Racks & Baskets - weight on the front...

[Philip Barrett]

...or the rear?

Discuss.

[dougP]

On my Atlantis, I always have a handlebar bag.  When I use panniers, the fronts are always used, and the rears only when needing to carry a camping load.  After much experimentation, I've come to the conclusion that for me & my bike, when using 4 bags, 60% front load & 40% rear gave best handling.  Others probably have different preferences. 

dougP

On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 7:50:37 PM UTC-7 philipr...@gmail.com wrote:

...or the rear?

Discuss.

[Garth]

Considering gravity is at best theoretical, so are it's associated calculations. So I'd say adorn the bike any way you wish, whatever the "inner light" reveals. We all have an unfiltered and unquestionable inherent sense of that.  

[Philip Barrett]

Unfortunately throwing money at it until I'm happy doesn't sit as well with my inner light!

[E. Ricky Creek]

I've been toying with this for a few weeks: 

https://www.amazon.com/Wald-Rear-Medium-Basket-13-5X6-25X11/dp/B001EL7P34?th=1

I see folks piling ridiculous amounts of junk on baskets and strapped to saddlebags because panniers aren't "cool" anymore. Why not start your own new style of basket pannier packing. If it takes off, I'm sure a new cottage industry of makers will sell custom Wald 520 bags to go in the baskets (thus become panniers again), available in any waxed canvas color you want. I'm joking, of course.  

(I'm not joking about the Wald pannier baskets on my Clem...)

[Philip Barrett]

Funny you should say that but I was thinking the Wald folding basket would be interesting particularly as I'm sure you could come up with an easy mount/dismount system with a trip to the local Ace Hardware. Certainly not boutique PNW custom pricing either.

https://www.amazon.com/Wald-Folding-Rear-Bicycle-Basket/dp/B0012DVQVQ?th=1

[Joseph Willms]

One last consideration may be the WB Loader bag.  It's a decent price point compared to something like a sugar loaf and though the pictures don't show it, it has 4 velcro straps on the front and back and two clips on the sides once the bag is rolled down to use for attaching it to a 137.  Just got mine last week for my Hillborne and couldn't be happier.  It also has a padded bottom.  See here: https://www.sim.works/collections/ral/products/ral-wb-loader?variant=31467798659124. 

Joe

[Philip Barrett]

I have a Linus sac which is nice heavy canvas & can clip pannier-style to a rack or be used with a basket -

https://www.linusbike.com/products/the-sac

[Pat Smith]

I too have the RAL WB Loader. It's ok. Hardware is cheap plastic and the velcro closure seems a bit weird, but maybe just because I don't usually have mine stuffed. I think Carsick Designs and some others make a similar style tote 137 bag that I'd probably look at if I were buying again.

Pat in DC

[Shoji Takahashi]

I've thrown lots of money at this problem over the years... given this list, I think many others have, too.

Unfortunately, there's a lot of personal preference, variety of needs among different people, types of bikes, etc. Also, for me and others, there's the desire to experiment. I think the first set-up that I had was fine... and so have been the other iterations. 

What are you carrying generally? Terrain? Risk of theft? Bike? 

My first set-up was a Breezer Uptown 8, which included a rear rack with rat-trap. I started as a commuter and decided not to-use a backpack. I got the Wald 582 folding rear basket for one side and zip-tied it on. It held my work bag fine. I could use the rat-trap for smaller items when necessary. It was great. 

My current commuter is AHH. It has a Saddlesack medium and Wald 137 front basket. It's great. I generally put items in the saddlesack since it's big and protected, and AHH rides better (for me) with rear loads. Front basket is perfect for light items and overflow when grocery getting. 

I've been tempted to try Ron's Fabio's chest, but I know it'll be fine, as have been my other choices.

Choosing now, after having experience with many choices, I would go with a Saddlesack, particularly a Riv frame. This is based on style, function, how I'd mostly use it, value. If you're tall enough and don't need a rack under it, even better value.  

YMMV,

Good luck!

shoji

Arlington MA

[Bill Lindsay]

What kind of weight?

Normal riding weight:  Front

Touring s240 wieght:   Front first, overflow in back

Grocery weight:  No opinion.  I don't buy groceries on my bike

Errand weight:  Front

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

[Patrick Moore]

The problem I had with both the folding and non-folding wire baskets was that they are too narrow for a standard paper grocery sack; not that paper is used much any more. Still, a couple of inches wider would make them much more usable, even for stuffed-full plastic or cloth bags.

Me, I much prefer panniers on a good rack, which you can add or remove, or switch among different sizes, at need. And IMO, they look much better than bulky wire baskets, and weigh less when unladen.

[Roberta]

I have two of those in black (which disappeared into my black rack and tires), used them for years for grocery shopping and they were fantastic.  Always with me, but out of the way when not needed. 

[Jim Whorton]

Those Wald rear baskets are great--I use one for grocery shopping routinely.  I have the larger version, the Wald 535 (18 inches long).  It is very sturdy--no problem loading it with cans, milk cartons, etc and you can strap a big bag of dog food or whatever over the top.  I have a set of the Wald folding baskets too, but they are much flimsier than the non-folding kind, and they rattle.

It is true that these rear baskets do not match the shape of an ordinary grocery bag (paper sack, or the reusable kind).  Takes a little repacking at the bike rack.

At one point I had this rear basket on my 59cm Clem H.  It didn't work--for some reason it created a bad shudder in the fork.  But it works fine on this old Peugeot.  And, getting back to the original question: on this bike I always load the rear first, and only put light things in the front basket.  Handling gets weird if there is much weight up front:

Jim Whorton in Rochester, NY

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 8:16:16 AM UTC-4 philipr...@gmail.com wrote:

[Philip Barrett]

For those liking the folding rears these look interesting?

https://www.amazon.com/Bushwhacker-Omaha-Bicycle-Grocery-Accessories/dp/B00B4ZKZK0/ref=sr_1_18?dchild=1&keywords=BUSHWHACKER+USA&qid=1617729448&sr=8-18

[Justin Drake]

TLDR: Over time I've moved more weight forward and lower and experienced better handling. 

Many years ago I would use dual rear panniers. That worked fine, but after I started to move weight to the front I realized a heavy rear load really affected the handling of most bikes. With a heavy rear load you cant toss the bike side-to-side when making an out-of-the-saddle effort. Maybe it's the long lever of the weight far back, but I feel like a bike is much more stable with a balanced (front AND rear) load. I also think the rear wheel already has the most stress when unloaded and adding extra weight in panniers and a rear rack only increases the burden on the wheel and tire. 

Over time I have added more and more weight to the front of my bikes. Started with a giant Wald 157 delivery basket on the front of a Schwinn Speedster 3-speed with the collapsible wire Wald baskets on the back. That bike had very stable handling and with steel wheels and a heavy steel frame it could take a heavy load front and rear well. Ginormous grocery runs. 

I've moved to lighter bikes and lighter/smaller bags and baskets. A great option for commuting was a 137 up front and a Carradice or Bags by Bird large saddle bag in the back. Balanced loads if a little top heavy. My most recent commuting setup is a Soma Lucas rack in the front with dual Jandd mini-mountain panniers on a Soma San Marcos with Albatross bars. This is a wonderful set up for commuting and I have found that I can load the panniers with way more weight with less effect on the handling than a Wald basket and saddle bag. The rear has no weight. 

My bikepacking bike has a Bags by Bird large on the front supported by a Lucas rack. Putting the weight between my hands is much more stable than if the weight was off the back of the bike. I add my light sleeping bag and warm clothes in a dry bag strapped to a aluminum rear rack. 

Justin in Sacratomato 

[esoterica etc]

Hey Justin, I like the sound of your setup on the Soma, would love to see some pics! Cheers,

~Mark 

Raleigh, NC

On Apr 12, 2021, at 15:19, Justin Drake <justin....@gmail.com> wrote:

TLDR: Over time I've moved more weight forward and lower and experienced better handling. 

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[Justin Drake]

 Per Mark's request - 

Justin, Grazing in the Grass, Cali

[esoterica etc]

Justin, thanks for posting a pic, your San Marcos looks ready for an adventure! 

How much of an influence do you think the double top tube has on the stability of your front load vs. a rear load? Thanks,

~Mark 

Raleigh, NC

On Apr 14, 2021, at 16:09, Justin Drake <justin....@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Justin Drake]

Hi Mark - I cant really tell a difference of the double top tube as there are so many variables that keep changing from bike to bike. Overall, the Soma has similar handling to the Hillbourne I have, but the Soma does feel lighter and just a little more agile. 

As far as front v. back: I like having heavier things on front as the bars help me control that weight and when out of the saddle there is less of an impact on handling. I assume the double top tube would make either front or back weight more stable, but really cant say there is a difference based on my experience. 

This one mostly adventures to and from the office, but does yearn for the open road. 

Justin in NorCal

[Clark Fitzgerald]

My experience is similar to Shoji's. I've tried so many different things, and most work fine in most conditions. I like the front basket and saddlebag for riding mild singletrack.

On my Atlantis I've been riding more S24O's involving singletrack, which is different from riding on the open road. Panniers would get hung up on rocks in this terrain, particularly lowrider panniers. I've been carrying a light load, maybe 10-15 pounds, balanced between the front basket and large rear saddlebag. The front load helps with steep dirt climbing, as my front end doesn't wander all over the place like with a rear load. My bike handles more precisely when the front load is strapped tight to a stiff rack. 

I use a long tail cargo bike to carry heavy stuff. It's on another level, and I roll with close to the max 400 lbs rider + bike + passengers + cargo weight regularly.

[Thomas Lawn]

I strongly prefer weight on the front, but when rear racks all follow pretty much the same design and can be had for less than $50, it's hard to argue with it from a utility standpoint. My Clem that I share with my partner has a standard (albeit silver) rear rack and a Velo Orange front rack with the standard wald basket attached. I usually toss an LL Bean tote bag in there with my stuff, and use a Carradice bag off the back for carrying extra clothing, flat kit, pump, etc.

My favorite setup is a front rack with a basket platform and lowriders, like the Velo Orange or Nitto campeur style racks. Nothing beats a big pannier full of produce mounted right near the front hub for adding stability to the bike. And, at $200-350, fancy front racks like this are worth outfitting 4-6 bikes with standard rear racks!

[Nick Payne]

I've carried as much as possible on the front for decades. Here's our tandem during a three week tour of Tasmania about 35 years ago - nothing on the rear rack at all except for a couple of pairs of sandals; home-made handlebar bag; large home-made panniers on a Bruce Gordon lowrider front rack:

And here's my own touring bike in Switzerland a few years ago - Ortlieb handlebar bag; Ortlieb panniers on a Tubus Tara rack. The Carradice saddlebag carries bulky lightweight items such as raincoats and warm clothing which we might need to take on or off during the day's ride:

Nick Payne