Chauncey Matthews Riv-cloned Road Bike for Road, take 2

[Patrick Moore]

Chauncey picked up the new bike this (actually, yesterday) morning to re-do the fork and reinforce the rear rack. A 41 mm Pasela has ample room under the 45 mm fender in the rear, but while it fits under the fender in front, there is only about 5 mm of clearance, so he will lengthen the fork legs to gain an additional 10 mm, and swap out the fork-crown fender mount with projecting boss with another that puts the threaded boss inside the steerer, so that the fender can be butted up tight against the underside of the crown. That should gain at least 3 mm. He said he can add more rake to the fork to preserve the wonderful (Riv-like, in fact, since it's Riv clone) handling.

Grant would not have built me a custom with the features I wanted -- 42s with fenders, narrow Q, and 118 mm OL rear spacing, with braze-ones for Sturmey Archer trigger shifter, extra-long but thin plate dropouts (Chauncey cut his own), and internal light wire routing, with custom f and r racks. So I consider this a non-Riv tribute to Riv.

Once I get the bike back, I'll look into buying some RH Naches Pass tires.

--

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

[Dave Johnston]

Did you try riding it as it was with the 41mm Pasela?

-Dave

[Patrick Moore]

No, though 1 reason was that I had only the 1 Pasela which I acquired as a a design gauge. 

There was perhaps 5 mm of clearance between top of Pasela and bottom of flat-head allen bolt, and I could have ridden it so, but I wanted the fork made right, which means room for a real 45 and 10 mm under fender bolt.

Once all is as it ought to be, I hope to get some Naches Pass tires and really try out the design!

Chauncey was waiting for a new (biplane; Pacenti?) fork crown a weeke ago.

Which leads to a dilemma, one that can only afflict the privileged: should 29s or 42s be the default tire? I'm inclined to keep the 29s as the "main" tire, since they ride so ineffably well on pavement, and since the bike handles so wonderfully with them. I personally have no use for tires fatter than, say, 32 mm, for pavement, even less than perfect pavement; given our sandy soil, I prefer real width, as in 60 mm, and 700C to boot, for off road. The Naches Passes would be occasional, "just 'cause I feel like it" tires.

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[Addison Quarles]

I must ask: a 41mm Pasela? How have I missed out on this? 700 x 41? Or is this another way of referring to the 26 x 1.75? 

Also, holy smokes do you have photos of this bike anywhere? This thing sounds wild!

[David Johnston]

He is referring to the 26x1.75 Pasela which has a real width of about
41mm. Interestingly the Rene Herse Natches Pass 26 x 1.8" is also
about 41mm.

On 8/11/20, Addison Quarles <bicycler...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I must ask: a 41mm Pasela? How have I missed out on this? 700 x 41? Or is
> this another way of referring to the 26 x 1.75?
> Also, holy smokes do you have photos of this bike anywhere? This thing
> sounds wild!
>
> On Tuesday, August 11, 2020 at 11:22:55 AM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> No, though 1 reason was that I had only the 1 Pasela which I acquired as a
>>
>> a design gauge.
>>
>> There was perhaps 5 mm of clearance between top of Pasela and bottom of
>> flat-head allen bolt, and I could have ridden it so, but I wanted the fork
>>
>> made right, which means room for a real 45 and 10 mm under fender bolt.
>>
>> Once all is as it ought to be, I hope to get some Naches Pass tires and

>> *really* try out the design!

>>
>> Chauncey was waiting for a new (biplane; Pacenti?) fork crown a weeke
>> ago.
>>
>> Which leads to a dilemma, one that can only afflict the privileged: should
>>
>> 29s or 42s be the default tire? I'm inclined to keep the 29s as the "main"
>>
>> tire, since they ride so ineffably well on pavement, and since the bike
>> handles so wonderfully with them. I personally have no use for tires
>> fatter
>> than, say, 32 mm, for pavement, even less than perfect pavement; given our
>>

>> sandy soil, I prefer *real* width, as in 60 mm, and 700C to boot, for off

>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> Patrick Moore
>>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>>>

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>>>
>>
>>
>> --

>>
>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>>
>

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[Addison Quarles]

Got it! Both lovely tires. I’d bought up and squirreled away some Pasela Tourguards back when they changed over to the “Protite”
Among them a pair of 26x1.75’s. I eventually put them on something but in hindsight I wish I’d bought more. Just mounted my last pair of 700x35’s on my “forever bike”
I don’t know why, but I can’t stand the colors of the label. The old TG logo just looks right.

[Patrick Moore]

The 559 X 1.75" Pasela measures 40.74 mm wide on my 21 mm outside width rims.

Here ya go! (I've posted photos earlier, but always happy to repost -- and re repost; and re re repost; and and and ...)

Fun facts: Bike was built to copy the 2003 Rivendell that I had had modified enough times for features missing on the original that I thought it time to start over. I told Chauncey to copy the 2003 Curt so that with the 559 X 29 mm (actual; labeled 32) Elk Pass wheels, the contact patches were in the same spots as when on the 2003; and that my body contacts were in exactly the same places on the saddle and bar and pedals as with the model; but to narrow the rear OL spacing to accommodate both a 114 mm OL Sturmey Archer AM hub and a 120 mm OL Surly fixed hub; to adjust rear triangle and fork so that the bike can accommodate 45 mm (actual) tires and fenders with at least 1 cm of gap; to add various braze ons to accommodate cantilever instead of caliper brakes, and to accommodate a quick release shifting system for the AM hub; to add provision for internal dynamo wire lighting (tho' just external loops on driveside of head tube, not wanting the hassle of running the wire inside the steerer); and custom f and r racks, with front lowriders removable but leaving the "arch" -- rack support/fender support -- in place. The "arch" and the rear rack are designed to accommodate the f and r light wires from the dynamo and headlight respectively.

I took several photos, but this is the best of the bike -- because taken by daughter -- tho' against a poor background.

While the bike has been designed for a fixed gear drivetrain (70"), with the AM wheel (66" direct, 74" overdrive, 57" underdrive) for occasional use, I find that the AM drivetrain is delightful: the gaps are just right.

All shifter bits except the trigger shifter can be removed quickly with no tools. The AM hub has OEM Sturmey Archer wingnuts and a QR indicator chain.

Possible developments in the future: Someone has offered me a TC 2-speed fixed gear hub, basically direct and an underdrive similar to that of the AM, so I could set it up with 74" direct and 64" underdrive. The TC like its more common TF sister is said to have less lash than other fixed hub gears, notably the S3X, which is notorious for lash. If I do get it, I will have it built into yet a 3d rear wheel for the bike.

The AM dates from 1956, but it has been rebuilt like the 1955 spare. The TC was made apparently from 1936 to 1941 and it too will be rebuilt with, I hope, NOS internals where needed, from England. Both AMs have aluminum shells, but the TC in mind has a chromed steel one, with patchy chrome -- no matter, because it's the insides I care about. All: 40 holes, built or to be built into 32-hole rims.

On Wed, Aug 12, 2020 at 7:55 PM Addison Quarles <bicycler...@gmail.com> wrote:

I must ask: a 41mm Pasela? How have I missed out on this? 700 x 41? Or is this another way of referring to the 26 x 1.75? 

Also, holy smokes do you have photos of this bike anywhere? This thing sounds wild!

[Patrick Moore]

Oh, and one more very big difference between the model and the image: the new copy is made from standard diameter, relatively thinwall 531 compared to the (in retrospect) excessively heavy tubing of the 2003 Riv, and the difference is very positively noticeable as this is yet one more of those delightful bikes that encourages one to choose a cog 1 tooth smaller. It' doesn't "bog down" when you come to an incline or turn into a headwind, as I had noticed over the years when comparing the 2003 with its even earlier 1999 Riv Joe Starck custom fixed gear gofast older sister, which also encourages 1 tooth smaller.

On Thu, Aug 13, 2020 at 8:55 AM Patrick Moore <bert...@gmail.com> wrote:

Fun facts: Bike was built to copy the 2003 Rivendell that I had had modified enough times for features missing on the original that I thought it time to start over.