System still freezes, still no resolution.
Drew White
The system still freezes after it's been on for a couple of days.
Sometimes only 1 day.
I leave it on, then in the morning I come in, and it's locked up.
I have started a logging system so that when I find it's dead in the morning, I can check the logs to find out the resource usage of things.
Hopefully this will help the devs resolve this issue that has been a plague since early on.
If anyone already knows a resolution to this bug, please let me know so that I can get it resolved. I'm tired of having to re-do the work that gets lost if files get corrupted or not saved properly, and also browsing information from things I'm doing.
Sincerely,
Drew.
Simon
> I'm tired of having to re-do the work that gets lost if files get
> corrupted
> or not saved properly, and also browsing information from things I'm
> doing.
applications
still running in the background (ie. only the graphical interface is
frozen)
or is it a complete system freeze?
On my side I'm running Qubes on a Lenovo Thinkpad T500 and I just wrote
a
similar request as yours just a few days ago:
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/qubes-users/O4UO9CjO4TM
On my side the graphical display is frozen, and with KDE I managed to
workaround the issue by setting KWin to use XRender instead of OpenGL as
compositing engine. After that the system became rock-solid and I never
encountered such freeze anymore for months, while it happened about once
a
week until that.
The sad thing is that Qubes has now switched to XFCE, the freezes came
back
and I do not know any equivalent setting on XFCE. I recently tried to
completely disable compositing and am now crossing my fingers.
Regards,
Simon.
Drew White
Mine is weird.
I have a cron running in the background.
This allows me to find out what happens while I'm not here to see the PC stop and lock.
It locked again over the weekend.
I can't get to a terminal/console/shell/prompt or whatever you want to call it.
Others can ALT+F2 and get a shell, some can't. And I can't.
I've attached the log file for running processes and memory usage at the time of me arriving here to find it locked up. So it's not completely locked up, things still are running. But it s3eems all input devices may have stopped or been disabled.
This happens every time I leave the PC for a day or so.
Hope someone can help.
It doesn't have the issue if I'm on the pc during the day since upgrade to 3.2 , only if I leave it for a day, (more than 12 hours)
Foppe de Haan
Drew White
> usb input devices? if so, can you attach a ps/2 mouse/keyboard and does that do anything? also, maybe have a look at bios settings related to (sleep/wake from) usb?
Doesn't matter.
USB or not, it doesn't respond to input.
raah...@gmail.com
Is your issue after a wake from suspend? Desktop freezes on me on one machine if it is left asleep for too long. I figure its related to bios or what vms were running when it went to sleep. I also find its less of a problem on kde then on xfce. In my case it also seems to happen more often if i wake machine up from power button rather then a keyboard press.
Drew White
> Is your issue after a wake from suspend? Desktop freezes on me on one machine if it is left asleep for too long. I figure its related to bios or what vms were running when it went to sleep. I also find its less of a problem on kde then on xfce. In my case it also seems to happen more often if i wake machine up from power button rather then a keyboard press.
Short answer: no.
Long answer:
It isn't from waking, it never goes to sleep, only blanks the screen itself.
I changed to XFCE because it was happenning overnight on KDE. XFCE takes a lot longer to happen.
Since mine never sleeps, and is always working (I am a programmer), all I normally do is move the mouse and it comes back to life from the lock screen.
But this PC locking up is odd. It never happpenned in version. or 3.0 that I can remember. Nope, it did happen once when Qubes Manager absorbed all the RAM. Since that 1 leak was fixed, it didn't happen in 3.0. And that didn't matter if I used KDE or XFCE.
I wish they would go back to the older GUI instead of this new wanky one.
Drew White
Well, it just happened again.
While I was using it.
I'll attach the log fine. But as far as I can tell, it's because Qubes uses SystemD. And when that runs out of RAM to use, it locks up. and since everything runs as SystemD, just like Windows, everything locks up, instead of 1 process.
How do I install another O/S as Dom0? (it is Linux)
How do I install another O/S as integrated guests? (it is Linux)
Help please?
Drew White
> Is your issue after a wake from suspend? Desktop freezes on me on one machine if it is left asleep for too long. I figure its related to bios or what vms were running when it went to sleep. I also find its less of a problem on kde then on xfce. In my case it also seems to happen more often if i wake machine up from power button rather then a keyboard press.
Well, it just happened again.
While I was using it.
Drew White
Drew White
Addn: I forgot to mention, this time, nothing kept running in the background, EVERYTHING was frozen. Not even the logging kept going.
johny...@sigaint.org
>> Is your issue after a wake from suspend? Desktop freezes on me on one
>> machine if it is left asleep for too long. I figure its related to bios
>> or what vms were running when it went to sleep. I also find its less of
>> a problem on kde then on xfce. In my case it also seems to happen more
>> often if i wake machine up from power button rather then a keyboard
>> press.
>
> Well, it just happened again.
> While I was using it.
> I'll attach the log fine. But as far as I can tell, it's because Qubes
> uses ystemD. And when that runs out of RAM to use, it locks up. and since
> everything runs as SystemD, just like Windows, everything locks up,
> instead of 1 process.
important to suspend/restore in the first place?
I'm generally not one to rationalize a bug by saying "well, just don't do
that," or "don't use that feature"; but the whole suspend/restore thing
does seem to add a layer of complexity to the whole security mess, with a
lot of CPU/BIOS/motherboard dependencies and such.
It's never worked well for me, from the days of the first laptop that
promised to suspend/restore, up until my last Macbook. :) Maybe I've
just lost one too many sessions from a failed suspend/restore, that I've
been turned off of the feature. Or maybe I just don't leave the house
enough.
I like to leverage all the hardware/software features I can, but
suspend/restore never seemed worth the trouble in most cases.
Suspend/restore doesn't quite reach the 26x increase in complexity I
perceived in the Wifi vs. Ethernet comparison, but it's probably at least
2x or 3x the complexity and dependency upon a variety of processor/mobo
features.
For a laptop on the go, okay, I can see the argument. But I don't think
most Qubes users are on laptops, given the hardware requirements. (Very
much moreso with 4.0. :P) Correct me if I'm wrong.
Why do you need to suspend?
A good, strong, password for your user account, making sure you have
physical security (or at least awareness if it's been breached), and/or
shutting down when you need to, works fine for me. (At last I hope, lol.)
It would be nice to see "xl save" and "xl restore" (which basically
hibernate a VM) smoothly integrated into Qubes, so the VM Manager
supported it, or at least was aware of it. Which would reduce the need
for a true hardware suspend/restore (if you can restore a VM fully after a
full reboot).
But if you need to keep your current state, why not just keep the machine
on? (And securely locked/monitored?) I'm hardly flush with cash, but the
electricity cost of keeping a PC on 24/7 isn't exactly breaking the bank.
And the alternative of shutting it down (and taking the disks with me)
when I leave, isn't terribly inconvenient, w.r.t. the risks, either.
Apologies if I completely missed the point, as I so often do. And maybe
I'm wrong and most Qubes users are running around with high powered,
compatible laptops.
I'm just looking to find out the motivations for such a feature that
brings additional complexity.
Cheers
JJ
Drew White
> A bit late to the party (as they say) in this discussion, but why is it so
> important to suspend/restore in the first place?
A bit late to the party? What party is this? I started this thread.
I don't want to suspend/restore. My PC never suspends.
> I'm generally not one to rationalize a bug by saying "well, just don't do
> that," or "don't use that feature"; but the whole suspend/restore thing
> does seem to add a layer of complexity to the whole security mess, with a
> lot of CPU/BIOS/motherboard dependencies and such.
Okay, I see that you are going to keep going on about the suspend/restore that I don't use and that isn't the issue here, so I'll stop reading your post here, and let you re-read my posts so that you can then re-post with your thoughts and all on the actual topic, not the complete reverse of what I have/use/want/do that is the actual issue. :}
yaqu
> A bit late to the party (as they say) in this discussion, but why is
> it so important to suspend/restore in the first place?
> think most Qubes users are on laptops, given the hardware
> requirements. (Very much moreso with 4.0. :P) Correct me if I'm
> wrong.
commuting every day, makes suspend/restore very useful feature.
Hibernate would be even better, but it's not supported by Qubes.
Qubes on laptops are not rare, according to published HCLs.
And Qubes-compatible laptop doesn't have to be expensive - e.g. used
Thinkpad T520 with i5-2520M for $200 and 16 GB RAM for $110 is really
affordable. And I hope it will also run Qubes 4.0, since it supports
SLAT/EPT (well, according to specs).
--
yaqu
raah...@gmail.com
raah...@gmail.com
> saves energy, keeps pc cool, clears ram, keeps it unconnected when idle, saves boot time.
about keeping it unconnected you have to make sure all wakes are off in the bios. and then the really paranoids are worried about big brother in cahoots with hardware manufacturers when it don't matter even if your pc is off lol.