Grandpa's shad flies

[Terry Cummings]

Inspired by Alex' report.

[namfos]

Nice, T. 

Here's what I've been turning out:

Mark

[Terry C]

NIce Mark,  those will work just fine.  

[namfos]

Thanks. Just gotta get me a 250 grain full sinker and then I'm in business.

Mark

[TurbineBlade]

Make that 250gr full sinker a density compensated line!  Having used both types of full sinkers, I much prefer the straight line feel provided by the ones with heads that sink much faster than the running line. 

I haven't heard that discussed much on here, but I think it makes a huge difference. 

Gene

[Dalton Terrell]

Gene,

What fly line do you use or recommend? I remember the old Rio Deep Lake 7 line that was full sinking that way, but don't think it's made any more.

I also probably need to replace my 7 and 8 wt sinking lines soon, they're both old Rio Striper 225gr and 250gr with sinking heads and intermediate running line. Fishing this past weekend with a friend, he was getting much deeper with a 250gr Rio In Touch, with sinking head and intermediate running line as well, so deep that he snagged the bottom a ton and broke the fly line three times with 20lb tippet. Obviously a defective core on that line, but I've gotten an equally bad one from Airflo years ago.

Dalton

[tperkins]

I am partial to the Orvis Depth Charge, 300 grain for my 8wt. Gets deep quick and loads the rod nice. 

[TurbineBlade]

Yeah, the depth charge is a good example.  The head does sink fast, and the running line much less so which (to me anyway) gives you a as close to a diagonal line from your rowboat to the fly.  Other companies have similar lines, usually identified as "integrated fast-sink shooting heads" since there isn't a loop-loop connection.  

My experience with regular "full sinking" lines is that they do get down, but the belly of the line tends to sink as much or more than the "head" making strikes a lot harder to detect.  

The depth charge type lines are more expensive, but well-worth it IMO.  

I'm still not great at casting them, but you really don't have to cast them very far to catch all of the shad you want.  I usually just flop them to one side, and then water haul over to make the cast.  

Gene

[namfos]

Thanks for the info, gents. Use to fish lakes with a sink tip, but never a full sinker. I suppose this old dog's got to learn new tricks.

Mark

[tperkins]

My experience with casting them, is that you sometimes have to "rollcast" once or twice to get the line to the surface. But then either a water load or one or two false casts will send the line flying. Part of this is that a 300 gr is overloading the 8wt a bit. 

[Dalton Terrell]

10-4, I was thinking you meant the full sink type of line rather than the integrated shooting head style.

Dalton

On Wednesday, March 1, 2017 at 4:13:33 AM UTC-5, TurbineBlade wrote:

[Mark Binsted]

I'm with Dalton on line terminology. The popular lines are properly called integrated shooting heads and are not full sink. The fast sinking portion or head is 24-30' long and has some taper. Even an intermediate running line doesn't make it a full sink. A full sink is 90' or so of tapered sinking line with no joint, like the Rio Lake 7. I have that line but have yet to try it, also am curious how it casts.

Deciding on 200, 250 or 300 grain can be difficult as the river flow varies and American shad are often deeper. Taking two rods is one answer but I use an old fashioned, non-integrated shooting head set-up and can change heads as needed. Rio non-tapered tungsten heads are good and reasonably priced. There are places where I use a much shorter head and can handle soft strikes better, especially with American shad.

Integrated shooting head lines are not "full sink" but they aren't "sink tip" either!

Mark B.

[TurbineBlade]

I'd argue that intergrated, fast-sink shooting heads with an intermediate running line are technically "full sink" but do agree that the running line really doesn't seem to make a damn bit a difference in that regard.  I can't recall hooking a shad where I couldn't see the entire length of intermediate running line at or just slightly below the surface.  The teeny t-lines are also integrated shooting heads (not sink tips, even though people call them that) but with floating running lines.  I cast a t-200 the same as I cast an orvis DC of a a similar weight, and honestly the teeny lines would probably do fine for shad if you excuse the fact that the head is slightly shorter in most cases.  

I should have just said "get a fast-sink integrated shooting head" versus anything else.  It's obviously just opinion; some folks will go out with a floating line and a 20' mono leader with a weighted fly and claim to have success with it, so there's always that.  

Gene

[Carl Z.]

All this talk has me wanting to use a Steelhead setup with 20 to 30 feet of T14 and 50lb mono as a running line.  I've never had the problem of the line getting too deep, but I've never seen the river running as low as it is now during a shad run.

Carl

--

Carl Zmola

--
http://www.tpfr.org
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[namfos]

Thanks for the clarification, Mark.

Mark

On Wednesday, March 1, 2017 at 10:44:25 AM UTC-5, Mark Binsted wrote:

I'm with Dalton on line terminology....

[namfos]

You guys keep this up and I'll say "screw it, I'll take my spinning rod" LOL

Mark