Feeler: ISO extra-small 26er?

[Michael Morrissey]

Hi Everyone,

I'm thinking about getting a new bike for my wife. Currently, she has a Trek FX. She likes it a lot, but I can't help but think it doesn't fit her right. She is 5 feet tall, yet the bike has 700x35 tires. The frame is small but I think it's crazy to have an extra-small bike with the biggest wheel size. Google "Trek FX 13 inch" and look at this ridiculously proportioned bicycle. It looks like a penny-farthing.

I think she would be much more comfortable on a steel 26" wheeled bike. I especially like it because I already own 3 vintage 26" mountain bikes as parts sources. She has expressed interest in getting a lighter bike, more roadish, with drop bars. She really likes the color blue, so I want to get her a blue bike. I spoke with a local custom builder, who loved the idea and quoted me $1800 for a custom frame. 

I've got an eBay notification going for the Surly Long Haul Trucker in extra-small 42cm. This would check all my boxes. 

I was wondering if anyone has experience (or ones they will get rid of cheap) with the smallest of touring bikes: 

Joe Appaloosa in 46cm

Atlantis in 47cm?

Surly Long Haul Trucker or Disc Trucker in 42cm

Clem Smith / Clementine in 45cm 

Buy another old Gary Fisher and add drop bars and call it a day? 

Others???

I'd even consider a 24" wheeled bike for her. Crust bikes made a Romanceur in 24". Salsa makes a 24" gravel bike that looks really nice too.

If anyone has one we could try, we are in NYC.

Thanks! 

Michael 

[lucky...@gmail.com]

I might be in the minority here but I had a 26" wheeled Long Haul Trucker and found it to be a tank. I didn't like it much for ...really anything. In comparison I have a 26" wheeled old short wheelbase Atlantis and like it very much both on and off road. (I also have a 26" wheeled step thru Hard Rock built up with nice parts (Risco Platy inspired build) and absolutely love it.

I saw yesterday on IG that Crust is thinking about another run of step thrus.  

You could go cheap with something like the Hard Rock as your base until the perfect bike appears. 

That said, all of these listed bikes feel pretty chunky to me if your wife wants to go faster. What about a step thru Bassi Rachel, Handsome She-Devil, or similar?

Me: female, 5'7 (so taller than your wife), my 2 cents for whatever that's worth

On Jan 11, 2024, at 09:46, Michael Morrissey <michaelg...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[George Schick]

I used to have a wife who was 4' 10" and she was persuaded to jump from running into cycling by some friends (something I had tried to get her to do unsuccessfully for many years).  She wound up with the smallest CF frame size road bike made with 700C wheels and it was an awkward looking and handling apparatus.  That frame eventually cracked (surprise!) and I told her to scrap it and get a small framed aluminum road bike with 650C wheels.  Of course, she resisted until someone else in the local bike club made the same recommendation. And it looked and fit proportionally and perfectly.

[Will Boericke]

I have a lovely 5'2" wife who is so attached to her 90s era Specialized Crossroads that she had me find her a replacement when the original was stolen.  700c wheels are not an issue for her on that frame and we just toured on it last summer.  I have replaced everything on the frame with more modern (and importantly lighter) components.

But, I hear what you're saying on proportional wheel size.  My buddy is 6'5" and looks silly even on 700c because his frames are so big.  He needs a 36er.

If you need an excuse to tinker, carry on!  ;)

Will

[Dave S]

I have a red 1993 XO-3 48cm kicking around here somewhere.  I'm in NJ.

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

Nothing to offer for sale, unfortunately,  but I would add a small Salsa Vaya 2 to your list (I don;t know the exact year range where the smallest all took 26" wheels but this is the one I recall specifically looking at: 

  2015 Vaya 2 | Salsa Cycles 

When we last purchased a new bike for my 5' spouse it was narrowed down between the small Vaya 2 (which did have 26" wheels, disc brakes, and drops and came in a nice shade of blue) and the small Velo Orange Camargue (which also takes 26" wheels but canti/v-brakes and was frame only to allow us to build to suit.)  She ended up choosing the VO because she was indifferent on brake type, already had a drop bar road bike and wanted more of a flat bar set-up for a touring type all-rounder, and it was in a shade of green (preferred color) vs. the blue Salsa.

On Thursday, January 11, 2024 at 12:46:08 PM UTC-5 Michael Morrissey wrote:

[Garth]

A Soma Buena Vista rim brake or disc come in 42cm size and 26" wheels !

https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/category/frames-frame-parts-bicycles-frames-990

VO has this one :

https://velo-orange.com/collections/neutrino-mini-velo/products/neutrino-minivelo

[lucky...@gmail.com]

Oooh yeah the Neutrino mini Velo! So many build options with that! 

On Jan 11, 2024, at 13:39, Garth <gart...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Patrick Moore]

+1 for an XO-?-type bike; if a custom all the better since the XO-1, at least, and I daresay the other XOs, was very capable of improvement. I would wonder whether a Long Haul Trucker is overbuilt for someone so small. 

The principal liability of a wheel size other than 700C is the number and type and quality of tires available, but I've been surprised at how many good road-ish 559 tires are currently for sale. I guess that the question is even more pertinent for 24" tires.

A custom that can take 559 X 28 mm Elk Passes and 42 mm Naches Passes is very nice.

I wish I could find and post a photo of Jan Heine's girlfriend (wife?) on her Elk Pass-shod road bike.

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Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[Ian A]

Hi Partick,

That would be Natsuko Hirose I believe (I could be wrong and normally am). https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqn2MZJw9-Q&pp=ygUZQWxsIHJvYWQgY3ljbGluZyBpbiBqYXBhbg%3D%3D

IanA

[Patrick Moore]

She is the one; Thanks. I have 1 or 2 photos of her riding gravel on Elk Passes on her custom -- Path hunter? All rounder? Country bike? a Jobstian "road bike is all you need"? -- bicycle with Elk passes; copied largely for her perfect hoods riding position; but those photos are on another computer.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/d1951a39-cd9d-4874-91f8-aad2d719fd8dn%40googlegroups.com.

[Ian A]

Perhaps this RH journal post would give a bit more context https://www.renehersecycles.com/performance-is-important-for-slow-riders-too/

Either way, a well written article invoking wonder in the reader. So many beautiful places to explore in this world. 

IanA

[Michael Connors]

She has an ALPS bike with two handlebar setups. From what I could find on the internet they stopped making them in about 2005. And you had to travel to Japan to order one in person.

[J L]

While all the bikes OP listed are great vehicles, none of them fit the brief. If the brief is “Lighter, more roadish, with drop bars…” for someone 5’ in height, I would look for used Georgina Terry bikes. Terry is an accomplished and innovative bicycle designer and frame builder. She builds custom bicycles now and has offered many production models in the past. Many of her designs utilize two different wheel sizes (24” front, 700c rear) to allow for the top tube length and stand over height to match the needs of short stature riders.

She also offered bicycles with 650c (571) and later, 26” (559) wheels. Her 26” (559) bikes tend to be designed around Rene Herse Elk Pass 26x1.25 tires.

The flea bay has beautiful blue Waterford built Terry Gale Force road frame for 559 wheels. I messages OP directly with this suggestion.

Another used bicycle option is searching for 650c bikes. We know from list member Patrick M. that 571x23 and 559x32 work on the same frames. Elk Pass tires tend to run a little narrow at 29-30mm so width is usually not an issue either. A discerning eye can separate the old time trial bikes from the small wheel road bicycles. Also on the flea bay is a nice steel Davidson, though the top tube might be too long for this use.

There are many current options using this 650c route on the bay, including a super inexpensive Terry size 50x50cm square. Which is too large for OP’s spouse but would be a nice bike for someone in the 5’2” range.

JL from SF

[Patrick Moore]

Note that 571 X 23 and 559 X 23 are easily swappable with mid- or slightly longer reach (centerpull) brakes -- even short reach calipers if the mounting holes are happily placed -- as the difference in radius is only 6 mm or slightly less than 1/4".

[Ginz]

Soma Fab has a 42cm Buena Vista Mixte. I don't think it gets you a MUCH shorter top tube (518mm vs the typical 525mm or 540mm on a 48cm frame) , but it is easier to mount for a smaller rider.

They also go on sale now and then.

On Thursday, January 11, 2024 at 12:46:08 PM UTC-5 Michael Morrissey wrote:

[Ginz]

Actually, I was thinking of putting one of these away for my kids. Unfortunatley, the 42cm model only fits 26" wheels on the dual-pivot/centerbull brake version,  49-57mm reach.  Not the end of the world but not at good as canti brakes.

[Matthew Williams]

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[Matthew Williams]

On Jan 11, 2024, at 9:46 AM, Michael Morrissey <michaelg...@gmail.com> wrote:

[dougP]

My wife is 5' 2" & loves her 47 cm Atlantis with 1.5" x 26" Schwalbe Marathon Supreme tires. I have a 58 cm Atlantis. When I ride her bike (to check out something) it seems to accelerate much quicker than mine. Rims are different & of course the 700 x 40 wheel / tire set up is heavier. The small Atlantis is hard to find. There were also a miniscule number of 44 cm that were made. A few years ago, during one of their periodic inventories, Rivendell "found" 2 47s tucked away somewhere. Who knows, there might still be one at RBWHQ. Give them a call.

DougP

[Pam Bikes]

I'm 5ft and have a pbh of 68.  I have a 47 Betty Foy w/26 in wheels.  I need the step through frame for stand over.  I've never found a bike w/ a horizontal top tube w/enough standover for me.  But I don't know your wife's pbh.  My daughter has a 50 Betty w/650b and it's too big for me.  If you want to come to NC, she's welcome to try out my bike and my daughters bike for size.  I'm in Charlotte.

[mgst...@gmail.com]

I have a project that needs a little more work to finish it up…..vintage 531 tubed gitane, originally drop barred 700c, now with 650b wheels; built it up for my wife as a city bike when we lived between 2 places, but now back to one rural life, she rides her OG Glorius, but mostly we’re tandeming.  The Gitane needs its cockpit sorted out, right now it’s a 1x9 with flat bars. It’s a very nice bike, she was quite fast on it. I; will post or send photos this eve, am in transit, and just noticing this late to the party

Also i have a Vitus frameset, yes! that one!  Which she also rode, and it was a light fast road experience. 

They’re both fit my wife who is short of leg…we call it, ‘well endowed in the torso’. 

Ron in Western Mass 

On Thursday, January 11, 2024 at 12:46:08 PM UTC-5 Michael Morrissey wrote:

[Michael Morrissey]

Hi Everyone,

I know there is a lot of bike knowledge on this board, but I was blown away by the detail and thoughtful responses I got to my question. Thank you so much! I bought one of the bikes someone suggested from the above posts! I got it shipped to my friend's house, and now I'm waiting a few weeks to give it to my wife for her birthday. I'll post her reaction in a few weeks when her birthday arrives. I hope it fits her and she likes it, and it softens her up to let me buy more bikes.

Thanks!

Michael

[Michael Morrissey]

Thanks again to everyone on this list for helping me pick out a bike for my wife! This is what I came up with thanks to Coal Bee Rye Anne's suggestion (I had no idea they made a 26" version)! I bought a 2012 Salsa Vaya 50cm with 26" wheels. It fits her great. Not only was she completely surprised, but she did that thing where someone test rides a bike and they disappear long enough for you to seriously worry. She went around the block. She has never had drop bars, disc brakes or a steel frame. She reported that it was quicker and smoother riding off pavement than she expected. This bike is so nice. I also looked at the Bike Insights page and the geometry isn't far off of the 26" 46cm small Appaloosa. I didn't get the best bargain price, but I found it at The Pro's Closet and they had great service, packed up the bike nicely, and even through in a little torque wrench. The listing is still up if you want to see the specs and how much I paid. 

The contrarian in me also appreciates that this bike has no Shimano parts. It has a full SRAM kit, and since it is from 2012 I consider it adequately modern but not annoyingly so. I might convert it to 1x10 for simplicity's sake. She wanted a blue bike, so I got blue pedals and I might get some more blue parts (anyone holding blue Chris King disc hubs?) for some added flair. 

Long live the 26" wheel,

Michael

[Michael Morrissey]

Oops I meant they THREW in a little torque wrench. LOL. 

[Bill Lindsay]

That looks like a BALB (bad ass little bike).  APPROVE!

BL in EC

[Bill Lindsay]

Also, I just got a work email indicating Mike Morrissey's involvement in a new executive re-org.  That Mike Morrissey is in Ireland, though, so probably not related.  :)

BL not in Ireland

[Patrick Moore]

Nice bike! Curious about the rims: I see that they're DTs but I can't read the model. I do see that they are made for disc brakes. Are these mountain bike rims or road rims? I'm tickled to see that the Tom Slick is still available, but then those DT rims must be pretty narrow and therefore -- ? -- 26" road rims ...?

Patrick Moore, who rides 26" road wheels even tho' he also rides a theoretical level tt 60 c-c frame.

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[Will Boericke]

I'm positive those were DT mtb rims.  I don't believe DT (or anyone?) ever made a rim for disc road application.  With the move to wide rims, though, "vintage" DT mtb rims like these look like modern "road" rims.

Will

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[Michael Morrissey]

The rims are DT Swiss X430 Disc. The hubs are SRAM (later Salsas came with anodized Formula hubs stock!) and the tires are 26" x 1" Ritchey Tom Slicks.

M