which rod for the shenandoah?

[Yambag Nelson]

Floating the south fork this weekend and was wondering which rod people would use.  I have a 9 ft 4wt and a 9 ft 8wt to chose from.  Unfortunately I broke my 6 weight on the potomac a couple weeks ago so am stuck choosing between a rod that is probably a tad undergunned vs a rod that is a tad overgunned.

 

 

[Jeffrey Silvan]

I'd use your 8 weight. I usually use a 7. Your 6 would have been perfect too. The 4 would probably be a bit challenging to throw clousers or bigger poppers.

On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 1:50 PM, Yambag Nelson <northstreet...@gmail.com> wrote:

Floating the south fork this weekend and was wondering which rod people would use.  I have a 9 ft 4wt and a 9 ft 8wt to chose from.  Unfortunately I broke my 6 weight on the potomac a couple weeks ago so am stuck choosing between a rod that is probably a tad undergunned vs a rod that is a tad overgunned.

 

 

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[tperkins]

Any reason to not take both if you are floating? 4wt for bluegill and such, 8wt for throwing bigger flies?

On Thursday, June 12, 2014 2:24:22 PM UTC-4, Jeff Silvan wrote:

I'd use your 8 weight. I usually use a 7. Your 6 would have been perfect too. The 4 would probably be a bit challenging to throw clousers or bigger poppers.

On Thu, Jun 12, 2014 at 1:50 PM, Yambag Nelson <northstreet...@gmail.com> wrote:

Floating the south fork this weekend and was wondering which rod people would use.  I have a 9 ft 4wt and a 9 ft 8wt to chose from.  Unfortunately I broke my 6 weight on the potomac a couple weeks ago so am stuck choosing between a rod that is probably a tad undergunned vs a rod that is a tad overgunned.

 

 

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[Dobrozsi, Jeff]

If you can adequately cast poppers or streamers, I’d use 4wt

[Yambag Nelson]

No real reason other than it is an overnight trip and I will have camping gear, cooler and a girlfriend in the boat with me.  So I guess I'd prefer to just bring one but could probably fit a second.  Really just wondering which one people thought would be most appropriate for the fish being caught and flies being used. 

[Rob Snowhite]

Always have a backup rod. 

Sent from my iPhone

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[Bryan Lanier]

Bring both then watch your girlfriend catch the larger fish!

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[HeaveToo]

I like throwing large flies for smallmouth.  I normally fish an 8 weight rod because of this.  Big fly = big fish. 

[TurbineBlade]

I agree with Rob -- having a backup of ANY length and weight is a good idea.  You never know --

I tend to use a 9' 5-weight or a 9' 8-weight, mostly depending upon my mood.  It all works.  

Gene

[Matt Geiman]

A 6-8 weight is what most people recommend around here for smallmouth. The size of the fly should determine what size rod and line you need. I would take the 8 because the flows are still plenty high, so larger flies will probably be more effective at attracting the fish.

[Yambag Nelson]

Ended up going with the 4 wt.  I could throw 2/0 clousers with it just fine.  Caught a bunch of fish, most of them were small.  I can't imagine trying to use an 8 weight there as it seems like the vast majority of the fish are on the small side.  Doesn't seem like it would be much fun at all if you caught them with an 8. 

[Jeffrey Silvan]

Kudos to you for being able to throw that big of a fly in a 4wt. A 2/0 weighted clouser isn't easy to throw on a 6. What size range were your fish generally? The post couple years on the doah I've seen a 12-14 inch average smallie with a few 16-18 inches each trip, and always a 20+ fish, although usually a largemouth. I couldn't image battling one of those on a four.

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[TurbineBlade]

Yep - I do believe you're out-to-lunch here Jeff.  Actually, I wasn't going to say anything, but that 4-weight is total overkill for 2/0 clousers with line and leader-shy bass and sunfish.  I'd use a 2-3 weight, but then only with a long, delicate front taper fly line like a RIO LT or something.  With clouser minnows you want that fly line mass mostly far, far toward the back so you can make long distance mends.  That's me anyway, I rarely make any cast that doesn't result in my backing knot ratcheting up into the rod guides.  

Gene ("Upstream-clouser")

.  

On Tuesday, June 17, 2014 9:58:45 AM UTC-4, Jeff Silvan wrote:

Kudos to you for being able to throw that big of a fly in a 4wt. A 2/0 weighted clouser isn't easy to throw on a 6. What size range were your fish generally? The post couple years on the doah I've seen a 12-14 inch average smallie with a few 16-18 inches each trip, and always a 20+ fish, although usually a largemouth. I couldn't image battling one of those on a four.

On Jun 17, 2014 9:14 AM, "Yambag Nelson" <northstreet...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ended up going with the 4 wt.  I could throw 2/0 clousers with it just fine.  Caught a bunch of fish, most of them were small.  I can't imagine trying to use an 8 weight there as it seems like the vast majority of the fish are on the small side.  Doesn't seem like it would be much fun at all if you caught them with an 8. 

 

On Thursday, June 12, 2014 1:50:49 PM UTC-4, Yambag Nelson wrote:

Floating the south fork this weekend and was wondering which rod people would use.  I have a 9 ft 4wt and a 9 ft 8wt to chose from.  Unfortunately I broke my 6 weight on the potomac a couple weeks ago so am stuck choosing between a rod that is probably a tad undergunned vs a rod that is a tad overgunned.

 

 

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[Yambag Nelson]

I would say most of the fish I caught were 8-10 inches.  I caught most of them on a size 6 brown wooly bugger.  Switched to the clouser to see if the bigger fly would result in some bigger fish, whcih it did not.  None of the fish I caught were over 14 inches.  I had a lot of water to cover so I didn't get to stop and fish some of the better spots as well as I would have liked.   

On Tuesday, June 17, 2014 9:58:45 AM UTC-4, Jeff Silvan wrote:

Kudos to you for being able to throw that big of a fly in a 4wt. A 2/0 weighted clouser isn't easy to throw on a 6. What size range were your fish generally? The post couple years on the doah I've seen a 12-14 inch average smallie with a few 16-18 inches each trip, and always a 20+ fish, although usually a largemouth. I couldn't image battling one of those on a four.

On Jun 17, 2014 9:14 AM, "Yambag Nelson" <northstreet...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ended up going with the 4 wt.  I could throw 2/0 clousers with it just fine.  Caught a bunch of fish, most of them were small.  I can't imagine trying to use an 8 weight there as it seems like the vast majority of the fish are on the small side.  Doesn't seem like it would be much fun at all if you caught them with an 8. 

 

On Thursday, June 12, 2014 1:50:49 PM UTC-4, Yambag Nelson wrote:

Floating the south fork this weekend and was wondering which rod people would use.  I have a 9 ft 4wt and a 9 ft 8wt to chose from.  Unfortunately I broke my 6 weight on the potomac a couple weeks ago so am stuck choosing between a rod that is probably a tad undergunned vs a rod that is a tad overgunned.

 

 

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[Carl Z.]

On Tue, Jun 17, 2014 at 10:57 AM, TurbineBlade <doubl...@gmail.com> wrote:

 I rarely make any cast that doesn't result in my backing knot ratcheting up into the rod guides.  

Gene, I think that's the big knot in your fly line.  

[jake hamilton]

sage vxp 7wt is the best for the Shenandoah  RIver i think it is 25% off at urban angler it treated  me well for smallies

[TurbineBlade]

Oh, good casters never throw a single tailing loop.  I've personally only seen them in pictures.  

I know this thread is for "which rod", but for me it might be more appropriate to discuss which reel...since few reels can handle the friction burn my intense line-shooting imparts (on moderate 100' casts, but also on longer 130'+ casts).  So bring a rod and also a small fire extinguisher.  When it happens, you'll know!  

Gene ("Charred Backing")

On Wednesday, June 18, 2014 10:21:02 AM UTC-4, Carl wrote:

[Daniel Davala]

Great and valid opinions everyone, and a very interesting topic.  There's another great option that has not yet been discussed on this thread and is worth mentioning.  Consider up-lining your lighter rod.  Often times through the summer on some of the smaller warm water streams I frequent like Bull Run, I'll toss a #8 line on my #6 rod for several reasons.  (Put in context, the original poster on this thread could have opted to throw his #6 line on the #4 rod).  

First, there is little argument to the fact that a heavier line will carry larger or heavier flies more easily (think poppers, clousers, hair bugs, crayfish, etc.).  Simply put - it takes mass to move mass.  This is true regardless of what (rated) weight rod is tossing the line.  It is certainly true that by adjusting your casting technique, you can throw a heavy fly on a light line.  However, it is much more easily done with additional line weight.

Second, on streams like Bull Run and similar, casts are often only in the 40' range or less.  By casting a #8 line on my #6 rod, I still get a good load/bend in the rod even on the shorter casts.  The rod has no clue whether it is casting 20' of #8 line or 30' of #6, both being relatively similar in physical weight.  Any of the modern fly rods on the market today can easily accommodate two and even three line sizes heavier than their rated line.  Those of you with multiple outfits should give it a try.  When you get a moment, go out and throw your #6 line on your #4 rod, or your #7 line on your #5 rod, etc.  You may be very pleasantly surprised by the result and new-found possibilities.      

Working at the shop, I regularly meet anglers new to the area who only have a "trout rod".  Often times after having the above conversation, I'll have them bring their rod by and we'll toss a few different (heavier) line sizes on it until they find the feel they like.  By getting a heavier line for the rod they already have, they open a lot more doors and local opportunities by increasing the range of fly sizes they can comfortably throw without breaking the bank on a whole new outfit. 

Any more, when selecting what tackle to bring out, I generally think from the fly back - as in:

What size/type of fly will I be throwing?

What size leader/tippet (length and diameter/strength) is necessary for that size fly?

What type of line and line weight will best throw that leader/fly combo?

What rod do I have that will deliver this line/leader/fly setup best in the environment I'll be fishing? 

Often times the answer to the last question in terms of rod does not match the selected line size, but does the job better or offers up the most fun in a given environment.  Case in point, try tossing a #7 line on your #5 rod next time you go chuck streamers at Mossy!  In this scenario, we're throwing a heavy fly, a short heavy leader, and making relatively shorter casts (i.e. not a lot of line outside the rod tip to load the rod), to fish we can handle on a #5 rod.   

Now, all this to say, up lining a rod will obviously not change it's fish fighting abilities, but much of that does come down to the angler him/herself.  By going heavy on the leader/tippet size (which is recommended for the larger bugs anyway), an angler can put a whole lot of pressure on a fish by keeping a low rod angle and fighting from the butt section of the rod rather than the more flexible top half.  After all, that is exactly how we fight (and beat) heavier saltwater fish on fly tackle and can do so quite effectively.  The butt section of a #5 rod can turn a fish much faster than the tip section of a #8 for sure.   

Hope this all provides some interesting food for thought.  I know I've really had fun and enjoyed experimenting with different line sizes on my rods over the last few years and I hope you all do too!

Dan Davala

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[darbrewe]

I used a 4 wt on the NF today, caught SM all day up to 16". Normally I'd use my 8wt on the Doah but it's on it's way to Germany. The 4 wt did just fine.

On Thursday, June 12, 2014 1:50:49 PM UTC-4, Yambag Nelson wrote:

[D. Walker]

On the topic of Up-lining your rod. I currently am in the market for a new reel, and have a 5/6 wt rod. that I use for most everything. my present reel is a 5wt, so I was thinking of getting a 6wt reel. with this though would you guys suggest a 7wt on my 5/6 rod to help throw some larger flies.

I fish for stuff around here trout, bass and im on the hunt for a snakehead.  just looking for suggestions. I also have a 7/8 wt fiberglass rod that I have an 8wt reel for already.

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[Yambag Nelson]

Most reels are not made for a specific line weight.  I am guessing the reel that you have a 5 weight line is the same real that they would recommend if you were putting a 6 weight line on it.  Most reels are good for a few line weights and can be used on a few different weight rods. 

[Jeffrey Silvan]

Agreed. All you need to worry about is decent balance with the rod and enough spool capacity for your line and enough backing so you don't get spooled if you're targeting fish that can take drag.

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