New blog on questioning techno-optimism as a fix to climate change

57 views
Skip to first unread message

Mari Martiskainen

unread,
May 2, 2025, 10:29:57 AMMay 2
to SCORAI

Dear all,

 

Hope everyone is well. I thought this blog may be of interest to the SCORAI community too.

 

I have written a short blog in relation to Tony Blair Institute’s report which calls for very techno-optimistic approaches to climate change. The UK’s ex-prime minister Blair was quoted in the media this week saying net zero policies are doomed and new thinking is needed as people are not willing to make changes. We have, however, emerging evidence from the Energy Demand Research Centre (EDRC), that people are willing to take action and change for example their diets, as long as they have clear leadership from government. There is other research backing that up.

 

As referred to in the blog, it’s also important to question who funds institutes such as TBI and where the potentially vested interests lie.

 

https://www.edrc.ac.uk/news-blog/techno-optimism-alone-wont-fix-climate-change/

 

Best wishes,

 

Mari

 

 

Professor Mari Martiskainen, PhD
Director – Energy Demand Research Centre (EDRC)

 

Jubilee 323

Sussex Energy Group (SEG)

Science Policy Research Unit (SPRU)

University of Sussex Business School


Web: https://profiles.sussex.ac.uk/p197918-mari-martiskainen
In: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marimartiskainen/

BSky: https://bsky.app/profile/martiskainen.bsky.social

 

Tel: +44(0)1273 876715

Pronouns: she/they


Selected publications (see full list on Google Scholar):

Call to action on energy demand (Report)

A sustainable transport system needs to address inequities like transport poverty (IPPR Progressive Review)

Eating, heating or taking the bus? Lived experiences at the intersection of energy and transport poverty (Global Environmental Change)

Policy prescriptions to address energy and transport poverty in the United Kingdom (Nature Energy)

The diversity penalty: Domestic energy injustice and ethnic minorities in the United Kingdom (Energy Research & Social Science)

Mixed feelings: A review and research agenda for emotions in sustainability transitions (Environmental Innovation and Societal Transitions)

Contextualizing climate justice activism: Knowledge, emotions, motivations, and actions among climate strikers in six cities (Global Environmental Change)

signature_247486420

 

Rees, William E.

unread,
May 2, 2025, 11:58:48 AMMay 2
to m.marti...@sussex.ac.uk, sco...@googlegroups.com

Dear Marie et al. 


First let me be clear that I think climate change is a horrific problem and that global society must abandon fossil fuels but there are several other considerations of which two stand out for me:

1) The world remains 80% dependent on fossil fuels for virtually everything including wind and solar energy.  Were we to stop fossil fuels quickly, say by 3030, then national and global economies would collapse.  People may be "willing to take action" (such as changing their diets) to fight global heating, but are they prepared for the implosion of their economies, i.e., energy shortages, massive unemployment, broken supply chains, local famines, etc.?   

Point: we need a comprehensive equitable 'Plan B' to ease society into transitioning to a minimal consumption, low energy future with smaller populations.  No government is yet prepared to contemplate this reality.

2) Climate change/global heating may be a huge issue but it is only one visible co-symptom of its cause, the meta-problem of ecological overshoot.  As 33 years of 'fighting' climate change has shown, the world cannot 'fix' any major co-symptom of overshoot in isolation of the others. This implies that much of the effort to address climate issues (Including Blair's report) is wasted. Indeed, the singular focus on climate is a  a distraction from the real eco-problem, overshoot. Again,  overshoot is the material cause of climate change and is itself caused by excessive industrialization and growthist economics.

 3)  The only solution to overshoot is major absolute reductions in economic throughput (resource consumption and pollution) and smaller populations.   Addressing overshoot directly would solve all its symptoms, from climate change and biodiversity loss to ocean acidification, simultaneously.  But again, fixing overshoot will require a comprehensive equitable 'Plan B' to ease society into transitioning to a minimal consumption, low energy future with smaller populations.  No government is yet prepared to contemplate this reality.

Your thoughts?

Bill


aka

William E Rees, PhD, FRSC

Professor Emeritus

UBC Faculty of Applied Science


"The ecologically necessary is politically infeasible, but the politically feasible is ecologically ineffective, when not catastrophic."

From: 'Mari Martiskainen' via SCORAI <sco...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Friday, May 2, 2025 7:29:46 AM
To: SCORAI
Subject: [SCORAI] New blog on questioning techno-optimism as a fix to climate change
 
[CAUTION: Non-UBC Email]
--
- Join the mailing list: scorai+s...@googlegroups.com
- SCORAI website: https://scorai.net
- Join SCORAI: https://scorai.net/join
- Submit an item to the next newsletter: newsl...@scorai.net
- Submit a new blog post: hbr...@clarku.edu
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "SCORAI" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to scorai+un...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/scorai/09D6C3E0-25CA-4F7D-B554-17AB21BE1109%40sussex.ac.uk.

Joe Zammit-Lucia

unread,
May 2, 2025, 1:03:03 PMMay 2
to William Rees, m.marti...@sussex.ac.uk, sco...@googlegroups.com
Dear Bill and Mari,

Thank you for this discussion.

Bill, fully agreed with your analysis. We have for far too long promoted the delusion that a rapid shift to current renewable technology will 'solve' the climate problem and that the transition can be done effectively, equitably, fast and with minimal disruption of any sort. We are learning that this is, indeed, a delusion. Tony Blair is right.

Regarding your suggestion of major reductions in economic throughput and smaller populations are the 'solution', that may well be true in theory but I would suggest that the reason governments cannot contemplate that is that none of us have any idea as to how that can be achieved. Some of it (eg smaller population) may well happen by default according to current projections. Whether that will lead to less economic output or suffer from the Jevons Paradox is unknowable.

Mari, 

Your comment about any interests behind these types of analyses is on point and most think tanks declare their funding interests openly. Yet biases do not only arise from the sources of funding. They also arise from the ideological biases and belief systems of any researcher and the desire to fit in with their social and professional circle of peers. Maybe it is time that all research should clearly state what such ideological biases are. It's time to stop pretending that any of us approach such matters in any way objectively. My own view is that if we're reduced to criticising reports solely on the basis of who funded them, then we have run out of substantive arguments.

In my experience, people surveyed are very ready to say in surveys they support climate action but that commitment wobbles when they are faced with the realities of the transition. Yes, everyone is up for a fair (defined differently by different people) transition at low cost and no disruption to their creature comforts. But that may simply not be possible. People say they will change their diets, but they don't. People say they will take care of their own health but they don't. Every morning I say that I will stop smoking (and that's what I would reply in a survey), and I don't. We all buy goods from China because they come with a penny off and we don't worry about the embedded emissions from the world's largest polluter. We all happily fill our cars with fuel regularly and then pretend it's nothing to do with us and blame oil companies for providing that fuel that we demand while being outraged when its price goes up. And on it goes.

All that taken together with the increasingly poor performance of green political parties and the dilution of green policies by many political parties trying to get elected (and one cannot assume that all those parties are just stupid and can't read the popular runes) and one really has to wonder about the degree of popular commitment in real life.

I would suggest that the whole sustainability agenda needs a substantial re-think if we are to move it forward. Here are some thoughts at a broad level intended to do nothing more than stimulate discussion. 

All best

Joe




Dr Joe Zammit-Lucia


Follow my regular 'Random Thoughts' newsletter here





Rees, William E.

unread,
May 2, 2025, 1:50:54 PMMay 2
to Joe Zammit-Lucia, m.marti...@sussex.ac.uk, sco...@googlegroups.com

Joe -

Many thanks for your comments -- I think you are spot on regarding your take on de facto human behaviour.  Various authors have advocated 'voluntary simplicity' for decades but the idea has never caught on (for excellent theoretical and practical reasons--that's another discussion).  Just one point: it is particularly difficult to for people to give up what they already have!

It follows, IMHO, that simplicity will come but it will be imposed upon us by nature as various forms of 'negative feedback' set in in response to excessive scale and continued growth.  Watch for accelerating climate damage, more rapid spread of controllable diseases (measles, anyone?), another pandemic(s), increasingly tight energy supplies, local and then more widespread food shortages, civil unrest, etc. 

Which brings me to your comment 

Regarding [my] suggestion of major reductions in economic throughput and smaller populations are the 'solution', that may well be true in theory but I would suggest that the reason governments cannot contemplate that is that none of us have any idea as to how that can be achieved.

Perhaps I should be clearer.  What I meant to says is that overshoot is ultimately a terminal condition which, in the absence of massive intervention, will self-correct (see my second paragraph above).  If we really wanted to achieve an orderly sustainability, then it would be necessary to articulate a global 'Plan B' which clearly lays out and implements the cooperative policies by which we achieve major absolute reductions in energy and material throughput (consumption and pollution) while: a) redistributing wealth/income in a justly equitable manner and; b) introducing non-coercive procreating planning to bring populations down to sustainable levels.  

Actually, I think we do understand the 'WHAT to do' (i.e., the mechanics of how to do these things) but in the absence of the appropriate social norms, behavioural responses and political will, you are correct -- we don't know HOW to do it. Governments remain  paralyzed -- or worse, continue to (re)produce and augment our collective predicament.  Which brings me back to the likelihood of painful systemic self-correction -- negative feedbacks will set in. In fact, they already are coming on.

BTW, this really is a predicament.  Problems have solutions; predicaments merely have outcomes over which we have little control. 

Best, 

Bill

 

aka

William E Rees, PhD, FRSC

Professor Emeritus

UBC Faculty of Applied Science


"The ecologically necessary is politically infeasible, but the politically feasible is ecologically ineffective, when not catastrophic."

From: Joe Zammit-Lucia <jo...@me.com>
Sent: Friday, May 2, 2025 10:02:53 AM
To: Rees, William E.
Cc: m.marti...@sussex.ac.uk; sco...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [SCORAI] Re: New blog on questioning techno-optimism as a fix to climate change
 

Joe Zammit-Lucia

unread,
May 2, 2025, 3:09:41 PMMay 2
to William Rees, sco...@googlegroups.com
Dear Bill,

Many thanks. I think we are in agreement.

I particularly like your differentiation between problems and predicaments.

You comment about knowing what to do brings to mind comments some years ago by Jean-Claude Juncker "We all know what we have to do but we don't know how to get re-elected if we do it"

Best

Joe




Dr Joe Zammit-Lucia


Follow my regular 'Random Thoughts' newsletter here





[CAUTION: Non-UBC Email]

Noel Gerard Keough

unread,
May 2, 2025, 4:23:39 PMMay 2
to jo...@me.com, William Rees, sco...@googlegroups.com
Good discussion. I particularly appreciate the contrast of problem and predicament. 

As for the Tony Blair prompt to these thread - he is a war criminal and a shill for Middle East oil interests. He has nothing useful/genuine to say re living in our ‘predicament’ I’d much rather refrain even putting people like Blair at the fulcrum of our discussions giving him attention he does not deserve. 

Noel

Sent from my iPhone

On May 2, 2025, at 12:09 PM, 'Joe Zammit-Lucia' via SCORAI <sco...@googlegroups.com> wrote:


[△EXTERNAL]


Dear Bill,

Many thanks. I think we are in agreement.

I particularly like your differentiation between problems and predicaments.

You comment about knowing what to do brings to mind comments some years ago by Jean-Claude Juncker "We all know what we have to do but we don't know how to get re-elected if we do it"

Best

Joe




Dr Joe Zammit-Lucia


Follow my regular 'Random Thoughts' newsletter here


<mime-attachment.jpg>



[CAUTION: Non-UBC Email]
<mime-attachment.jpg>



[CAUTION: Non-UBC Email]
<mime-attachment.png>

 

Julia Steinberger

unread,
May 5, 2025, 6:47:00 AMMay 5
to m.marti...@sussex.ac.uk, SCORAI

Thanks for doing this Mari, very useful.

 

Warm wishes

Julia

 

 

From: 'Mari Martiskainen' via SCORAI <sco...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: 02 May 2025 16:30
To: SCORAI <sco...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [SCORAI] New blog on questioning techno-optimism as a fix to climate change

 

Dear all,

--

saleem

unread,
May 5, 2025, 7:24:02 AMMay 5
to SCORAI

John Ehrenfeld's technology loops analysis from his book Sustainability by Design is also a helpful pushback against such techno-optimism.

I cover it in my new VSI on Sustainability with Oxford Univ. Press linked below

Cheers
Saleem
------------------------------------
Chair, Department of Geography & Spatial Sciences
Blue and Gold Distinguished Professor of Energy and the Environment
University of Delaware, 125 Academy Street, Newark DE 19716, USA


Pradanos-Garcia, Luis

unread,
May 5, 2025, 10:53:18 AMMay 5
to sal...@alum.mit.edu, SCORAI
Dear all,

This essay by Samuel Alexander is one of the best critiques of techno-optimism I have ever read. I use it often in my classes.

Best,

Iñaki


Luis I. Prádanos (Iñaki)
Professor and Chair
Spanish & Portuguese
Affiliation: Institute for the Environment & Sustainability
Miami University
Irvin Hall 268
400 East Spring Street
Oxford, OH 45056



CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material.  Any review, transmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited.  If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer.  






--
- Join the mailing list: scorai+s...@googlegroups.com
- SCORAI website: https://scorai.net
- Join SCORAI: https://scorai.net/join
- Submit an item to the next newsletter: newsl...@scorai.net
- Submit a new blog post: hbr...@clarku.edu
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "SCORAI" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to scorai+un...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/scorai/c8267943-bde5-4ba5-8421-a614400e4d67n%40googlegroups.com.

Jean Boucher

unread,
May 5, 2025, 10:58:03 AMMay 5
to prad...@miamioh.edu, sal...@alum.mit.edu, SCORAI
Gee, Iñaki, scary epigraph, nicely concise - thx for sending!

Jean

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/scorai/CAC7Ff_XzVtOCGuQAp7fgSQGhjJK%3Dms2ZP8ZFtqLe3dq7P%3DoBsQ%40mail.gmail.com.

Rees, William E.

unread,
May 5, 2025, 2:18:08 PMMay 5
to prad...@miamioh.edu, jlb...@gmail.com, sal...@alum.mit.edu, SCORAI

The Alexander essay is one of those 'dated' papers whose conclusions have been reinforced by the passage of time.

Bill


aka

William E Rees, PhD, FRSC

Professor Emeritus

UBC Faculty of Applied Science


"The ecologically necessary is politically infeasible, but the politically feasible is ecologically ineffective, when not catastrophic."

From: sco...@googlegroups.com <sco...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Jean Boucher <jlb...@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, May 5, 2025 7:57:48 AM
To: prad...@miamioh.edu
Cc: sal...@alum.mit.edu; SCORAI
Subject: Re: [SCORAI] Re: New blog on questioning techno-optimism as a fix to climate change
 
[CAUTION: Non-UBC Email]

Akaninyene Ntia

unread,
May 7, 2025, 2:54:02 AMMay 7
to wr...@mail.ubc.ca, prad...@miamioh.edu, jlb...@gmail.com, sal...@alum.mit.edu, SCORAI

Dear All,
Am happy to connect with everyone in this family.  My name is Akaninyene, a member of the Commonwealth People's Forum, President of the Organization of Christian Writers, Nigeria, and a potential candidate for an MSc in Climate Change, Development and Policy., in Sussex, UK. And am so excited to read your contributions on Climate Change.

I am from a country that gets more than 90% of its annual revenue from fossil fuel energy. Not just my country, but there are others like Angola, Saudi Arabia, etc. So, asking people to adjust their duets, or change them totally, in an atmosphere inflated with inflation and very poor standard of living could be seen as one building castles in the air  And the transition to Renewable energy sources to some, is an invisible long road that these countries must walk, to ease the Climate crisis facing them. I may not agree with Mr. Tony Blair's recent words that vividly point out the fears of the climate projects spearheaded by the global climate team, but he has pointed out a very salient point. All should look at it critically and analytically.

Recently, we have issued a call for papers on the highly contested topic of Climate Justice and Climate Financing in Developing Countries and Small Island States.
Scholars, researchers, policy experts and advocates, CSO leaders, government, intergovernmental and nongovernmental agencies and organizations, and students in Climate Change and Developmental courses can send in their papers.
Interested entrants should please send in  their full articles of not less than 20 pages to:  email: christianwr...@gmail.com
( We will appreciate most research work with at least 30% of the  information from primary sources)

The recommendations from the accepted works will form a policy paper that will be widely shared among governments, intergovernmental, governmental bodies, and other stakeholders in the Climate Change sector.  Every Contributor will receive a hard copy of the publication ( mailed to him/her anywhere in the world). Moreover, the Journal will be open-access.

The areas for consideration are, but not limited to:
a.  Analysis of the climate crisis facing the nations of the world. Emphasis on developing countries,  Small Island States, and coastal regions of the world( Any country can be a case study)
b.A Critical Analysis of the effects or perceived effects of Climate Financing 
c. A Meta-analysis of Climate Justice 
d. Policy analysis of Climate Financing.
e. And other related areas

Dateline is June 10, 2025..

Please note: Our Journal is Peer-reviewed and acceptable all over the world. The Journal is a Journal of Advocacy on HUMAN RIGHTS and CLIMATE CHANGE.
We accept articles that are original, well-written, scientific, and in the area of our consideration. We accept contributors from all geographical locations in the world. . Diversity is also reflected in the editorial board and authors who contribute from diverse geographical locations across the globe.
The Journal is published on schedule, and we are looking for significant findings and results in the area of our consideration. The findings should agree or disagree with other researchers' findings on Climate Justice and Climate Financing i
In the end, we will come together to discuss the findings and come up with a policy paper that we can share with stakeholders in the Climate sector.

Thank you for considering sending your work to us.

Akaninyene Ntia,
organization of Christian Writers
+2348054900462


To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/scorai/d6a15be1b3754206a22465bc45d6e4e3%40mail.ubc.ca.

Mari Martiskainen

unread,
May 9, 2025, 7:42:00 AMMay 9
to nke...@ucalgary.ca, jo...@me.com, William Rees, sco...@googlegroups.com

Hi all,

 

Thank you all for the various comments on this. In the case of the UK, a former prime minister tends to get a lot of media attention (whether deserved or not!). There is a backlash to net zero, and it’s good to question where it’s coming from. Thanks for all the comments relating to several other countries too, I like learning more about those outside my own UK/Nordic lense. Bill’s comment on “redistributing wealth/income in a justly equitable manner” is very relevant here too.

 

Best wishes,

 

Mari

 

 

Professor Mari Martiskainen, PhD
Director – Energy Demand Research Centre (EDRC)

 

Jubilee 323

Sussex Energy Group (SEG)

Science Policy Research Unit (SPRU)

University of Sussex Business School


Web: https://profiles.sussex.ac.uk/p197918-mari-martiskainen
In: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marimartiskainen/

BSky: https://bsky.app/profile/martiskainen.bsky.social

 

Tel: +44(0)1273 876715

Pronouns: she/they


Selected publications (see full list on Google Scholar):

Call to action on energy demand (Report)

A sustainable transport system needs to address inequities like transport poverty (IPPR Progressive Review)

Eating, heating or taking the bus? Lived experiences at the intersection of energy and transport poverty (Global Environmental Change)

Policy prescriptions to address energy and transport poverty in the United Kingdom (Nature Energy)

The diversity penalty: Domestic energy injustice and ethnic minorities in the United Kingdom (Energy Research & Social Science)

Mixed feelings: A review and research agenda for emotions in sustainability transitions (Environmental Innovation and Societal Transitions)

Contextualizing climate justice activism: Knowledge, emotions, motivations, and actions among climate strikers in six cities (Global Environmental Change)

signature_3548736293

 

 

 

From: <sco...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Noel Gerard Keough <nke...@ucalgary.ca>
Reply to: "nke...@ucalgary.ca" <nke...@ucalgary.ca>
Date: Friday, 2 May 2025 at 21:23
To: "jo...@me.com" <jo...@me.com>
Cc: William Rees <wr...@mail.ubc.ca>, "sco...@googlegroups.com" <sco...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [SCORAI] Re: New blog on questioning techno-optimism as a fix to climate change

 

Good discussion. I particularly appreciate the contrast of problem and predicament. 

 

As for the Tony Blair prompt to these thread - he is a war criminal and a shill for Middle East oil interests. He has nothing useful/genuine to say re living in our ‘predicament’ I’d much rather refrain even putting people like Blair at the fulcrum of our discussions giving him attention he does not deserve. 

 

Noel

 

Sent from my iPhone



On May 2, 2025, at 12:09 PM, 'Joe Zammit-Lucia' via SCORAI <sco...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

[△EXTERNAL]

 

Dear Bill,

 

Many thanks. I think we are in agreement.

 

I particularly like your differentiation between problems and predicaments.

 

You comment about knowing what to do brings to mind comments some years ago by Jean-Claude Juncker "We all know what we have to do but we don't know how to get re-elected if we do it"

 

Best

 

Joe


Image removed by sender.

Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages