Seat Post Slippage

[Drew Henson]

Anyone have any issues with the stock seat post (the one included with the frame) slipping with the latest sam frames? Happened to me on my first shakedown ride yesterday. 

I have a new nitto stem and some park tool supergrip on the way but was curious if anyone else experienced this. Or if there's any advice on using the park tool super grip?

[Peter White]

Is there grease on the binder bolt threads. Is the head of the bolt greased where it contacts the frame? If either answer is no, you just may not have the binder bolt tight enough.

On Thu, Jan 26, 2023 at 3:14 PM Drew Henson <drewh...@gmail.com> wrote:

Anyone have any issues with the stock seat post (the one included with the frame) slipping with the latest sam frames? Happened to me on my first shakedown ride yesterday. 

I have a new nitto stem and some park tool supergrip on the way but was curious if anyone else experienced this. Or if there's any advice on using the park tool super grip?

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Peter White

[Brian Turner]

Not a fan of those stock seatposts, but the Super Grip is worth a try. The folks at Crust once recommended Fiber Grip to me when I was having a similar issue.

-Brian

On Thu, Jan 26, 2023 at 3:14 PM Drew Henson <drewh...@gmail.com> wrote:

Anyone have any issues with the stock seat post (the one included with the frame) slipping with the latest sam frames? Happened to me on my first shakedown ride yesterday. 

I have a new nitto stem and some park tool supergrip on the way but was curious if anyone else experienced this. Or if there's any advice on using the park tool super grip?

[Joe Bernard]

Those posts are a pain in the arse. That bike needs a Nitto!

[Slacky Mac]

I did swap my stem out for a Nitto, but did not have issues with slippage for the few miles of shake-down use on my new Sam.  It also held the bike for it's build, but that is no real test.   I left the binding bolt stone dry as it is a nylock.  This is not an area where I wanted to over-torque and torque specs are generally fairly low for the post due to the surface area involved.  I use anti-seize on the post, and the frame has a ton of anti-corrosion goo, so it's pretty slippery in there.

Here is what my Sam Gap look like for comparisons.

[lconley]

You need to lubricate the binder bolt because:
1. It can gall if not lubricated, especially if the bolt and nut are stainless steel.

2. The lubricant allows more of the force that you apply to go into tightening the bolt and clamping the post and less to overcoming friction.

If all else fails, you can knurl the seat post where it fits inside the upper inch or two of the seat tube. The fancy tools (Stein) make it easy, but a hammer, center punch and finesse & patience work also.

Laing

[Joe Bernard]

I'd go ahead with the Super Grip and crank down on the bolt a little more. The worse that happens is you snap the bolt and need a new one but that's not likely. If this doesn't work then you just got unlucky with the diameter on the post, I've run into this on a couple frames with it. 

[Mike Packard]

I had this on my Atlantis, took it to my LBS (Cycleast) who used a cordless drill with a flex cylinder hone brush attachment for about 60 sec and never had another issue.

mike

[Garth]

I'll second the greasing the bolt head and threads. I had a recent experience with a Unior Truing stand whose uprights were out not parallel. They were adjusted using 2 bolted collars, not unlike Park stands. Neither had a lick of grease in the threads, and one wasn't even set. Loosening them, I heard that awful sound of metal on metal, so tightening them as they were wasn't happening without some lubricant. I applied some anti-seize compound on the threads, and then they were easily tightened like cutting butter.

The brand of seatpost has nothing to do with it slipping in the frame, given it's the correct diameter. Do measure.

[Joe Bernard]

The brand matters if I keep finding that one a little undersized and was able to solve the problem with a Nitto. Which is what I did, which is why I mentioned it. 

[J]

I had awful seat post slip on my Romanceur when I first built it up. I finally resorted to $30 carbon friction paste and haven had a slip since. Also had the same slipping on my old All rounder a shop out of town I was visiting showed me the friction paste fix. Both seat posts were Nitto S65

[Paul M]

My recent Susie calls for a 26.8 seatpost but with the stock Kalloy seatpost there is a fair amount of play. I had a 27.0 Kalloy seatpost that fit snug and solved the problem. I'm not sure a Nitto 26.8 seatpost would have solved the problem for this frame.

[Richard Rose]

This is fascinating. During a saddle swap I took a S83 post off my Clem & put a Kalloy in its place. No slip wig either. Then I got my Gus. Wanted to put the S83 on it. Absolutely could not get it to go in the Gus seat tube. Kalloy slid right in. Both are 26.8. Now I am suspicious the Kalloy might slip in the Gus once I get it on the trail.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 26, 2023, at 8:57 PM, Paul M <mott...@gmail.com> wrote:

My recent Susie calls for a 26.8 seatpost but with the stock Kalloy seatpost there is a fair amount of play. I had a 27.0 Kalloy seatpost that fit snug and solved the problem. I'm not sure a Nitto 26.8 seatpost would have solved the problem for this frame.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e0057bc8-fdb1-4a6f-bc27-e83b872af9ddn%40googlegroups.com.

[Nick Payne]

On Friday, 27 January 2023 at 12:57:25 pm UTC+11 Paul M wrote:

My recent Susie calls for a 26.8 seatpost but with the stock Kalloy seatpost there is a fair amount of play. I had a 27.0 Kalloy seatpost that fit snug and solved the problem. I'm not sure a Nitto 26.8 seatpost would have solved the problem for this frame.

I found the same on the Appaloosa frame I purchased a couple of years back - the 26.8 Kalloy post that came with the frame was a slightly loose fit in the seat tube with the binder bolt slackened off. I measured the post with my calipers, and it was accurately to size, so I bought a 27.0 Nitto S65 post from Blue Lug, and used an expanding reamer in the seat tube until the 27.0 post was a exact fit with no slop and no binding.

Nick

 

[Piaw Na]

Yup. I worked with Rivendell on my kalloy seatpost that came with the Roadini slipping. Greased the binder bolt, etc. Darn thing still slipped, and in any case that kalloy would never stay level (I guess I know why all those pictures of Rivendell bikes have saddles pointed upwards!). I gave up and bought a Thomson Elite masterpiece and never had a problem since. The Thompson also had the advantage of being a 2 bolt seatpost that's infinitely adjustable and doesn't nose itself upwards.

[Drew Henson]

Whelp greasing the clamp bolt worked, much to my amazement, which will at least hold me over until the nitto seat post and carbon paste shows up. One of the great things about bikes is one tiny thing can make all the difference. And one of the great things about this group is all the knowledge to be shared.

Speaking of greasing the bolts, here is the new sam waiting at the swinging bridge over the Duwamish River this morning. Those in the Seattle area know that this bridge was recently closed to replace a hydraulic cylinder that allows the bridge to swing open. This is the main bike route out of West Seattle and it was a major pain to commute with it out of commission. Thankfully it's back in action!

[Drew Henson]

Update - I put some park tool super grip on there for a little extra stickiness. Anyone have experience with this stuff? Do you just use this alone on a seat post or is it combined with some grease on the lower part of the post? 

[brizbarn]

I had the same problem with my Appaloosa.  I did not grease the binder bolt at the head, or the threads. It slipped on my first ride, then broke when trying to tighten it down more.  I had an extra nut and bolt at home that I grease in both spots, and it has held tight since.  Something easy to overlook on a build.  

[Brian Turner]

I too am curious as to how to use the SuperGrip compound on a seatpost. Normally, I would lightly grease the entire post (from the clamp area on down) with some Phil grease. With these gripping compounds, do you still use regular grease on the post but apply the grip compound to the area where the binder or seatpost clamp grips the post? Or are you supposed to use the grip compound on the entire post in lieu of regular grease?

The Nitto S83 on my Gus has started slipping just a bit. I've torqued the binder bolt to 10 nm, but I'm afraid to tighten it much more than that because I don't want to break it. Most other bike I've had, I've tightened to no more than 8 nm, and they've held fine. This is the first post I've had that has had slippage issues.

[Richard Rose]

Brian, this is interesting to me because I could not get my S83 to go in the seat tube of my Gus. I too have always used Phil grease. The Kalloy post (also 26.8) slid right in. I am certain I could have gotten the S83 in there but did not want to scratch it Al up doing so. So far the Kalloy has not slipped - just two rides in. If it does I may just use carbon paste. I did that for my handlebar clamp and the Bosco has yet to slip.

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 14, 2023, at 1:13 PM, Brian Turner <brok...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Piaw Na(藍俊彪)]

I've never needed anti-slip compound on any of my steel, aluminum or ti frames.  Are you sure it's not the seatpost that's off in sizing? I discovered, for instance, that the kalloy that came with my Roadini was just no good. Replaced it with a Thomson and the problem just magically went away. I did notice that the Thomson seatposts have some milling that might improve grip, but then again, the cheapo seatpost on my Airborne mountain bike (aluminum frame) never slipped either, so that milling probably isn't even necessary. My impression with anti-slip compound was that it was for carbon fiber seatposts (and I have cracked those) which can't stand getting torqued.

[Brian Turner]

The Park Tool SuperGrip compound is supposed to be for carbon or alloy use. I've heard it really doesn't matter though; apparently stuff that's advertised for carbon fiber can also be used on steel and aluminum... I've just never had to actually use it before. I would be surprised if the Nitto S-83 26.8 post is somehow "off" in sizing. I mean, it's Nitto after all. I've had the bike since October but it has only started slipping in the past couple of weeks, so I'm not sure what has changed to cause it to do so. I can see how the machined grooves on a Thomson or the cheapo Kalloys that a lot of Rivs come with would help to prevent slippage. My main issue with Thomson posts is that they do not provide enough setback for me, and I won't use the Kalloys because I can't stand single bolt saddle clamps.

[Piaw Na(藍俊彪)]

+1 on the single bolt seatposts. Those are the worst. I've always ended up with a Thomson because way back in the 1990s they were the only 2-bolt seatposts. Are there any alternatives nowadays? The Thomsons are pretty spendy for something that seems like you could easily copy it.

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[Eric Norris]

FWIW, I have been advised in the past that, for standard (alloy, steel) frames and seat posts, you should never have to resort to anti-slip grease. 

A slipping post is a sign that something is mechanically wrong. In one case, the seat collar on one of my bikes had a small protrusion that was preventing it from gripping the post properly, leading to slipping. Once that was fixed (a few seconds with a file) everything worked properly.

The mechanics I trust have said that the proper course of action is to find the mechanical problem, not apply friction paste. The paste is a band-aid on the real problem, which will still be there.

--Eric Norris
campyo...@me.com
Insta: @CampyOnlyGuy
YouTube: YouTube.com/CampyOnlyGuy 

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