friction mode on silver shifters and shimano down tube dura ace shifters slip!

[Sam Perez]

does any one know how to trouble shoot friction shifters that wont hold gears under hard effort, i have riv silver shifters and 9speed dura ace down tube shifters that slip on friction mode.

I have done the following only to have the lever loose grip after a few shifts. (lots of hills)

-tightened the bolt (done)     

-tightened the D ring (done)

-adjusted the rear  deralure (done) 

any thoughts?

[Cyclofiend Jim]

Check the cable routing, especially the ferrule fit. A minor movement between the cable and ferrule or the ferrule and a cable stop can sometimes cause this.
Double-check that there is not a "second" ferrule stuck in a stop somewhere (including the derailleur). 

If the bike was built up with too tight of a cable/housing run, that sometimes causes that.  

Too tight of an arc at the RD.
Derailleur not completely tightened/attached.
Bent derailleur hanger

Since it's happening on two different sets of shifters, the problem is likely in the cable run or derailleur. 
Also, you might make sure that the bike was built up with the proper type of housing - brake housing and derailleur housing are not the same. 

Hope that helps!

- Jim

[Bill Lindsay]

Yes, many good mechanics know how to trouble shoot friction shifters that wont hold gears under hard effort

My thoughts are that there is one of two things going on: Either you are never getting it tight enough, or it is loosening itself up.  

The reason you may not be able to get it tight enough is that the bolt that threads into the downtube shifter boss is bottoming out at the bottom of the threaded hole.  It feels tight in your hand, because it's bottoming out, but it's not actually squeezing the friction bits any harder.  To test this, tighten it to confirm whether it is possible to make it too-tight.  Can you tighten it to a point where the friction is clearly too firm?  If so, then this is not what is going on.  Alternatively remove the shifter entirely and install only the bolt and observe how far in you can thread it before it bottoms out.  See what that looks like and what it feels like.  If you determine the bolt is bottoming out, carefully file 0.5mm off the end and you should be good.  

If you can get it tight enough, and it transitions from 'tight enough' to 'not tight enough' over a few shifts, then the bolt is loosening itself.  Consider using a not-too-permanent threadlocker.  I'd start with blue Loctite.  Also decide if you have parts that don't fit well on the shifter boss that are free to wobble somewhat, and that wobbling helps auto-extract the bolt.  

If the judgement calls are difficult, find a good mechanic you trust to put their eyes on it.  One other contributor can be excessive friction on the cable at the BB.  Your hard efforts cause the cable to very slightly tighten and loosen as you flex the frame.  The friction between the cable and the housing or guides at the BB can 'win' in the tug-of-war with the shifter.  

The last thing is to question whether the return spring on your rear derailler is just too strong.  If you are using an RD that is clearly intended for index-only operation, or one with a known super-burly spring, you just may have a poor combo of parts.  

These are the things I'd go through if the bike(s) were in my stand

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito CA  

[Sam Perez]

On the silver shifter I have a Shimano xt rear derailleur and on the dura ace down tube I have a micro shift short cage deraliur. Hmm 🤔 I tightened it to the point it takes effort to shift so, looks like this could be frame flex/Rd shifter combo/ need of adjustible locktight.. 

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[Andreas]

As you state this occurs under hard efforts, it could be that this is due to a "soft" frame and has nothing to do with the shifting setup.

Andreas

[tuolumne bikes]

Are you absolutely sure the cable is slipping? Does it always move in the same direction? (Gets harder to pedal for traditional rear derailleur.) Never happens in index mode? Skipping on worn cogs with a newer chain can seem like a shifting problem especially if it's on the larger cogs and you're pedaling hard uphill. If the cassette is oldish, replacing it can narrow down the possibilities.

Carl

On Thursday, August 20, 2020 at 7:14:40 AM UTC-7 Sam Perez wrote:

[Sam Perez]

Oh I didn't think of that I'm only just now tinkering with more than just changing handle bars. I don't remember the last time I purchased a replacement. I remember I broke the chain 2 years ago and replaced it. 

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[Grady Wright]

I have had the same experience with my new silver shifters. They will not hold their position even when I tighten them to the point It's to difficult to shift. I am using an old M952 xtr derailleur.  They've even frayed and broken the shifter cable. I emailed them about it a couple time with no response but seems from the latest blog I believe that they are addressing at least the issue with it cutting the cable. Little disappointed as they are really nice looking shifters.