What creates tiddlers from links

[Sheridan Price]

Greetings;

I have made major mods to both the journal and tiddler creation in terms of having specific titles, text content and fields created when clicking on the new tiddler or new journal buttons. I notice however that when I click on a link in a tiddler for a not yet existing tiddler the newly created tiddler is; well call it a standard tiddler -  showing non of the modifications that I have for the tiddlers when using the new tiddler or new journal button.

Now, this is actually good since in this case I actually want different text and fields upon creation. I've looked all through the titles for core modules and can't find anything that remotely sounds like it is the trigger.

So my question is: what core tiddler creates these tiddlers from links? Then I can go and modify it to my hearts content.

Thanks

Sher 

[PMario]

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 4:11:34 PM UTC+1 sheri...@gmail.com wrote:

So my question is: what core tiddler creates these tiddlers from links? Then I can go and modify it to my hearts content.

Hi Sher,

The default ViewTemplate shows a missing tiddler hint, that allows us to create a "standard tiddler". ... This missing tiddler hint is hardcoded in the core atm. ... So there is no easy fix.

------------

At the moment I'm working on a "dynamic" missing tiddler body, for the TW core. It uses the new cascade filter system, that will allow us to be much more flexible in the future with exactly your usecse.

I'm implementing the new mechanism for the markdown plugin atm. It looks like this: (NOT final!)

There is a new body with a new "edit MD" button in the body text and the toolbar.

If one of those buttons will be clicked a new text/markdow tiddler will be created.

As you can see, the whole new body is useful but a bit too "aggressive" ... The new tiddler doesn't look empty anymore :/

So I'm looking for  better mechanism, that will allow us more flexibility and still have an "empty feeling" for non existing tiddlers.

There should be a possibility to create dynamic toolbar buttons, that should allow us to use "user defined templates" instead of the default tiddler template ...

-mario

[Sheridan Price]

Neat.

Firstly it's nice that it isn't obvious where this happens. I don't mind looking around but I hate missing it when I've been looking.

In my particular use cases I can see a use for one of just a standard empty tiddler or a tiddler that I can configure the way I want much like the new-tiddler new-journal tiddlers. Your dynamic toolbar sounds like it would allow that. Might be nice to have a choice for the entire wiki to always do one or the other or allow for choice on the fly.

Personally the "not empty" look doesn't phase me. Right now the first tiddler seen is still not "my" tiddler just a question on whether to create it or not; so being asked how I want it to be created is fine and even desirable if I have more than one option.

Thanks for the info and for your efforts on behalf of improving tiddlywiki. It's great.

Regards

Sher

[springer]

PMario,

I'm perplexed a bit, since I'm well aware you're a wizard relative to my bumbling-tinkering ways. But it seems that when you say "this missing tiddler hint is hardcoded in the core", you imply it's tricky and dangerous to tinker with... Isn't the Missing Tiddler hint easily overridden by erasing or replacing the contents of the following shadow tiddler?

$:/language/MissingTiddler/Hint

Its contents can be replaced by anything -- including a new-journal-here button, right? 

So, in a number of my teaching-related tiddlywiki instances, I've zapped the Missing Tiddler hint (as well as "empty filter" message on Shiraz dynamic tables, which is a bit more deeply hard-coded into the plugin). I do this because I have set up ViewTemplate nodes for missing tiddlers (```<$list filter="[all[current]is[missing]]"> ... </$list>```) , and don't want visitors to be distracted by the missing tiddler message.  

(My own use case for removing the hint: have participant name-codes listed in hidden "list" field of various tiddlers, assign each participant a virtual permalink with their #name-code initials at end, so that the custom ViewTemplate shows each one a custom overview of tiddlers where they're listed -- but with no easily-browsed or easily-searched way to surf among other participants' name-codes. Not perfect privacy, but not *obviously* public either.)

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding what Sher is looking for, or I'm missing some other point here. But I'm curious where the misunderstanding lies!

-Springer

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 12:43:11 PM UTC-5 PMario wrote:

[PMario]

On Monday, December 20, 2021 at 8:33:13 PM UTC+1 springer wrote:

 

I'm perplexed a bit, since I'm well aware you're a wizard relative to my bumbling-tinkering ways. But it seems that when you say "this missing tiddler hint is hardcoded in the core", you imply it's tricky and dangerous to tinker with...

That may be your interpretation, but I didn't write it's dangerous.

 

Isn't the Missing Tiddler hint easily overridden by erasing or replacing the contents of the following shadow tiddler?

$:/language/MissingTiddler/Hint

That's the text in the missing tiddler body. But the edit-toolbar button of a missing tiddler also should work in a consistent way. That's not easy to achieve with the current mechanism. There should be an easy and standardized way for plugin authors to allow users to modify the behaviour, without modifying the plugin or the core tiddlers. This should make it possible for several different plugins to work together. At the moment the last plugin that "modifies" the core tiddler wins and overwrites the behaviour of every other plugin that may want to use the same functionality.

-mario

[PMario]

Hi Sher

The markdown missing tiddler info looks as follows now. So the changes are minimal if the configuration is closed.

With the new "config button" the configuration can be shown.

A very similar workflow could be created for the default tiddler or journal buttons. ... So markdown is only an example here.

Open Configuration

1) Clicking a missing link opens the missing tiddler .. Default is the following view.

2) It's possible to define several templates that can be directly used if the "Use" button is clicked

3) Defines the default that is used if button 6) or the "edit MD" button in the body is clicked.

4) Defines if the Button 7) also uses the default template from 3)

5) Allows to use the "dynamic edit" button or if the default button should be used

6) see 3) AND this toolbar button always uses the default template

7) Page toolbar button does _not_ use templates by default

8) 9) close and toggle the config areal.

What do you think?

-mario

[Sheridan Price]

Sorry for the delay in responding. I didn't see your more complete solution reply until just today (via talktiddlywiki). Anyways. I'm impressed. Though it looks a bit daunting at first, once you read through each bit of the choices in the main text (even ignoring your notes in your reply) it seems straight forward and it provides a lot of flexibility such as what I was looking for. Even more than I could hope for since it appears you can change your default template on the fly as well as create multiple templates for any project. WOW.

Thanks muchly. I look forward to being able to add it to my tiddlywikis.

Regards

Sher