LEGAL WADING ACCESS TO OUR POTOMAC RIVER

[Daniel Davala]

To All TPFRers

I thought I'd start a new thread on this issue as id like to chime in myself and hopefully help finally put this issue to rest.  I'm in agreement with Josh, that even though it has not been an issue outside of a few isolated incidents there are still legally binding statutes on the books that prevent us from legally accessing our most valued local resource, the Potomac River.

I also want to call out and acknowledged Josh for his commitment to this cause and his continued perseverance on the issue.  He and I have had several correspondences about it, and from the beginning he has always volunteered his time and effort to see it through.  So, thank you Josh for your continued support and dedication to the club!

To clarify, my only reason for suggesting we hold off last time he and I talked about it is I felt it was just a little too close in the heels of the Fletcher's access issue which I thought was a bit more pressing at the moment and I didn't want to flood the NPS with another petition about another issue too quickly.  I also didn't want to hit the club with another petition too soon either and possibly cause confusion of the issues in the process.

I do believe the timing is now right to once and for all fully address this issue and clearly establish legal wading access to the Potomac River.  While most of us are fine just leaving things alone, it is a very real issue that many working in our area have security clearances and cannot afford to be cited for violating a statute by wading while fishing our river.  In some cases, it could even cost someone their job.

I think as a club focused in this fishery, it certainly fits within our scope to want to help define, preserve, and protect legal wading access to to public resource.  

So, with that said, I am excited to seeing what Josh puts together for a petition, and you can bet my name will be the first one on it, unless one of you all beats me to it of course!  Our success in supporting Friends of Fletcher's Cove should serve as an example of what we can do when we do it together.  I look forward to legally getting my boots wet with you all very soon!

Dan Davala

[TurbineBlade]

Though I rarely wade the actual Potomac, I strongly support angler rights/access and I do not support laws that make no sense.  

I'm willing to help, especially if it's on a rainy day!

Gene

[McFly]

This whole issue started because some anglers don't use common sense when wading, fishing in fast water with loads of debris like sharp metal-slippery rocks-wood-trash and other things makes the Potomac dangerous, then there's the group that wants to wade at night next to a major airport after 911, most of the time DNR and park police are fine with people wading as long as it's not in an unsafe place. I think asking the park service to approve wading areas from a list that the members of  this group suggest is reasonable, approving the whole Potomac river is crazy. 

On Monday, May 11, 2015 at 11:51:31 AM UTC-4, Dan Davala - Founder/President wrote:

[TurbineBlade]

That's fantastic!  

Hey, does anyone want to scrub my back?  I'm really dirty and can't reach back there!  Stay above the equator!  

Gene

[Andy Thomas]

That sounds like a very reasonable compromise.  Besides, we all know that people drown in the river every year because their doing something dumb--probably wading illegally where its really dangerous or in high water.  I think designated areas, and possibly, designated times of the year for certain areas is a safe way to go. To be honest, I'm pretty safe and experienced in the water but there are plenty of places that look wadeable in low water but one false step can put you in water over your head; thus, designated areas is good.

 

On Tuesday, May 12, 2015 at 12:50:10 PM UTC-4, McFly wrote:

[TurbineBlade]

Dan D. has insisted on fishing near the airport after 911 at night -- I've seen the reports.  So have Trent, Remick, Rob and probably a lot of other people in this club.  I don't consider any of them idiots for doing so -- I suspect they're just people who want to fish.  

I've been to the Grand Canyon and don't recall a fence to keep people from falling over the side -- which flushes the "concern for safety" argument down the toilet to me.  

I think approving parts of a river would be unnecessarily complicated and don't see why you'd do it for this river but not any of the others which you could easily kill yourself playing in.  

Gene

On Tuesday, May 12, 2015 at 12:50:10 PM UTC-4, McFly wrote:

[Jamie Carracher]

Has there been any thought about offering wading safety classes? As a newbie fly fisher, I normally stick to the shore because I don't feel comfortable wading in the Potomac. I'd definitely be willing to pay to learn how to wade safely.

[Joshua Delmonico]

They officially issue a waiver for the Triathlon every year.

On Mon, May 18, 2015 at 3:50 PM, Patrick Reilly <reil...@gmail.com> wrote:

I went back and looked through the old discussion forum and have to ask a dumb question.  I do the Nation's triathlon every year and every year when there isn't storm water runoff poisining us with poop (2013, 2009) we swim in the Potomac. Does DoI "officially authorize" the triathlon to swim in the Potomac every year? Or are we all breaking the law (with Park Service and Police supervision)? I find that really odd. I appreciate people taking some time to work on this.  Thank you!

“(e) Swimming. Bathing, swimming or wading in any fountain or pool except where officially authorized is prohibited. Bathing, swimming or wading in the Tidal Basin, the Chesapeake and Ohio Canal, or Rock Creek, or entering from other areas covered by this section the Potomac River, Anacostia River, Washington Channel or Georgetown Channel, except for the purpose of saving a drowning person, is prohibited.”

On Monday, May 11, 2015 at 11:51:31 AM UTC-4, Dan Davala - Founder/President wrote:

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[TurbineBlade]

I forgot about that -- good point.  

From what I recall, the WQ parameters are based upon data with the geometric mean instead of the arithmetic mean for WQ data over previous months prior to the triathlon.  In other words, it's equivalent to using the Farmer's Almanac to predict E.coli levels prior to swimming somewhere.  It was formerly measured as total poop-poisoning (TP....P), but better science in the early 2000s led to measuring E.coli directly.  

Make sense?  No?  Well, it's more or less consistent with ticketing someone for standing in a calm section of the Potomac river vs. not ticketing someone for standing under the US 1 bridge down in F-burg.  

Gene (Disc-World) TurbineBlade

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[Ed]

 It is confusing literature.  According to NPS there is no swimming or wading in the potomac.  However, there seems to be an exception for fisherman as long as they are wearing some sort of flotation device.   

[Rob Snowhite]

What is the deal with the rocks on the upper Occoquan? Heard a guy got a ticket for being out of his yak last week while fishing the rocks. I've asked Beau Beasley to look into the matter.

 

Rob Snowhite

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From: Ed <edward....@verizon.net>
To: tidal-potoma...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2015 8:32 PM
Subject: {Tidal Potomac Fly Rodders} Re: LEGAL WADING ACCESS TO OUR POTOMAC RIVER

 It is confusing literature.  According to NPS there is no swimming or wading in the potomac.  However, there seems to be an exception for fisherman as long as they are wearing some sort of flotation device.   

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[Daniel Davala]

Upper Occoquan as in, above the footbridge in the old town, or upper as in the reservoir?  If the former, then I'm pretty sure there are lots off no trespassing signs up there since it is on the water authority's property.  You used to be able to fish those rocks as well as the (stunningly beautiful) stretch between there and the reservoir dam, but after 9-11 it was made off limits since a huge main water supply line runs the whole length above ground.  Too bad, there's some awesome water up there.

Did you hear what the ticket was written for?  Trespassing?

Dan Davala

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[Lost Sailor]

Wading on the rocks on the upper Occoquan is trespassing. We have spoken with the game warden on multiple occasions back there. We go a warning the first time because we tied our boat to the rocks. He busted a couple of guys that walked up from the foot bridge and were fishing up on the rocks toward the dam.

On Tuesday, May 26, 2015 at 9:04:39 PM UTC-4, Dan Davala - Founder/President wrote:

Upper Occoquan as in, above the footbridge in the old town, or upper as in the reservoir?  If the former, then I'm pretty sure there are lots off no trespassing signs up there since it is on the water authority's property.  You used to be able to fish those rocks as well as the (stunningly beautiful) stretch between there and the reservoir dam, but after 9-11 it was made off limits since a huge main water supply line runs the whole length above ground.  Too bad, there's some awesome water up there.

Did you hear what the ticket was written for?  Trespassing?

Dan Davala

On Tuesday, May 26, 2015, Rob Snowhite <r...@robsnowhite.com> wrote:

What is the deal with the rocks on the upper Occoquan? Heard a guy got a ticket for being out of his yak last week while fishing the rocks. I've asked Beau Beasley to look into the matter.

 

Rob Snowhite

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From: Ed <edward....@verizon.net>
To: tidal-potomac-fly-rodders@googlegroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2015 8:32 PM
Subject: {Tidal Potomac Fly Rodders} Re: LEGAL WADING ACCESS TO OUR POTOMAC RIVER

 It is confusing literature.  According to NPS there is no swimming or wading in the potomac.  However, there seems to be an exception for fisherman as long as they are wearing some sort of flotation device.   

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[HeaveToo]

There aren't any signs on the water about Trespassing.  I frequently go into that stretch of the Occoquan to fish.  People do walk up there but that is not legal.

Here is the thing I would argue with it.  If you are fishing out of the boat you are in a parallel situation to the stuff going on in the Jackson River.  Unless there is something that gives an area particular possession of the river bottom then the river belongs to the state and you can kayak through it.  Just don't exit the boat and you should be fine.

It is getting frustrating to hear all these different things about fishing.  Here is the big thing.....Laws can be understood differently.  A Game Warden can make a charge and not know the actual legal basis of what they are charging on.  I am a LEO and I know how things like this can work.  Case Law is usually what clarifies this.  My thoughts is that I would cite the case law that makes it illegal to fish certain areas of the Jackson knowing that no one in that area had the same rights to that.

As far as wading in that area, I understand that being illegal because it is VERY dangerous.  In a kayak or a boat it is much better.  Until there is clarification or a change, if you fish the area, stay in your boat!  Use an anchor and you will be fine.

[Melser Bonilla]

when I spoke to the Game Warden about a month ago right at the foot bridge he said while construction is going on that they were enforcing the no traspassing in that area. And that possibly they weren't going to allow fishing under the foot bridge until the project is over.