Jim 7-Speed Cassettes

[TP H]

In 2022, pretty cool to see 7-speed cassettes sell out in less than 12 hours. But, if you missed out, this is a PSA that Soma has them in stock still, though they don’t include the spacers like Riv did.

13-34: https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/product/590906-s-ride-cassette-7sp-13-34t-cs-m200-6765?category=735

13-42: https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/product/590907-s-ride-cassette-7sp-13-42t-cs-e500-6766?category=735

[Garth]

I had some bit of hope that these would use an consistent gear progression of 15-17-20-24 on the 13-34, but no ..... S-Works does the overly big 15-18 jump along with the 18-21-24 which is unnecessarily close. I often wonder of anyone who designs these actually rides it. IRD does some weird cog progression with some of their offerings as well.

[John Hawrylak]

I agree with Garth about the poor gear progressions on the 13-34 Jim.   The Shimano HG-50-K 13-134 is

13-15-17-20-24-29-34

which IMHO is much better, it avoids the 15-18 problem and has 2-3-4-5-5 spacing above 15 vs the Jim's  3-3-3-4-6 spacing.   I used the HG-50-K on my 88 Voyageur and gives very good spacing.   IRD also sold the same copy of a HG-50-K for about $30 2 years ago.  I do not see it in the IRD store now.  Maybe they changed suppliers.

The 13-42 is also poor do to the 13-16 jump leaving NO 2 step drop for the high gears.  My 1975 Shimano 14-32 5 speed had a 14-17 jump and was always frustrating on level terrain finding a good high cog.  The 13-15 solves that.

In all, why does anyone want to go from 9 speed to 7 speed???   I can see them saying here is a supply of 7 speed for folks with 126 OLD rears, but if you have a 130 OLD rear just use the 9 speeds out there.  They have better progression.

I think RBW is pitching folks a lemon with these as saying convert from 9 to 7 speeds.

John Hawrylak

Woodstown NJ

[Joe Mullins]

With a 7 speed you can run bigger tires on a Susie or Gus with less chance of the chain hitting the rubber when going from small front ring to the big one in the back. The website says they fit up to 2.8” tires but there is clearance for 3”. The deciding factor is the chain line. 

With a 24-34-44 up front and a 13-42 in the back, my new Susie will be unstoppable! 

Thanks,

Joe in Los Angeles 

On May 1, 2022, at 6:17 AM, 'John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

I agree with Garth about the poor gear progressions on the 13-34 Jim.   The Shimano HG-50-K 13-134 is

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[RichS]

I'm the target market for these cassettes since my friction shifted bikes use 7 and 8 speed cogs; for the time being though I have enough cassettes and spare cogs. What piqued my curiosity was Grant runs these with 10 speed chains - and 9s. Something I haven't attempted but maybe worth a go. Anyone here done a comparison?

Thanks very much.

Best,

Rich in ATL

[Ryan Frahm]

I was going to pick one of these up but they went fast! 

[Garth]

On my Bombadil I have a 12-36 9sp cassette, but only use the 14-32 portion as I have 3 rings. The 36 is in a wonky position, too close to the spokes for my liking, so I adjusted the derailleur to stop at the 32 and 14. If I had to use the 36, I'd remove the 12t cog, and place a spacer where the 36 is. the lock rings for 12t work for anything  on up. The serrations are not vital to it staying tight, being tight is vital to it being tight. I can't recall the spacer width required, I measured it, it somewhere like 3.5-4mm. I think ... hah !

The whole point of this there's nothing stopping anyone from doing this with any cassette, as even the ones with spiders have loose cogs for the 11,12 or 13.

The S-Ride cassettes Riv sold are stock cassettes minus the 11t cog and a larger lock ring. You can do that yourself with a 12t lock ring(for Shimano style cassettes) and a spacer. If I had a bike shop. I'd have a blast modifying all sorts of stuff, anything I had at my disposal !  .... don't be fooled ! :-)

It took me a while to get used to the 9 speed spacing, but now I can go between 7 and 9 easily. I use Suntour Power Ratchet shifters.

I realize it's easy to question Riv on why they do some things, sometimes I ask myself if they don't know this, or have not tried that, and "what the hell are they thinking ?". There comes a point though when you find you can question everyone and everything .... then ask yourself who's the question-er to ask the question ? Who's the self appointed "law" ..... the self-righteous fault-finder pointing all that's messed up in the world ? Who or what is THAT ?  And more importantly .... are any such claims actually valid, and by what Absolute Authority ? According to what ? A book of rules for fools ?  ... or a book of fools with rules ? 

I think the latter !

Oh heck ....

In the World of the Real, 7-speed cassette hubs are wholly available for all that want them. Same for freewheels hubs, any hub that suits you. Any combo of cogs, the more or less the merrier !  Hubs are quiet(or loud if you like) without being $500 or discontinued or the whims of corporate insanity. Up-grade-itis never was. Stuff just works, FOREVER .... ala  doesn't break down, go flat, run out of whatever, and never requires ANY monkey business and babying. What IS IS, What NOT NOT. He!! Yeah !  Endings never began. Life never died, , Substance never dis-integrated. The dream never dreamed the dream of dreaming. Intelligence never forgot. BEING never be-comes .... or be-goes.

It's a very Good Day .... All-ways a good Day ! 

[Ray Varella]

Rich,

     The usability of 10 speed chains may have something to do with using thinner cogs than what existed in the days of 7 speed cassettes and freewheels. 

I’m just guessing but it would make sense to use parts which are currently available. 

Ray

[Patrick Moore]

I've used 10 speed chains with 10, 9, 8, and single 3/32" fixed cogs -- no problems.

Aside, related, fwiw: Bike Radar some time ago recommended (and I am sure they were quoting earlier suggestions) using a chain 1 generation later than your cassette; thus 9 sp chain for 8 sp cassette, and so on. The idea is that the smidgen (scientific term) of added clearance will allow the chain a bit of off-center while not rubbing the adjacent cog. Single instance in proof: I use an 11 sp chain on 10 cogs, shifted friction, and whether it is this divergence or something else, this is the best-shifting drivetrain I'ver ever used, except for the positively supernatural crispness of a stock Sante' 7-speed, dt-shifter drivetrain; and this friction one is as close as Bartali to Coppi in the final leg.

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Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

[Patrick Moore]

"He delighted to tread upon the brink of meaning."

Sorry Garth, I couldn't resist. I like you, don't worry.

On Sun, May 1, 2022 at 11:40 AM Garth <gart...@gmail.com> wrote:

... It's a very Good Day .... All-ways a good Day !  

[RichS]

My thinking lines up with Ray's point about cogs and chains matching up as the number of cogs increased and chains became correspondingly narrower. Patrick's experience has been the opposite. It's always a Good Day to buy a new part! Why not try a skinny chain for my fat 7 and 8 speed cogs? 

Thanks Ray, Garth and Patrick for your thoughts.

Best,

Rich in ATL

[TP H]

I too like the extra tire-to-chain clearance for wider tires.  Also, while I prefer a 2x setup to 1x (for aesthetic and closer gear steps reasons), at the same time I like some simplicity and don't want a ton of gears, so 7 with the 2x is a good minimal arrangement for me.  Lastly, I like using (wearing down) all of my gears rather than having one (the 11t) or two that don't see much action and seem like lost value.

[lconley]

Nerding-out on gearing:

The % changes on the S-ride 13-34 are 14%, 18%, 15%, 13%, 15%, 19%. maximum delta % in lower 6 is 5% (13% to 18%)

The % changes on the Shimano 13-34 are 14%, 13%, 16%, 18%, 19%, 16%. maximum delta % in lower 6 is 6% (13% to 19%)

I thing the S ride is better, but this is much ado about nothing. 

I personally think the biggest jump should always be on the biggest (lowest) gear as is the case with the Riv S-ride. I don't need two bailout gears.

I still ride freewheels on some bikes - My Rivendell sourced Shimano 7 speed freewheel on my 1x Riv commuter is 14-16-18-20-22-24-34 for 13%, 12%, 11%, 10%, 9%, 34%. -maximum delta % in lower 6 is 4% (9% to 13%) I think this about ideal, could have maybe substituted a 25 for the 24, but again - much ado about nothing.

My NOS Suntour Winner 7 is 12-14-16-18-21-24-30 for 15%, 13%, 12%, 15%, 13%, 22%. maximum delta % in lower 6 is 3% (12% to 15%), It is going on my Bombadil with a triple crank.

Laing

On Sunday, May 1, 2022 at 9:17:20 AM UTC-4 John Hawrylak wrote:

[greenteadrinkers]

Was hoping for some advice... on my Sam, I'm interested in the Jim 7s 13-42, with a 40 x 24 upfront, and Silver shifters in friction. The big question I have is rear derailer choice, would the Shimano Alivio T4000 make sense? it's rated as a 9-speed with a total capacity of 45T.

Thanks,

Scott

[TP H]

Scott, the capacity math works out but it looks like the specs for that rear derailer list a max sprocket of 34t (https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/product/component/alivio-t4000/RD-T4000.html).  It may still work outright (specs are conservative) but, if not, one of the links/tabs (e.g., WolfTooth road or goat link) to drop the derailer down will likely make it all work out.

[Doug H.]

Nine speed seems to hit the sweet spot for me on my Clem with the double chainrings. Although,  I imagine any rider could adapt to 5 or more rear sprockets.

Doug

[Jim Bronson]

The earlier version of the Alivio 4000 was rated for 36 and it worked quite well.  I still have it lying around the garage somewhere.  It just doesn't fit my shiny silver aesthetic.

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