Hawk Troubleshooting

457 views
Skip to first unread message

Jeff Eggers

unread,
Mar 3, 2026, 8:35:20 AMMar 3
to RAS_Prime
I’m flying an ASW-24B with an LX9000/V8 configuration, which has Hawk enabled.

I’ve never been successful in getting Hawk configured to the point I feel it is useful and working, so I’m looking for someone with familiarity on how to set it up and use it effectively.  If anyone is willing to consult with me on how to try some things, I’d be grateful.  I’ve consulted with LXNAV and done AHRS alignments, firmware updates, plumbing leak checks, etc.  

And FWIW, here is my current Hawk profile and plumbing configurations:

·      Setup>Vario Parameters>Hawk Enabled = Yes

·      Setup>Vario Parameters>Hawk Wind Variance Settings = .07, 30, 10


·      Setup>Sounds>Audio>Vario Audio Source = Hawk

·      Setup>Sounds>Audio>SC Audio Source = Hawk


·      Graphics>Glider and Track>Path Style = Hawk Netto


·      Graphics>Thermal Mode>Enabled=Yes

·      Graphics>Thermal Mode>Color Circles By=Hawk Netto


·      Hardware>Vario>Vario Needle=Vario

·      Hardware>Vario>SC Needle=Netto

·      Hardware>Vario>Needles=Vario&Hawk


·      Hardware>V80>TE Compensation = 100% (Electronic)


·      V8 TE and static ports are t-connected to Probe Static Pressure

·      V8 pitot port is t-connected with airspeed to Probe Pitot Pressure 


Thanks, 
Jeff

Jeff Stetson

unread,
Mar 3, 2026, 2:38:45 PMMar 3
to RAS_Prime
Jeff,

I went through considerable experimentation with the X-100/HAWK setup installed in my Ximango 1 1/2 years ago. Though I will continue to fiddle, it's working quite well for me now, IMO. I'll share some observations as a personal experience, not as a resident expert on the device and some may only apply to my very-mediocre performing motor glider.

1) Try hooking up and referencing to the usual total energy probe. Using the electronic compensation, I was never able to convince myself it was working correctly or how to set the percentage of compensation. Comparing with my good old B-40, the vario response of the S100 on TEK was identical; with electronic, it was not. 

2) Presumably the goal of the leveling procedure is to establish a "zero" for in flight use. The install procedure is to use the weight & balance level as an equivalent. With my ship, I found this not to be the same. While on the ground in the W&B reference position, I closed and latched the canopy, picked a nice spot repeatable spot on the frame that I could also see from the inside, and took a reading with an electronic level. (A phone app isn't stable enough, and the cheap rattly ones don't work in turbulence. The 
Klein Tools 935AG worked well.) In the W&B level, this gave me 2 degrees nose down measured on my canopy rail reference. Previous flight testing showed me at a minimum of - 3 degrees, ranging to -5 degrees at best L/D. I zeroed HAWK for -3.5 degrees, about equivalent to min sink speed. (I think zeroing at a faster speed equivalent might work better - but it's a massive (literally) project to set up a big heavy ship for that again).

3) My ship is 21 years old (yours, older). Even making the big assumption that the advertised polar while new was correct, it's unlikely to be as good now, unless the wings have been re-profiled, etc, etc. If HAWK thinks that your performance is better than it can be, it's going to exaggerate. With a rare bird, it's hard to find accurate data, but I guessed at a crappier polar, entered that, and went through a whole process of measurement (a rather clever one, actually) to confirm. (Remember, polar goes with TAS, not IAS!). You might try knocking your reference polar down by a significant amount for starters. HAWK seemed to exaggerate less after I redid mine. The sink rate in the range of thermally speeds is at least 20% worse ... sadly.

4) HAWK assumes perfect flight technique, which I'm lacking. Likely tooBut still, it's smooth math and doesn't consider necessary imperfections like having to hold opposite aileron to prevent overbanking or a slight inward slip most of us do to minimize that. It will thus always be somewhat optimistic, and more noticeably so in weak conditions. But I do find it super useful in flight, preventing turning in to foolers and the associated painful altitude loss.

DM me if you wish to phone chat.

-J  

Greg Arnold

unread,
Mar 3, 2026, 3:03:45 PMMar 3
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
Anyone know if the Stefly Larus with Dual GPS is any easier to set up than the Hawk?


--
Thanks for using RAS_Prime!
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RAS_Prime" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rasprime+u...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rasprime/401f6429-e568-40d4-8650-028bacb68d4an%40googlegroups.com.

Richard Pfiffner

unread,
Mar 3, 2026, 8:44:08 PMMar 3
to RAS_Prime
Check that you have no leaks in the Pitot.  I had one where a there was a pitot leak and it made things unusable.
.07 to .11,  30, 10

Richard

Peter Scholz

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 4:17:54 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
Jeff,

I would suggest to change at least the Vario Audio Source to TEK. I did that after I found out that the Hawk Vario seems to be too optimistic in most circling situations, esp. weak thermals. This was confirmed by the developers when I talked to them about this. Has to to with banking. 
--
Peter AB

Am 03.03.26 um 14:35 schrieb Jeff Eggers:
--
Thanks for using RAS_Prime!
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RAS_Prime" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rasprime+u...@googlegroups.com.

Jacques Graells

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 5:32:05 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com

That is also what I noticed.

I am flying straight looking for the core of the thermal in raising air and when I bank Hawk sound goes up even if there is no increase of lift.

That gives a false indication of turning into the core when I am actually not. It has probably something to do with how they calculate the airmass movement substracting the circling polar to the lift/sink.

It is a shame that the lift indicated by the Hawk is wrong and there is that issue with the banking, else it would have been an awesome vario. Very nice and effective filtering of horizontal gusts, ultra fast response still cutting the noise, very good filtering in rough thermals. Maybe one day they’ll fix the software but it seems there has not been significant changes to the Hawk part for a while.

Jacques

Jeff Eggers

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 5:38:42 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
Thanks, Peter.

LXNAV actually suggested the same thing: use TEK for vario audio source.

But if Hawk isn’t to be used for vario audio, which is the primary way most of us receive vario information, is Hawk really then just for cruise mode and wind calculations?  

Thanks,
Jeff


Message has been deleted

Gordon Wingate

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 6:50:24 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
I've been flying with Hawk for a year and experimented a lot. My evolving technique is not using one or the other but both, plus the averager and altimeter, and my eyes and ears.

My V8 is set to use the TE red needle for audio in the thermal but I refer to the Hawk blue needle at the same time. I've found that they compliment each other but neither one is best by itself. In a broken thermal the Hawk helps me find where the center is. I see it as an enhancement for my gluteal accelerometer, taking that analog sensory input and converting it to a digital one. It generally confirms my feel of the thermal. Hawk is useful in a gusty broken thermal when I'm not confident I'm feeling the many gusts properly. 

But just being in lift doesn't mean the glider is going up so the red needle and the 20 second VarA averager together tell me that. The TE needle gets confused when encountering shear winds surrounding a rising thermal, often calling them a gain or loss of energy when they are not. Hawk is reporting the sensations of how the airmass is moving the glider. The speed changes and sound of the air outside tell me even more about where the edges of the thermal are. The averager and altimeter tell me if I'm actually going up and how fast, which at the end of the day is all I care about. By watching these I can tell which vario needle reflects the current situation the best and keep more of my attention on that one for that climb. Next climb could be very different, of course, even on the same day.

Gordon

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rasprime/AF01819D-7BEB-4207-9926-AA3EB76A088A%40gmail.com.

Peter Scholz

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 7:12:01 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
Yes:
  • It gives you (much) better wind information esp. in mountain areas, where predicting the wind in a specific situation e.g. near terrain is difficult. 
  • When cruising at higher speed, it gives you (almost) instant information about thermals, without the latency of a pure pressure-based system with TEK input.

-
Peter AB


Am 05.03.26 um 11:38 schrieb Jeff Eggers:

Gordon Wingate

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 7:23:07 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
I've got a little over 100 hrs using Hawk and I've not used it in cruise yet. I can't wait to try this.

Gordon

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rasprime/d45171d4-9e43-4ea7-9665-d68f2d824704%40softservice-computer.de.

SoaringXX

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 8:45:56 AMMar 5
to RAS_Prime

Hi Jeff,

Toni here – I handle Sales & Marketing at LXNAV, and I’m also an active competition pilot.

Personally, I use HAWK for:

  • Filtering out wind gusts (no more false turns)

  • Detecting the true center of the thermal

  • Reading live wind indication (especially valuable when flying in the mountains)

I always keep the sound set to TEK and use HAWK as confirmation. When the blue needle rises (typically around 2 m/s), I begin thermaling — and it works extremely well for me.

The last time I flew a club glider without HAWK, I felt completely lost. There were so many “fake” thermals caused by gusts, and it was much harder to center the thermal from the first turn.

For accurate HAWK indications, the following are essential:

  • Proper yaw calibration

  • Correct tilt calibration

  • Good GPS reception

  • Flying with minimal sideslip

  • Keeping the system updated to the latest software version (we continuously improve the HAWK algorithm)

Have a great season!

Toni

PS: For some reason I’m unable to register using my company email address. Could you please let me know who I should contact to resolve this? 

  PS2: I also recommend contacting in...@lxnav.com for any customer support questions. We respond within 24 hours, and the most accurate information will always come directly from us. I often see some rather unusual replies on forums 🙂  

Bill Mileski

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 8:48:30 AMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
Maybe it was already discussed, but electronic compensation requires (per manual) colocated static and TE ports. I use TE compensation for that reason. 

My LxNavigation vario agrees very well with my SxHawk TE vario, so I started with Hawk as audio source, whilst leaving my LxNavigation TE vario audio on. With both sources of audio it helped get a sense of each source’s interpretation.  The usual comments about horizontal gusts not stimulating the Hawk response, apply, but for me it seems that very well coordinated flight is very important for predictable results. 
When flying well, I have been impressed by how well horizontal gusts can feel like a surge of lift, with acceleration in the seat, etc., and Hawk has helped my success rate in interpreting these. 

On Mar 5, 2026, at 7:23 AM, Gordon Wingate <gordon....@gmail.com> wrote:



Jeff Eggers

unread,
Mar 5, 2026, 9:07:52 PMMar 5
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
If using TE pressure for TE compensation on the V8, is it OK for that TE pressure line to be shared with a standard variometer?  

I recall hearing that the very minor movements within the variometer are enough to throw off the V8 sensor, so the TE line should be dedicated to the V8.

Gordon Wingate

unread,
Mar 6, 2026, 9:29:15 AMMar 6
to rasp...@googlegroups.com
Any mechanical variometers that measure flow in and out of a capacity bottle will interfere with any electric vario that measures the pressure signal with pressure transducers. If the TE line must be shared with a mechanical vario the split needs to be as far away from the instruments as possible. At a minimum it should be behind the seat. 

Gordon

Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages