference question
On 11 Jun 2020, at 16:26, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Can I exp3ect from topspin based on:
<image002.jpg>
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/85143cff94ad4cc4bf7bda7909f2d826%40tno.nl.
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
That’s clear David
Only here the structures ARE in OWL-RL (well, seem to be: intersection of classes, where classes are constructed with object value restrictions).
But the reasoning rules seem not to cover that relevant part of OWL-RL constructs.
(although looking at the kind of inferences wanted: they seem pretty strait forward ...)
michel
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Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Wrt last, if I understand right...
Yes but this is part of the automation..
In our case we combine with owl equivalence
So I am trying to find out whether it is normal that tbc does not support it yet or if it is a bug (on my or tbc side...)
The things we do ARE in owl-rl grammer but....maybe not covered by the owl-rl reasoning rules (like implemented by tbc topspin)
List is:
you can register via topquadrant.com ... community.....
often interesting stuff!
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Van: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Verzonden: Monday, June 15, 2020 5:16 PM
Aan: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Onderwerp: RE: [topbraid-users] inference question
Hey Michel,
No I am not in the tbc user list. What is that?
I really find it very interesting the part of the blank nodes and the inferencing.
If you know both then u can model everything and therefore, in my opinion, it is quite important to know how both work.
As the Dutch would say, I found them the “puntjes op de i ” (I hope I used correctly the expression).
So please feel free to share. This is definitely not a spam. 😊
Knowledge is always appreciated.
By the way, answering my question I asked last Friday:
why :DichteDeklagen becomes always rdfs:subClassOf :Wegdeel (in the use case as it is now)
I think the reason lies in In 4.3 (OWL-RL grammer), Table 9, and specifically:
|
scm-int |
T(?c, owl:intersectionOf, ?x) |
T(?c, rdfs:subClassOf, ?c1) |
Met vriendelijke groeten / Kind regards,
Miltos Gatzios | BIM Consultant
Torenallee 62-22
Gebouw Anton, eerste verdieping
5617 BD, Eindhoven
KvK-nummer 76907279
+31 6 40 21 95 95
From: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2020 4:58 PM
To: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Subject: RE: [topbraid-users] inference question
If you find interesting I can share more...
If not tell me and I stop spamming 😊
(or are you already on the tbc user list?)
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Van: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Verzonden: Monday, June 15, 2020 4:53 PM
Aan: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Onderwerp: RE: [topbraid-users] inference question
Hey Michel,
Thanks for sharing the discussion.
Met vriendelijke groeten / Kind regards,
Miltos Gatzios | BIM Consultant
Torenallee 62-22
Gebouw Anton, eerste verdieping
5617 BD, Eindhoven
KvK-nummer 76907279
+31 6 40 21 95 95
From: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2020 3:06 PM
To: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Subject: FW: [topbraid-users] inference question
Fyi
Still trying to get things fully clear for our use case......
Gr michel
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/85143cff94ad4cc4bf7bda7909f2d826%40tno.nl.
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Oeps, tbc list, sorry
Just needed the exact mail but forgot to remove...
Trying to get more people on tbc board 😊
Irene Polikoff
On Jun 15, 2020, at 11:23 AM, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Wrt last, if I understand right...Yes but this is part of the automation..In our case we combine with owl equivalenceSo I am trying to find out whether it is normal that tbc does not support it yet or if it is a bug (on my or tbc side...)The things we do ARE in owl-rl grammer but....maybe not covered by the owl-rl reasoning rules (like implemented by tbc topspin)List is:often interesting stuff!
Senior Data Scientist
Van: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Verzonden: Monday, June 15, 2020 5:16 PM
Aan: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Onderwerp: RE: [topbraid-users] inference questionHey Michel,
No I am not in the tbc user list. What is that?
I really find it very interesting the part of the blank nodes and the inferencing.
If you know both then u can model everything and therefore, in my opinion, it is quite important to know how both work.
As the Dutch would say, I found them the “puntjes op de i ” (I hope I used correctly the expression).
So please feel free to share. This is definitely not a spam. 😊
Knowledge is always appreciated.
By the way, answering my question I asked last Friday:
why :DichteDeklagen becomes always rdfs:subClassOf :Wegdeel (in the use case as it is now)
I think the reason lies in In 4.3 (OWL-RL grammer), Table 9, and specifically:
LIST[?x, ?c1, ..., ?cn]
T(?c, rdfs:subClassOf, ?c2)
...
T(?c, rdfs:subClassOf, ?cn)
Met vriendelijke groeten / Kind regards,Miltos Gatzios | BIM Consultant
Torenallee 62-22Gebouw Anton, eerste verdieping5617 BD, EindhovenKvK-nummer 76907279+31 6 40 21 95 95
From: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2020 4:58 PM
To: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Subject: RE: [topbraid-users] inference questionIf you find interesting I can share more...If not tell me and I stop spamming 😊(or are you already on the tbc user list?)
Dr. ir. H.M. (Michel) Böhms
Senior Data Scientist
Van: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Verzonden: Monday, June 15, 2020 4:53 PM
Aan: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Onderwerp: RE: [topbraid-users] inference questionHey Michel,
Thanks for sharing the discussion.Met vriendelijke groeten / Kind regards,Miltos Gatzios | BIM Consultant
Torenallee 62-22Gebouw Anton, eerste verdieping5617 BD, EindhovenKvK-nummer 76907279+31 6 40 21 95 95From: Bohms, H.M. (Michel) <michel...@tno.nl>
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2020 3:06 PM
To: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Subject: FW: [topbraid-users] inference question
FyiStill trying to get things fully clear for our use case......Gr michel
Dr. ir. H.M. (Michel) Böhms
Senior Data Scientist
Van: topbrai...@googlegroups.com <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> Namens dprice
Verzonden: Thursday, June 11, 2020 6:31 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference question
On 11 Jun 2020, at 16:26, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Can I exp3ect from topspin based on:
<image007.jpg>
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/56037c2a49ad437691f8c3b4d396142e%40tno.nl.
Irene Polikoff
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
I tried different approach:
I defined a class (could also be in an independent ruleset ontology) that is a subclass of Wegdeel and has the two owl restrictions. Next I defined a owl:equivalentClass between that new class called Wegdeel_gv_rblw and AsfaltverhardingWithDichteDeklagen.
But still no inference....so I must be doing something wrong here....
Michel
Code:
# baseURI: http://www.tno.nl/amsterdam
# imports: https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl
@prefix : <http://www.tno.nl/amsterdam#> .
@prefix owl: <http://www.w3.org/2002/07/owl#> .
@prefix rdf: <http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#> .
@prefix rdfs: <http://www.w3.org/2000/01/rdf-schema#> .
@prefix xsd: <http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema#> .
a owl:Ontology ;
owl:imports <https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl> ;
owl:versionInfo "Created with TopBraid Composer" ;
.
:Asfaltverharding
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :Verhardingsobject ;
.
:AsfaltverhardingWithDichteDeklagen
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :Asfaltverharding ;
owl:equivalentClass :Wegdeel_dv_rblw ;
.
:BegroeidTerreindeel
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :IMGeo-Object ;
.
:Berm
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :OndersteunendWegdeel ;
.
:FunctieType
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf <https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl#EnumerationType> ;
.
:FysiekVoorkomenType
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf <https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl#EnumerationType> ;
.
:GebruiksfunctieType
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf <https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl#EnumerationType> ;
.
:GroenObject
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :IMBOR-Object ;
.
:Haag
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :GroenObject ;
.
:IMBOR-Object
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf <https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl#PhysicalObject> ;
.
:IMGeo-Object
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf <https://w3id.org/def/basicsemantics-owl#PhysicalObject> ;
.
:OndersteunendWegdeel
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :IMGeo-Object ;
.
:Onverhard
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :Verhardingsobject ;
.
:Verhardingsobject
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :IMBOR-Object ;
.
:Wegdeel
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :IMGeo-Object ;
.
:Wegdeel_1
a :Wegdeel_dv_rblw ;
:functie :rijbaan-lokaleweg ;
:fysiekvoorkomen :geslotenverharding ;
.
:Wegdeel_dv_rblw
a owl:Class ;
rdfs:subClassOf :Wegdeel ;
owl:equivalentClass [
a owl:Restriction ;
owl:hasValue :geslotenverharding ;
owl:onProperty :fysiekvoorkomen ;
] ;
owl:equivalentClass [
a owl:Restriction ;
owl:hasValue :rijbaan-lokaleweg ;
owl:onProperty :functie ;
] ;
.
:berm
a :GebruiksfunctieType ;
.
:functie
a owl:ObjectProperty ;
rdfs:domain :IMGeo-Object ;
rdfs:range :FunctieType ;
.
:fysiekvoorkomen
a owl:ObjectProperty ;
rdfs:domain :IMGeo-Object ;
rdfs:range :FysiekVoorkomenType ;
.
:gebruiksfunctie
a owl:ObjectProperty ;
rdfs:domain :Verhardingsobject ;
rdfs:range :GebruiksfunctieType ;
.
:geslotenverharding
a :FysiekVoorkomenType ;
.
:groenvoorziening
a :FysiekVoorkomenType ;
.
:onverhard
a :FysiekVoorkomenType ;
.
:rijbaan-lokaleweg
a :FunctieType ;
.
Setting:
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dprice
<image005.jpg>
Senior Data Scientist
Verzonden: Monday, June 15, 2020 7:16 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
CC: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference questionThat is clear irene.Assuming that the topspin is rlcomplete i am just surprised the owl rl rule i need is not in the official owlrl rule set despite the fact all the related grammer stuff needed is in the owlrl grammer.The rule i need seems quite strait forward and does not feel owldl...Anyway if this is the situation i could try to define that rule and add it or try to do a shaclaf construct query i guess.Michel
I meant cls-int2<image006.png>
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/285e83a75a834119904a4a3985dd8675%40tno.nl.
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Ahhhh
No I did not import
Because it is a tbc level function I thought this would be internal/automatic....
Thx david, I’ll experiment (and will even retry my original issue...yiou never know....)
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dprice
On 16 Jun 2020, at 15:42, 'Bohms, H.M. (Michel)' via TopBraid Suite Users <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
I added spin stuff but still no reasoning results...
Thx for any adviceBtw: earlier without spin imports I saw top-spin times etc.....so it seemed working....
Senior Data Scientist
Van: Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
Verzonden: Tuesday, June 16, 2020 2:57 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
CC: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Onderwerp: RE: [topbraid-users] inference questionAhhhhNo I did not importBecause it is a tbc level function I thought this would be internal/automatic....Thx david, I’ll experiment (and will even retry my original issue...yiou never know....)
Dr. ir. H.M. (Michel) Böhms
Senior Data Scientist
Van: topbrai...@googlegroups.com <topbrai...@googlegroups.com> Namens dprice
Verzonden: Tuesday, June 16, 2020 2:51 PM
Aan: topbrai...@googlegroups.com
CC: Miltos Gatzios <miltos....@bim-connected.nl>
Onderwerp: Re: [topbraid-users] inference questionIf you mean no inferences at all then likely because you did not import the OWL RL SPIN file. The engines look for rules in the open/current graph and graphs included via owl:imports.I generally Create SPIN file (e.g. Run-OWL-RL), drag the OWL RL ALL file into Imports and save. I then drag the ontology/data in question (and any graph into which I might want to assert inferences) into Imports and Run the engine. You can review the inferencesbefore deciding to assert them or not, and choose the graph into which to assert them. That way you’re not imported SPIN, etc. into your ontologies/data. Anyway, I copied and pasted some of your ontology and it works for me (if I’ve understood what you are doing):
<image002.png>
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/topbraid-users/7384278dfbae45e38dab284a1e22ec66%40tno.nl.
<amsterdam.ttl>
dprice
OK, I do remember now.Chick on the Home button to get to the ontology pane itself and then select Profile and indeed you can tell it to use OWL-RL without having to do an owl:imports.
I do it the way I do because I also write SPIN converters and I don’t have to remember to handle cases involving the OWL-RL inferences differently from other inferences I’ve written myself.
On 16 Jun 2020, at 13:51, dprice <dpr...@topquadrant.com> wrote:
If you mean no inferences at all then likely because you did not import the OWL RL SPIN file. The engines look for rules in the open/current graph and graphs included via owl:imports.I generally Create SPIN file (e.g. Run-OWL-RL), drag the OWL RL ALL file into Imports and save. I then drag the ontology/data in question (and any graph into which I might want to assert inferences) into Imports and Run the engine. You can review the inferencesbefore deciding to assert them or not, and choose the graph into which to assert them. That way you’re not imported SPIN, etc. into your ontologies/data. Anyway, I copied and pasted some of your ontology and it works for me (if I’ve understood what you are doing):
<Screen Shot 2020-06-16 at 13.48.59.png>
Bohms, H.M. (Michel)
And moreover....
My original issue (without explicit subclass) is also resolved!
(tested two-way)
It was in the ned with both owl-rl grammer and reasoning
Really great!
Thx David
Start:
After reasoning:
With inferences like (oneway):
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