Does Qubes-OS 4.0.1 have support for KDE or GNOME desktop environment?

[Finn]

I've installed Qubes-OS 4.0.1 and it's XFCE desktop environment but I
would rather prefer either KDE or GNOME desktop environment. I found
this document[1] where mentioned that Qubes-OS is migrating towards
GNOME but at the time of installation only XFCE (neither KDE nor GNOME)
is available. I was wondering, is there a way I can use my preferred
desktop environment? Or, I have to wait for GNOME until migration is not
fully completed because it seems currently there is no support for KDE.


[1]: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/usability-ux/


Cheers,
Finn

[unman]

There are minor issues with KDE - the most significant is that the
sys-net icon does not appear - there's a blank icon there. Other than
that KDE works fine. In fact, that's offset by the ease of menu
manipulation, use of activities to ensure separation of qube windows etc
etc.
This is completley separate from using mainly Gnome programs.

[awokd]

unman wrote on 6/2/19 11:28 AM:

Also, see https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/kde/. Not sure if it's been
updated for 4.0.

[Chris Laprise]

KDE does have support AFAIK, although its no long the default. If you
can get used to the blank-space network icon, then I recommend KDE as
there are many pluses.

I don't believe Qubes is actually going to migrate to Gnome. There was
an aborted attempt and Gnome 3's paradigm (tablet touch UI, melded
WM/app widgets) doesn't seem compatible with Qubes' concept.

--

Chris Laprise, tas...@posteo.net
https://github.com/tasket
https://twitter.com/ttaskett
PGP: BEE2 20C5 356E 764A 73EB 4AB3 1DC4 D106 F07F 1886

[Jon deps]

On 6/5/19 8:00 PM, Chris Laprise wrote:
> On 6/2/19 3:41 AM, Finn wrote:
>> I've installed Qubes-OS 4.0.1 and it's XFCE desktop environment but I
>> would rather prefer either KDE or GNOME desktop environment. I found
>> this document[1] where mentioned that Qubes-OS is migrating towards
>> GNOME but at the time of installation only XFCE (neither KDE nor GNOME)
>> is available. I was wondering, is there a way I can use my preferred
>> desktop environment? Or, I have to wait for GNOME until migration is not
>> fully completed because it seems currently there is no support for KDE.
>>
>>
>> [1]: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/usability-ux/
>
> KDE does have support AFAIK, although its no long the default. If you
> can get used to the blank-space network icon, then I recommend KDE as
> there are many pluses.
>
> I don't believe Qubes is actually going to migrate to Gnome. There was
> an aborted attempt and Gnome 3's paradigm (tablet touch UI, melded
> WM/app widgets) doesn't seem compatible with Qubes' concept.
>

https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/kde/

suppose one follow these instructions but does *not want to use sddm
nor change any windows management settings

on reboot

one is logged into XFCE then, in dom0 can type

startkde

or startkde --replace xfce ?

but this seems to result in 2 taskbars running


what would be the way to choose the DM on login or to startkde and
close xfce or is that possible ?

[unman]

At the login screen, there's a drop dowm menu allowing you to choose
which DM to apply, no?

[Jon deps]

ah OK it was up in the corner bar , not in the login area , hadn't
notice :)

[Jon deps]

On 6/5/19 8:00 PM, Chris Laprise wrote:

> On 6/2/19 3:41 AM, Finn wrote:
>> I've installed Qubes-OS 4.0.1 and it's XFCE desktop environment but I
>> would rather prefer either KDE or GNOME desktop environment. I found
>> this document[1] where mentioned that Qubes-OS is migrating towards
>> GNOME but at the time of installation only XFCE (neither KDE nor GNOME)
>> is available. I was wondering, is there a way I can use my preferred
>> desktop environment? Or, I have to wait for GNOME until migration is not
>> fully completed because it seems currently there is no support for KDE.
>>
>>
>> [1]: https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/usability-ux/
>
> KDE does have support AFAIK, although its no long the default. If you
> can get used to the blank-space network icon, then I recommend KDE as
> there are many pluses.
>
> I don't believe Qubes is actually going to migrate to Gnome. There was
> an aborted attempt and Gnome 3's paradigm (tablet touch UI, melded
> WM/app widgets) doesn't seem compatible with Qubes' concept.
>

seems to want about 4 times the dom0 RAM and still buggy am
getting all these flashing windows bar and applications menu hit and
miss giving dom0 memory boost 800 MiB and minimal qubes memory 400 MiB
or so , so gave up


btw, is there any documentation on recommended RAM for dom0 using XFCE

I'd like to put back the Default memory settings but don't know what
they are

[Chris Laprise]

What GPU does your system have? I'm running KDE comfortably in only
1.5GB dom0 memory, and my graphics are Intel HD integrated.

I don't recall the exact procedure to set dom0 memory. It begins with
changing GRUB_CMDLINE_XEN_DEFAULT in /etc/default/grub and then you run
a command to update it.

[awokd]

Chris Laprise wrote on 6/15/19 12:50 AM:

Defaults are dom0_mem=min:1024M dom0_mem=max:4096M.

[john s.]

so your 1.5GB of dom0 memory is NOT the dom0 "memory boost" in the
Qubes Global Settings? which I'm assuming is akin to "maxmem" for
other VMs ?


I also have intel integrated graphics, maybe kabylake generation


at minimal qube memory 1564 and dom0 memory boost 5138 I am
still finding it unusable the app menus don't appear , I keep
fighting the taskbar widgets which then somehow I make appear on the
desktop not the taskbar, then can't get them back on the taskbar,
etc, which maybe a / the KDE learning curve ..... nice to see something
less austere using Qubes, that I might be able to understand but

if it requires me to change something in Grub and not just the Global
Settings ...maybe time to give up :)



--
A895 0C7C A244 8E2E FD77 A3DB 180B 7D4D D158 F8B6

[Chris Laprise]

Right, its the base dom0 memory settings, which you can also add
temporarily from grub menu (hit 'e', make change then boot). My dom0
'memory boost' in Qubes Global Settings is only 160MB.

The dom0 kernel I'm using is 4.19.43.

>
>
> I also have intel integrated graphics,  maybe kabylake generation

Mine is Ivy Bridge, much older.

> at minimal qube memory 1564  and  dom0 memory boost  5138      I am
> still finding it unusable   the  app menus  don't appear ,  I keep
> fighting the taskbar widgets  which then somehow  I make appear on the
> desktop not the  taskbar,  then  can't get them back on the taskbar,
> etc,  which maybe a / the KDE learning curve ..... nice to see something
> less austere  using Qubes, that I might be able to understand   but
>
> if it requires me to change something in Grub  and not just the  Global
> Settings  ...maybe time to give up  :)

What happens if you change to sddm, what I'm using? In fact, it seems I
removed lightdm from dom0.

Also, for something easy to try, you can turn off the compositor with
Alt-Shift-F12. And the KDE compositor settings are under Display /
Compositor.

If none of that works, it may simply be a compatibility problem that the
old Fedora 25 possesses.

[Jon deps]

Well, I'm trying to not doing anything that I might break the system,
hence no sddm , no grub tweaks ......

So, does it make any difference how I setup the two Qubes Global
Settings?


I'll try out the compositor thing .... though, sort of don't want to
touch Grub even for temp settings :)



Maybe I can try it on my old thinkpad , esp if you happen to have
specifics on making the 1.5gb of dom0 permanent, so far the
thinkpad may be running the KDE better than the modern hardware ...