HCL - Dell Latitude E5470 + Docking Station

[Rafael Reis]

Almost everything works fine. Amazing support for Dell Dockstation. All the ports works, USB works, Display Port and DVI monitor works along with built in laptop Display.

Memory card reader used to work on a previous install, but required testing kernel. Right now I'm running 4.0.2 after a fresh install on stable channel and it is not working out of the box.

Overall very satisfied with the Hardware Support.

I'm running a dedicated SSD on WWAN M.2 slot for Qubes. I "dual boot" windows with F12 on startup and choose UEFI boot source.

[andrew.t...@gmail.com]

Hi Rafael

Interested to see you got an SSD drive to work in the WWAN slot in your E5470. Could you tell me what drive you used, and the spec for your laptop. Am I right in thinking that you have Windows installed on one drive and Qubes on the other, and that you actually choose which drive to boot from at power up? So it's not "dual-boot" in the usual sense (ie multiple OSs on the same drive)?

Thanks

[Rafael Reis]

Hey Andrew!

Sorry for the late reply, haven't checked the mailing list in a while. 

I have a 5470 service tag # 5V2GBG2 

You may see the full original config here. 

Basically it came stock with a quad core i7-6820HQ. Sata drive with the tiny sata cable. No m.2 bracket or SSD installed to the NVME ngff slot. Nothing installed on the wwan ngff slot, and intel's wifi card installed to the ngff wireless slot. 

It has 3 ngff slots (M.2 NVME, WIFI, WWAN) keyed differently (Key A, B etc) and the sata data+power cable for 1 sata drive.

I've upgraded ram to 2x8GB DDR4, removed the stock sata hdd and replaced it with a sata ssd. Since I needed more capacity than performance, I got a 512GB Crucial BX500. It was way more affordable than an nvme drive atm, and I didn't have the m.2 bracket either, which would mean I would only be able to secure the nvme ssd with double sided tape or other improvised solution. The BX500 is known to have an exploitable hardware encryption, so be advised to use only software encryption on that drive.

That drive became my Windows 10 drive, GPT / UEFI enabled.

Started using Qubes on a USB 3.0 64GB flash drive, it worked pretty well considering the constraints, but decided I needed a drive for Qubes itself.

After some deep research I discovered that the WWAN slot indeed takes a SATA M.2 SSD. (source).

You'd better go for the shorter ones, otherwise they'll collide with the inner plastic frame and won't fit. I believe you can fit 32 and 40mm length drives without any trouble.  I couldn't find an affordable SATA M.2 with at least 256GB for Qubes (that was my personal need), so I ended up getting a regular 80mm lenght one. To make it fit, I had to "mod" the inner plastic frame, and disassemble 50% of the laptop.  I opted simply to break pieces of the plastic frame in order to free space for the lengthier drive. Then, I isolated the surroundings with tape and secured the ssd (don't remember how, if I was able to bolt it in, tape it, or pressure). The SSD I used in the WWAN port is https://www.lexar.com/portfolio_page/ssd-nm100/ 256GB version

You have to change BIOS settings under drive configuration to enable the required sata ports. 

Initialized that drive as GPT, and installed Qubes to it.

You are right regarding the "dual boot". I don't have Grub. I use the "BIOS" UEFI bootmanager to choose which OS I'd like to boot. All I have to do is press F12 after powering up. I've renamed Qubes to Recovery, so it is inconspicuous. Default boot drive is the BX500 with windows. 

The level of compatibility of the E5470 with Qubes is outstanding. The performance is incredible.

The only thing that didn't work OOB was the SD card reader, which was easily fixed by opting to  kernel-latest . Docking station works 100%, with multiple monitors. Even 2 monitors + laptop monitor works perfectly. I wish it was possible to nuke Intel ME on 6th gen laptops and have it fully Opensource. It would make a great candidate for certification.

My only concern right now is the decisions for the GUI of Qubes 4.1. I wonder if the separation of the GUI and dom0 would result in incompatibility with E5470 or even a big decrease in performance. This thing is perfect for Qubes if your threat model isn't government agencies high.

Hope I could help, and let me know if you have further questions.

[brenda...@gmail.com]

On Monday, May 11, 2020 at 6:13:21 PM UTC-4, Rafael Reis wrote:

My only concern right now is the decisions for the GUI of Qubes 4.1. I wonder if the separation of the GUI and dom0 would result in incompatibility with E5470 or even a big decrease in performance. This thing is perfect for Qubes if your threat model isn't government agencies high.

Following the developer discussion, my understanding is that for Qubes 4.1, GUI/dom0 separation will be an optional feature and not the default.

Brendan

[Rafael Reis]

Hey Andrew,

Glad I could help.

Yes you can manually enable and disable drives on BIOS, although it is a somewhat cumbersome workflow if you dual boot a lot. Especially if you have BIOS password enabled as well.

Windows sees the Qubes drive enabled, initialized but not formatted. It does not touch the drive and does not prompt to format it or anything. Yes, it is there, exposed but again, depending on your threat model this isn’t that big of a deal. I have custom software highest encryption bitlocker enabled on the windows drive as well.

You may always encrypt qubes boot partition as well. It’s one more password. There’s docs for that.

As far as laptop size goes that’s entirely personal. I’m 95% of the time docked, with a full desktop setup around me, so I favor the portability when on the go. You may consider the dock station + monitors + keyboard mouse combo. You also get a ton of additional I/O, charging, and many perks with this configuration. It’s awesome, and a Single eject away of being untethered.

I’ve worked with the precisions before, and to me they are absolute mammoths. But I’d probably go for a bigger laptop if I didn’t have the docking setup.

Good luck on your Qubes adventure.

Rafael 

Em qui, 14 de mai de 2020 às 09:13, Andrew Sullivan <andrew.t...@gmail.com> escreveu:

Hi Rafael

Very many thanks for your comprehensive reply, lots of good information there.  What I hope to end up with is pretty similar to what you have - a large(ish) drive with Windws and Linux Mint in a conventional dual boot setup, and a drive in the WWAN slot to run Qubes.  I think it is possible to inactivate drives individually on Dell laptops so if I feel it necessary I could switch off the W/LM drive when using Qubes and vice versa.  I think this would largely get around the potential risk of the Qubes /boot partition getting compromised when using one of the other OSs?  Depends how paranoid I feel!

Regarding choice of laptop, I am torn between the E5470 and the M4800.  I now know that the E5470 will work, but I do like the bigger screen (would FHD, not QHD) and the separate number pad on the M4800; I also like the number of storage drives it can accomodate. It's a bit of a big old thing, but portabity isn't really an issue for me.  Pricewise there's not much in it on the Dell Outlet site (UK).

I agree it would be good if the ME could be dealt with on the newer machines - maybe someone will find a way...  I'm not up to speed on the GUI/dom(0) issue; hopefully Brendan is right that it will be an option, so it won't matter.

Thanks again

Andrew

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[Andrew Sullivan]

On Thursday, 14 May 2020 13:52:59 UTC+1, Rafael Reis wrote:

Hey Andrew,

Glad I could help.

Yes you can manually enable and disable drives on BIOS, although it is a somewhat cumbersome workflow if you dual boot a lot. Especially if you have BIOS password enabled as well.

Windows sees the Qubes drive enabled, initialized but not formatted. It does not touch the drive and does not prompt to format it or anything. Yes, it is there, exposed but again, depending on your threat model this isn’t that big of a deal. I have custom software highest encryption bitlocker enabled on the windows drive as well.

You may always encrypt qubes boot partition as well. It’s one more password. There’s docs for that.

As far as laptop size goes that’s entirely personal. I’m 95% of the time docked, with a full desktop setup around me, so I favor the portability when on the go. You may consider the dock station + monitors + keyboard mouse combo. You also get a ton of additional I/O, charging, and many perks with this configuration. It’s awesome, and a Single eject away of being untethered.

I’ve worked with the precisions before, and to me they are absolute mammoths. But I’d probably go for a bigger laptop if I didn’t have the docking setup.

Good luck on your Qubes adventure.

Rafael 

Hi Rafael

Quick update - I now have a refurbished E5470 (Core i5, 256GB SSD, 8gb RAM, FHDscreen).  Works fine with W10 and Linux Mint, so I'll be getting a SSD for the WWAN slot (and maybe another 8GB SODIMM) and starting with Qubes!  Do you happen to remember what sort of SSD you put in that slot (I know it should be 2242 form, but mSATA, PCIe, something else???).

Many thanks

Andrew

 

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[Rafael Reis]

Quoting myself:

After some deep research I discovered that the WWAN slot indeed takes a SATA M.2 SSD. (source).
You'd better go for the shorter ones, otherwise they'll collide with the inner plastic frame and won't fit. I believe you can fit 32 and 40mm length drives without any trouble.  

So a SATA M.2 2242 or 2230 should fit. Examples

I couldn't find those sizes here in my country. So as I explained on the same post, I disassembled and broke away pieces of the inner frame to fit a 2280 size drive.

 

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[Andrew Sullivan]

Many thanks.

 

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[Andrew Sullivan]

Hi Rafael

So, I got a Transcend M.2 SSD, 2242 form. Physically fits fine, but it is invisible! Can't see it in W10, Mint or Qubes - neither gparted nor Windows Disc Management can see it.

Can you remember exactly what you had to change in the BIOS? For some reason my laptop is set up in legacy mode - maybe because it originally had W7 installed; not sure if that would make a difference?

Thanks

[Andrew Sullivan]

Forgot to mention, it's an M.2 SATA SSD and all the drives in the BIOS are checked...