If you convince Rivendell to bring back "one" former model

[Mackenzy Albright]

All these threads about "choosing the one Riv" or "how do I pick which model" got me thinking. If you could convince Rivendell to resurrect one out of production model....which would you choose? 

After acquiring a Clementine after a new Clem Smith Jr, I see merit of the geometry of the Clementine as a standalone step through that feels like a long wheelbase agile bike rather than a floaty surfboard. I absolutely adore both-but they're extraordinarily different, despite being a natural and logical evolution. I really enjoyed the reference of the thread "a tale of two clems" by Ding Ding! as I found similarities in my experience. 

The evolution of Rivendell's is absolutely fascinating to me as there has never been a hang up for changing tried and true models. XO-1 - ALL Rounder - TOYO Atlantis - MUSA Atlantis - MIT Atlantis. People are still obsessive with each rendition of a concept over its evolution. 

SOoo long story short. I would choose the Hunqapillar. Hands down. 

[Scott Luly]

I vote long stay version of Glorious and Hunqapillar in CLEAR COAT...

I hope Grant is listening

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[Drew Henson]

legolas OR a more classically styled country bike with close to level top tube and shorter chain stays

[Johnny Alien]

I have loads of favorites but honestly most of them are covered with a current variation.

[Slin]

This never made it to be an official model, but I would love to have the Riv Kids bike back.

[Jack Doran]

My Hunqapillar is the favorite in the stable, but I think a case can really be made to bring back the Bleriot. Classic geometry, MIT (I believe) to keep the price reasonable, and I'd argue that the decal is the best Riv has done. 

[Chris Fly]

hands down, a Legolas.. ideally a Taiwan-made frame to save a little coin..

I just picked up a new-to-me Rambouillet, so I'm covered there for now.. :) 

[Bill Fulford]

Bombadil, no question.

[Garth]

The only one that fit me was the Bombadil, so the Bomba it would be. The parallel TT ones, but frankly it doesn't need it. It does make for a lift though, and being a straight gauge tube I can clamp it there to my Feedback workstand. I wouldn't pay more than $1700 for it though, not the over inflated 3k it ended up being when it went full diagonal extra tubes. All those extra tubes were unnecessary in real world riding though. 

This said, I'm pretty sure anyone can contact Grant about having a previous model made custom for not quite custom fee. It's not as if the blueprints, the form, vanishes. So there really is no need to bring back models as those models haven't gone anywhere. Consider them "off the menu" , formerly "on the menu" models.  

[Joel S]

Saluki as it started the 650b Rivendell excursion.  Also the Yves Gomez as I never had a chance to get one.  The AR should get honorable mention.  

[Jason Zakaras]

Another vote for the Bombadil.  Just to add content around a one off production from Riv, I spoke to the good folks at Rivendell a bit this year and they are not doing any customs or special orders currently, I wanted a 56cm Bombadil, they said maaaaaybe next year (like fall 2023) if at all.  Perhaps others have a better tie in there, but for me, I'm stuck waiting and watching for someone to grace me with my favorite bike and LOTR name of all time.

[Brian Turner]

I'm guessing they would need to call them something else if they made any more Bombadils or Legolases. I'm still wondering how they are able to get around still using "Sackville" if they've had to cease with the Tolkien monikers.

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[Edwin W]

Original Atlantis!

Not too long chainstays so it fits places better.

Single top tube.

26" wheels for all (I know that is not original).

Edwin

[Nick Payne]

On Friday, 9 December 2022 at 10:12:54 am UTC+11 jackd...@gmail.com wrote:

My Hunqapillar is the favorite in the stable, but I think a case can really be made to bring back the Bleriot. Classic geometry, MIT (I believe) to keep the price reasonable, and I'd argue that the decal is the best Riv has done.

Ditto on the Bleriot. Mine is the favourite of the Rivendell's I have. The frames were built by Maxway, I believe. I notice when browsing their website that they now offer stainless steel touring frames, in both disc and cantilever brake versions:

https://www.maxway-cycles.com/Y15T01-700C-Touring-Frame.html

https://www.maxway-cycles.com/Y13R02-StainlessSteel-Touring-Frame.html

Nick

[Joe Bernard]

Indeed, I suspect I may have one of the last customs Rivendell assigned to Mark Nobilette. They're not taking orders currently and I'm not sure Grant sees any point in getting back into that game, he has enough on his plate just getting production models out there to everybody who wants one. 

My answer for a revived frame is uhhhhh I don't have one. Said custom has all the current Riv philosophies built into it - long front center, high headtube, low step-over, long stays - and I don't have a particular affinity for the older styles. If I was looking for a production Riv now I'd want what they sell now, they work! 

Joe Bernard 

[Eric Marth]

I've noticed a fair bit of interest in Bombadil and Hunqapillar frames over the last few years. The frames certainly seem to sell on the used market for quite a lot, compared to other Rivendell frames. 

Can someone give me a quick run-down of these bikes and what their intended purposes were? How do they differ from the more robust Riv mainstays like the Atlantis & Appaloosa? 

Cheers my dears

[Joe Bernard]

Hunqapillar was the cheaper Bombadil after that MUSA frame got crazy pricey, they were both stouter/more geared to rough-trail riding than Atlantis and Appaloosa.* The updated models would be Gus and Susie, plus the now retired Clem H. 

*Of course it can be argued that the Atlantis/Appaloosa touring bikes are sufficiently stout as trail bikes. 

[J J]

Eric, here's a rundown — it's not a quick one but it is thorough and interesting :)  Joe, your asterisked point is apropos. The Toyo Atlantis I've been riding lately does not feel like it is lacking stoutness at all.

So I looked up the actual Hunqapillar copy from April 28, 2011 that was on Riv's site. It's slightly different from the info in the Hunqapillar brochure! As with everything Rivendell, specs and info are subject to change without warning — and they did. I attached the copy here as a PDF, but the first few grafs from April 28, 2011 are telling. This is when the Hunq frame, fork, and headset cost $1,500.

• It's a stout touring-trail bike, somewhere between an Atlantis and a Bombadil. It has Bomba-stout tubing --- about 0.1mm thicker in the main tubes than the Atlantis tubing.  But like the Atlantis, the Hunqapillar has either 26-inch or 700c wheels, depending on the frame size (48cm-51/26; 54-58-62/700C). Geometry here.
• Again Bombadil-like, it has an expanded frame, meaning the listed size truly is the length of the seat tube, and then from that point the top tube slopes up six degrees. This increases the standover height (compared to a top tube that's level or slopes up less), and that's why you ride about 3 to 6cm smaller than you would, say, a Surly or Masi. And as long as you buy down a few centimeters, you'll have the standover clearance you like. 
  
• The Hunqapillar frame is an interesting mix of materials and co-conspirators. It's made in Taiwan by a team of builders trained by Tetsu Ishigaki, of Toyo. The main tubes are the most expensive steel tubing we could find anywhere --- Japanese Kaisei 8630 heat-treated. The seat and chainstays are excellent Taiwan CrMo. The fork is made in Japan by Tetsu Ishigaki at Toyo.
  
• Note: 58 + 62cm Hunqapillars have been built with both 26.8 and 27.2 inner seat tube dimensions. If you are buying a frame-only from us, check with us before buying/using a seat-post from someone else, and we'll let you know which one works for your frame. 
  

It was pitched as a "budgetated" version of the Bombadil (see below), for loaded touring on any surface, and for riding with any kind of handlebar. This info above was from when the Hunq was being produced in Taiwan. It wasn't long thereafter that Hunq production moved to Waterford and its standard colors changed from dark grey and kidney bean (which inspired your beautiful bike, right Joe?) to the green and cream Hunq that I have ("Jay's green"). For reasons I won't get into right now, I was watching this movement happen in real time because I had one of the grey Taiwan models before I got the green Waterford model. This switch from Taiwan to Waterford happened late 2011 to early 2012. The price went up $375, too. 

Now the following is from October 6, 2012. At this point it was listed as being made both in Taiwan and Wisconsin, but the price was $1,875. It no longer mentioned tube thickness.

• Hunqapillar
• New color! Green with cream details/decals. More, better, photos on the Hunqaflikr.
• History. Concept. Etc.
  
• Our most extravagant, screw-the-expense bike is the off-roady Bombadil, and the Hunqapillar is a budgetated version of that bike—only slightly short-cutted to make it a lot more affordable and barely less heavy duty than it’s much more expensive big brother. But still—the Hunqapillar is extremely labor-intensive bike by any standards, you pay more for it than you will for a welded bike. (Not a jab at welded bikes, just a fact.)
  
• Like all of our bikes, the Hunqapillar is hand-made of fine, lugged steel, and uses our own quite expensive and fine investment-cast fittings.

• The Hunqapillar is a touring bike—for road or trail.
  
• The riding position, clearance for fat tires and fenders, and braze-ons make the Hunqapillar ready for touring on any surface and in any weather. You won’t find a better touring bike. Some may have disc brakes or suspension or other features of debatable worth, but the Hunqapillar, without them, is our idea of perfect. 

• And it's a trail bike.
  
• The tubes are stout, but reasonable in weight, and the strong lugged joints should last or decades. There’s clearance for 58mm tires. If you need fatter than that, get a Pugsley. 
  
• Trivia: Former employee Daniel rode a proto-Hunqapillar the entire 2700-miles of the Great Divide trail. No problem. The current ones are vast improvements over that.

• And it’s an all-‘rounder, too.
  
• You could argue that it’s overkill (strengthwise) for unloaded day rides or general use, but the argument against that argument is even better: The engine (you) still comprises by far the largest percentage of weight on a ready-to-go bicycle, and most adult humans on Earth are better served by losing two to four pounds off the engine—which won’t weaken it— than by taking it off the bike, which will absolutely weaken it. The Huqnapillar is lean but strong.

• Meet the Diagatube.
  
• It’s the obvious oddball tube on the 58cm and larger Hunqapillars, and it strengthens and stiffens the frame by reestablishing the triangulation lost by the taller head tubes. The weight “penalty” is only 8oz or so—too little even raise an eyebrow over, considering the strength and load-carrying capability of the Hunqapillar. An extra tube is proven technology in Third World countries where bikes are bad and the loads carried are heavy. Bikes without them don’t last.  The Hunqapillar has just adopted the same idea, but on a really fine bike.
  
• The 54cm and smaller Hunqapillars don’t have room for the diagatube. They have enough triangulation already, and don’t need it.
  

By April 2014, the price jumped again to $2,000 and it was listed as being made in the USA only, and made to order only, i.e., not as a standard production bike. By July 4, 2017 the price climbed to $2,350. I could not find any Hunqapillar info beyond that.

I found all this using the Web archive. Fun stuff! The glamor shot below is from Rivendell.

[Joe Bernard]

Correct, my custom is a brightened up version of the grey/kidney bean which was originally the custom paint on Mark @ Riv's cyclocrosser before it landed on Hunqapillar. Interestingly (to me!) the dove grey I ended up with was the same color (without red) on his FIRST cyclocrosser. I used to be able to find pics of his bikes on the webs but they've disappeared now. 

[Eric Marth]

Thanks for the info, Jim. Now I wish I'd started a new thread rather than occasioning academic thread drift! 

[brendonoid]

I always desperately wanted 58cm Hunqapillar, but the Appaloosa came out with superior Geo and I could never justify the gamble of buying a second hand bike in another country.

If I could bring back a model it would be the Suluki. I want an fat tyred road bike, dang it.

[Andrew Turner]

The original Atlantis was Riv summed up for me. It's a selfish request but boy did it look good with shorter chainstays.