Paul Touring vs. Neo-retro question

[greenteadrinkers]

If you had to choose between the Paul Touring Canti or the Neo-Retro for a front brake, which would you pick and why?

Curious about how much functional difference exists between the 2 models.

Thanks,

Scott

[Jay Lonner]

I’ve used both, prefer the Tourings due to higher mechanical advantage. Now I run Motolites which are even better. Maybe I’m just bad at setting up cantis but switching to linear pull brakes was a big upgrade for me. 

Jay Lonner

Bellingham, WA

Sent from my Atari 400

On Jan 20, 2023, at 3:12 PM, greenteadrinkers <greentea...@gmail.com> wrote:

If you had to choose between the Paul Touring Canti or the Neo-Retro for a front brake, which would you pick and why?

Curious about how much functional difference exists between the 2 models.

Thanks,

Scott

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[J J]

Scott, I’ve used both, and as hard as I’ve tried to discern a functional difference, I honestly just couldn’t. They felt the same to me. Both felt great and had plenty of stopping force. I don’t know if this is because of they way each was set up and dialed in. But neither lacked anything. I don’t consider myself a super expert in setting up cantis, either. 

Function aside, I very much prefer how the wider profile Neo-Retros look over the Tourings. I love how the Neo-Retros look both old school and modern.

Jim

[J G]

I use the touring brake up front when I run them for mountain mountain bikes and loaded tourers due to higher mechanical advantage, as already mentioned.

I will often run the Neo-Retro up front with a Touring in the rear for Rando, light touring and city bikes where that is less important to me.  Good setup and good compassionless housing is what makes the difference for me in any brake and the Neo-Retros work just fine for me in many applications.

[Bob]

Scott,

I've used the Neo-Retro as a front brake for about ten years and have always had great luck with it. It looks great and, at the time, I was under the impression that the Neo-Retro was the more powerful brake—than the Touring Canti, that is. Paul's web page for the Neo-Retro used to warn that it's a powerful enough brake that one should make sure the frame could take the braking force, and maybe use the Touring Canti instead if one wasn't sure. I can no longer find that warning on the website. In any case, the Neo-Retro is powerful enough for me and relatively easy to adjust, and it's my first choice for a rim brake. (For some reason, likely user error/dimwittedness, I've never had luck with linear-pull brakes, but then I've never tried the Motolite.)

I chose the Touring Canti for the rear to maximize heel and pannier clearance. The combination works well for me, even with a full touring load going downhill.

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Bob

[J G]

Bob,

My understanding is that this is one of the cases where the physics of brake design and how they interact with the setup as related to yoke angle in this case, creates confusion because it is not just the brake design that has to be considered, but also the yoke angle's part in overall mechanical advantage.  Each brake type allows for very different yoke angles and that is why overall a touring brake has the capability to be setup with more power, if done correctly and with that purpose in mind.

I think this article is a good one on the topic as it is actually on canti geometry:

https://www.velonews.com/gear/technical-faq-with-lennard-zinn-a-detailed-look-at-brake-shudder/

And here is the associated Sheldon page:

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cantilever-geometry.html

[Bob]

I was familiar with the Sheldon page, but not the Zinn piece. Nice to have an explanation for the old Neo-Retro warning. Thanks for the reference.

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Bob

[greenteadrinkers]

Thank you all for the feedback, very helpful!

Scott