Cross-country camp 2025
brian...@hartcraft.com
The SSA has already approved me planning a junior cross-country camp next year—but they have also advised me to get the date set by next month so that I can have some hope of attracting the additional field of mentors that will be required if next year’s camp attendance substantially exceeds this year’s.
Here is my dilemma: if I just pick a week, I expect a flood of historical precedence claims—probably valid ones—for other events’ dates, or someone will throw some new event into the mix. Any junior camp has to happen after school gets out, so it will not conflict with the DustUp; in fact, it cannot happen until at least late June. But we have many other events in there: Evergreen & Wiederkehr encampments, Methow Valley, the contest, Mackay, and even things like the WVSC Alvord Desert that can take mentors out of action for a junior camp. From what I can tell, Ephrata just has a lot more happening than do many other soaring sites around the country.
This—staying out of everyone else’s way—is why I intentionally picked the week after the contest this year—even though I was ready to set the date last December while other dates were still in flux; it was the one leftover week. I had intended to do the same in 2025, but then we ended up this year with a number of camp mentors that were at the contest the week before, and more than one of them has asked to have camp pushed back a week for next year to allow a gap. But this may then conflict with things like the WVSC Alvord Desert or Mackay events. On top of this, I have a hard restriction: with the no camping rule at Ephrata now, I cannot conflict with a Civil Air Patrol aviation encampment, as that would make their barracks unavailable for juniors that week. I have asked for clarification from them, but so far as I know, the same week as this year remains open for us.
It took me 150+ hours to plan this year’s camp—quite a lot longer, I suspect than the amount of time required to plan other events. And the one thing I cannot add to that load is countless hours negotiating dates. On the other hand, I cannot just aim for the middle of August to avoid any conflicts; I need to at least try to schedule this during the main soaring season in Ephrata. And, generally speaking, I have no problem taking whatever week is left over. Except for the proximity to the contest, this year seems to have worked well.
It is just kind of hard to accept a leftover date for next year when nobody else has dates set yet, and it seems that many are still neck-deep in this soaring season. Who has specific dates locked in for other Ephrata or SGC events next summer so I can work around them? Or who thinks the effort to recruit and train more juniors—concurrently with a camp open to all comers anyway—might be worthy of some priority among other events? Remember, t
Remember that this camp will open to all, not just juniors, with a few conditions that do not, in my opinion, tie anyone’s hands substantially.
- Sponsorship of tow cost applies only to qualified junior participants.
- Accommodation at the CAP is limited to juniors and chaperones.
- Mentors doing flights with juniors will be asked to dedicate their time and glider capacity to juniors for the week. My standard is that, weather permitting, each junior flies each day.
- Like this year, we must have exclusive use of the refrigeration and cooking facilities for the week.
- Tow priority
- Dual ships with junior onboard
- Solo ship with junior onboard
- Dual ship with adult onboard
- Solo ship with adult onboard
None of this was a big issue this year (that I could tell!), and it still means that attending adults get in on all all training sessions for free and join us for all meals on a voluntary donation basis. Still, if things get too complicated regarding meals or pushback on junior/adult priority, we may have to do like Tony & Matt did with this year’s DustUp and impose adult registration fees with a cap on registration and registration priority given to juniors. I do not want to do that; I want any and all to be able to attend and get the benefit of this event. But I have to get the date set by early fall.
Thanks!
Brian Hart, Sr.
HartCraft
(360) 772-0613
Brad Pattison
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "SGC Discussion" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to sgc_news+u...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/018201dae6ef%241e55c280%245b014780%24%40hartcraft.com.
Chris Klix
Chris
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/CAJc298OFbKEgyQ%3D6uQxHuDNzP0y40Lp%3DwNGbCASha4nT48mYMg%40mail.gmail.com.
Douglas Hornal
On Aug 5, 2024, at 4:30 PM, Chris Klix <Chris...@gmail.com> wrote:
Assuming the contest is again held during the last week of June, I would recommend moving Methow up a week to perhaps the second week in June. Our tow plane resources are always a bit limited and this would make it easier to accommodate pilots that want to arrive early and practice in the days leading up to Region 8 contest. It also gives us more time to sort out maintenance issues on the towplanes in-between events. In addition it allows a break or rest period between events for pilots, including tow-pilots, wishing to participate in both Methow and the Region 8 contest.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/7FFF4145-4441-4D9C-B627-7D13235F7642%40gmail.com.
Brad Pattison
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/379EF7BA-2B39-416F-ACE4-E3490EE619D2%40gmail.com.
brian...@hartcraft.com
The end result of that is that although it may avoid back-to-back weeks for other events, it leaves the cross-country camp in the same spot it was in this year—the week after Region 8. Perhaps we can move the cross-country camp to the second week of July, however, it may not be so simple.
- I need to know if that pushes it late enough to risk getting out of the best soaring weather for Ephrata. I have no perspective on that, since this is only our fourth year of involvement, and we have never been to Ephrata later than July 7. But there is no sense in taking leftover weather for the juniors, or we risk losing them all (and likely the mentors as well).
- If the Civil Air Patrol has their encampment that second week of July, that is a hard conflict; the no-camping rule at Ephrata makes it untenable for us to hold a junior-strong camp any week the CAP barracks is unavailable.
- There are other events such as the WVSC Alvord encampment that also typically occur in July, and those are likely to pop up to siphon off mentors should it conflict with that.
And this is what motivated my question in the first place: if we cannot move a junior/XC camp to the second week in July due to a CAP conflict (I should know that within a couple of weeks), then it remains back-to-back with the contest, just like it was this year—with all of the fatigue issues for tow pilots and contest/mentor pilots (I don’t count). And with the national exposure Ephrata is beginning to get after the apparent success and widespread attention to this year’s event, it is likely we may have closer to 20 juniors wanting to attend—and that means a waiting list as we try to find enough mentors to remain within a 2:1 junior-to-mentor ratio—that is, twice as many as this year.
Which is the big reason I am rather stuck getting a date set within the next month: I need to get this onto the radar of additional potential mentors, possibly even from outside the northwest, early enough for their next year’s planning.
As noted, I will plug the cross-country camp in wherever it will fit, barring that hard conflict with the CAP and without going long and risk missing the best conditions. But whatever we (you?) can do to get dates set as soon as possible may help make another cross-country camp possible next year. I just need to get that date nailed down soon so that the process of trying to find enough mentors does not finish me off for good☹
Chris
1. Dual ships with junior onboard
2. Solo ship with junior onboard
3. Dual ship with adult onboard
4. Solo ship with adult onboard
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/CAJc298PR%2BKh0MNQfN1cmcizM3x8hjMikogpn_3Or09G1nS1SOw%40mail.gmail.com.
David Lindberg
Sent: Monday, August 5, 2024 9:32 PM
To: sgc_...@googlegroups.com <sgc_...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [SGC_Discussion] Cross-country camp 2025
stephen northcraft
Sent: Tuesday, August 6, 2024 8:20 AM
brian...@hartcraft.com
When I asked the CAP for available dates in 2025—because there is no possible way we can manage shuttling 10+ juniors to campgrounds and back, that is, we cannot have a 2025 XC academy except when the CAP sleeping quarters are available—they came back indicating that the same week in 2025 as we used this year is the one that works best for them. So we will be planning the junior (and adults are still invited!) cross-country academy for arrival June 29, six fly days June 30 through July 5, and departure day July 6. The SSA is fully onboard with this and has given formal assent to fully funding the tows for attending juniors again this year.
That means we do not have the luxury of actually having a week between the contest and cross-country academy. But it also means we have more time to plan and may draw an even larger crowd.
So now is the time to begin thinking about three things:
- Who is willing to attend as mentor with a dual ship? With the 150+ hours it took to plan this year’s camp, the question that there might be clubs expecting to be getting rental revenue for gliders used at the event was always in the back of my mind with never enough time to actually raise the issue. So there will be no surprises next year; if a club or organization wants to bring a dual ship that would otherwise be making rental income, it will have to bring the dual ship rent-free in service to the community, unless they can convince their own mentors to pay for the rental. That would be downright cheesy, and I know; I did nine ASK-21 flights on our local EAA Young Eagles Day in August, and it cost me over $800 out of pocket! At any rate, I just do not have the bandwidth to try to be a representative for every club’s policies, so this is how it will be for 2025: if a club wants to bring a dual ship, rental will not be chargeable to the event or to attending juniors; it will need to be done in the spirit of serving the next generation of cross-country pilots.
- Who knows juniors—here or elsewhere—that can be primed for next year’s event? It is likely that somewhere between one or two and 10 of post-solo CAP cadets will attend; I just have to get them the information on joining the SSA and help facilitate ways for them to find SSAIs well beforehand so they can qualify for the camp. I want to avoid having to monitor Bronze Badge progress all the way up to camp week next year; juniors that want to attend need to plan for it now and get started on their tasks.
- Start getting word out to advanced juniors that may want to bring their own glider or their club’s solo glider to the event. (Side note: solo gliders are fair game for rental fees; that is purely between the club and the junior club members bringing the solo gliders; it is a completely separate deal from the dual-ship policy above!)
This year, HRS juniors brought the HRS L33 and flew at least three Silver task-qualifying flights. But then there were a number of other non-HRS juniors wanting to fly solo when they had not gone to the work of getting their own club to send a glider or to join HRS so they could fly the HRS L33. If we hauled Jonathan and his Libelle all the way to Caesar Creek Ohio, then to Boulder, Colorado, when he was 14—and long before I was even a pilot, some other juniors can jolly well step up and bring their own or their club’s gliders. Maybe we are just too far away here in the NW to attract that advanced junior crowd, but my hope is that publicity around this year’s event will make next year’s one of even higher participation and achievement. Remember, this is open to adults also—although we may simplify meal planning and ensure fewer surprises by having an adult registration fee for the event next year. I hope we can additional adults even from outside the area to attend to learn and practice XC.
How’s this for a plan to try to keep Ephrata in the national spotlight, Chris?
Chris
1. Dual ships with junior onboard
2. Solo ship with junior onboard
3. Dual ship with adult onboard
4. Solo ship with adult onboard
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/BY1PR11MB798313325C996A5733D49507A8BF2%40BY1PR11MB7983.namprd11.prod.outlook.com.
Chris Klix
Chris
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/006401dafa39%24e68d9810%24b3a8c830%24%40hartcraft.com.
*Eric Greenwell1*
Good work - probably a relief to have the date tied down by other people, avoiding time consuming negotiations. This allows plenty of time to find additional towpilots to lessen the burden on the ones towing at Methow and Region 8 contest.
Eric G
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sgc_news/006401dafa39%24e68d9810%24b3a8c830%24%40hartcraft.com.