PSA: Watch our for scammers in the group

[Johnny Alien]

Just as a PSA, I have had no prior issues with getting contacted on this group so wanted to let everyone know that it can and does happen even in trusted groups. I had posted interested in a blue lug bucket hat (Still looking if anyone has one) and was contacted by someone that said they not only had a new one but that they were close and could drop it off. It turns out that it was not an actual member and they don't have a hat either. It turned into requests for more money to help them in a bad situation. It wasn't a ton of money but just a reminder to always verify as much information as possible.

(Note that the title makes it sound like members here are scamming which I don't think is true its just people using the group to pull off scams)

[Peter Adler]

Is this group readable by non-members? I know that Google Groups has settings that allow an administrator to block reading to anyone who's not an authorized member, or at least such settings used to exist; the Classic Rendezvous group uses them. They may be a holdover from some older era of group settings.

There are obviously drawbacks from locking the group off from outside observers, mostly that you'll get fewer new members if you don't offer a free taste. But it would cut down on email harvesting.

Peter "eternally vigilant, and not at all paranoid, no no no" Adler

Berkeley, CA/USA

[Eric Marth]

Peter — This RBW group and all posts are visible to people who are not members. Individuals' email addresses are hidden by Groups when posting. However, if a poster includes their email address in the text of their message it remains visible. 

In my experience iBOB and the CR groups are not visible unless you're a member. 

When I receive emails about items that I've listed for sale from names I don't recognize the first thing I do is search their email address in the forum. If they haven't posted or shared to the group I often ignore the request. 

[Conway Bennett]

Yes, lots of lurkers here.  I recently have had issues with questionable PayPal payments and having unknown quantities ask a bunch of questions about FS: items then disappear.  I actually prefer just selling on eBay now because of the grief associated with the list.

[Johnny Alien]

I was aware that anyone could view the forums but I (wrongly) assumed that only members could post or message other members.

[Ryan]

I thought you had to be vetted by Cyclofiend Jim,who I assume still administers this list, before you could post.

If I just browse this list without signing on to it with my Google account, I cannot see anyone's profile with their email. If I sign on to post, I can see email addresses...however, that's not to say this security feature can't be compromised, unfortunately.And, as Eric points out, if  someone embeds their email address within the text of their post, anyone can see it.

Probably just reiterating what Eric said.

[Joe Bernard]

For the record I've never had this problem and I've sold a ton of stuff here over the years. I try to describe my parts and pricing clearly and post photos, I'll get a couple questions - usually them trying to work out if the item will fit their use case well - and it sells or they bow out. Not much grief for me from the list. 

Joe Bernard 

[Joe Mullins]

I’ve never had problems with members here but I have been reached out by names I don’t recognize. Usually they just ended up never responding. I think they fell under the lurker/non-participant category and not the unknown scammer category. 

I’m a member of another forum that is HUGE. Too big for it to be enjoyable sometimes. But on that forum they have what’s called a “Good Trader” thread and it’s a thread where folks can post about positive experiences with other folks they done transactions with. Maybe we can start one of those…

It’s disheartening to hear that scammers have found their way here but a quick search on past posts is enough to put my mind at ease when dealing with sellers or buyers. 

Joe in Los Angeles

[J J]

I sold the Blue Lug bucket hat to a list member, and was sorry to hear you were subjected to that, Johnny.

I’ve bought and sold a decent number of items since I’ve been hanging out here and I've never had any problems either way. Nothing even hinted of a scam attempt.

I try to err on the side of giving too much info about the stuff I sell. There should be no surprises for a buyer. I’ve found folks buying and selling through this forum super friendly, civil, and laid back. I’ve struck up some very nice correspondences and phone chats with like-minded bike and Rivendell nerds. It was clear folks were genuinely interested in the items.

(An aside: I was surprised by the volume of email I got about the Blue Lug hat. Who knew it was such a hot item? Too bad it was just a tad small for my head!)

[Patrick Moore]

I'm surprised at this, having bought and sold many times on this list (and even much more on the Boblist) with no problems I can remember except 2 or 3 instances of excited people piping up ME! ME! ME! upon a FS announcement and then never replying to your email replies.

Conway, can you elaborate on the grief? Just invalid paypal payments?

Others, can you describe your bad experiences of selling and buying onlist?

[chintan jadwani]

I only recently started building my bike with some thought and forum discussions of this group showed up in my Google search. I decided to join after reading some relevant discussions and the FS email chains gave me some confidence to buy directly from the members.

I've made only one purchase "attempt", which failed because after I made the payment the seller told me that it was not according to the terms and after a couple of messages to redo the transaction, stopped responding. This was a weird experience because I'd made a payment and still was accused of being a scammer. Anyway, I tried to be nice, to at least get a refund from the payment company - but got no response. Can't completely blame the seller, must have had bad experiences. I've made a couple of purchases from the bob group without any hassles and am confident future purchases will be positive here too :)

Chintan

[Cyclofiend Jim]

On Monday, April 10, 2023 at 5:29:03 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

I was aware that anyone could view the forums but I (wrongly) assumed that only members could post or message other members

Specific to this comment:
- This is a publicly viewable group
- Non-members cannot post
- All new members are moderated (and believe me, not all move past that point...)
- If you post contact information in your post, it will be viewable.

 

[Cyclofiend Jim]

In the more general sense, I have not received any feedback from active members that this was an issue.
It strikes me as part of the due diligence of anyone selling or buying on any internet-based group to confirm that someone is who they say they are.

From the description of this particular problem, it doesn't seem like there's a reasonable fix. We can't guard against everyone on the internet scraping contact info. If someone off-list contacts you, I'd be wary. But that's just good internet hygiene.

Just to be clear - I do not "vet" people on this list. I ask that they take the time to reach out and ask to be unmoderated. That seems to self-select those who would just want to sell something and leave. 

Honestly, in recent I've been tightening up which FS posts I let through. Riv bikes and Nitto and RBW-sold items, sure. But piles of generic road components? Yeah...no... Or the person who was trying to sell a C'dale FS MTB? No...no. 

For those who have been here a while with full posting permission, I have no interest in policing what is getting bought and sold. it is my belief that the more the total number of threads skew towards buy/sell, the less of an asset this group becomes. I also realize that many appreciate that aspect of this group.

Locking this thread. 

Be well, go ride!

Jim 

/admin