Fuel tank grommet/seal

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

On my saloon I need to replace the grommet/seal (where filler pipe enters)  on my MK2 tank (40l top sender type) as it has gone really hard with age.

But I am struggling to find a correct replacement seal. My filler pipe is the metal type 50mm diameter. The aperture in the tank where seal fits is approx 61mm inside diameter.

I have found seals to fit 50mm pipe but they are much smaller tank fitting diameter - these match the seal on an old earlier type tank (side sender) II have in garage.

So does anyone happen to know if the seal I need is a Fiesta part or was it sourced from another car?

John

 

[susanandmartin]

Mine used a standard Fiesta seal.

Martin Scott

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

--
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Quantum Owners Group" group.
To post to this group, send email to quantu...@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to quantumowner...@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/quantumowners?hl=en
 
IMPORTANT NOTE: All information presented herewith is provided on an "As Is" basis, without warranty or the implication thereof. Neither the Quantum Owners Club nor the individuals associated with the Quantum Owners Club or in the preparation of the above information shall have any liability to any person or entity with respect to liability, loss, or damage caused or alleged to be caused directly or indirectly by the instructions contained within this or related message(s).
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Quantum Owners Group" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to quantumowner...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/f3c1e8eb-23b5-49cb-b394-6d3ae0ded06cn%40googlegroups.com.

 

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

@Martin - is that using metal filler pipe into a later type tank?

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

Correction to my original post. Internal diameter of filler pipe seal opening in my fuel tank is approx 68mm not 61mm.

On Wednesday, September 7, 2022 at 10:12:20 PM UTC+1 susanan...@corringham99.free-online.co.uk wrote:

[Jim Hearne]

The earlier tank (side sender) used the metal filler pipe , the later tank (top sender) used the plastic filler pipe.

I don’t think you can mix the 2 as the pipes are a different size.

 

Having said that, my saloon has the later tank and the saloon has to use the metal filler pipe as it is cut and joined with a flexible section.

I can’t remember what i did to make it work though (don’t you hate getting old).

I may well have welded a sleeve onto the metal pipe filler pipe to make it the larger diameter.

 

I know i left the small pipe inside the filler pipe out, the one that lets the air back up the filler pipe, i thought, it can’t be that bad without it.

Wrong, it can, that’s still on the todo list to fix.

 

It was hard to find good tank seals even back then , 2006

 

Jim

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/c9e08aef-7ef9-47ac-8ced-5477ed28b443n%40googlegroups.com.

[susanandmartin]

It is – but I remember there was an additional metal piece as shown in the saloon assembly manual.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/c9e08aef-7ef9-47ac-8ced-5477ed28b443n%40googlegroups.com.

 

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

I have 2 versions of saloon assembly manual. The version 1.0 copy briefly states Fiesta MK1 filler pipe must be used and cut and sleeved - no real detail just a photo..An obviously later pdf copy (but version not stated) of manual I have gives much more detail of cutting, sleeving and joining metal filler pipe with hose and clips.

On my car which was a factory build (around late 1991 with Mk2 XR2 donor) the metal filler pipe is one continuous pipe - the Ford pipe has clearly been carefully cut  and welded (very neatly) in several places with breather pipe correctly preserved. There are no sleeves. My guess is QSC did this as an improved solution over joining sections with flexi hose and jubilee clips. 

The seal is a puzzle - it has no code markings. it does not match the standard  ones I have found  for Fiesta, it could be custom seal or a pattern tank (unlikekly). My guess is it is from another Ford of similar era ....?

If all else fails I could always get a new seal made using old one as model.

ps

If anyone has a MK2 top sender type tank lying around could they please measure the inside diameter of the filler pipe aperture - this would help me confirm if my tank is standard.

 Thanks

[Jim Hearne]

Remember the early Mk2 Saloons were based on a Mk1 Fiesta donor so the early manual probably would only mention that.

 

Mk2 Fiesta owners must have a similar problem with tank seals.

 

Jim

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/e366ca43-a2aa-4a82-8558-f1851603e5f4n%40googlegroups.com.

[susanandmartin]

My next comment may or may not help…….

It may be possible that large grommets of the type needed are available from boat chandlers?

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/e366ca43-a2aa-4a82-8558-f1851603e5f4n%40googlegroups.com.

 

[Jim Hearne]

They would have to be specifically for Petrol or the petrol would attack them.

 

Jim

 

 

From: susanandmartin

Sent: Thursday, September 8, 2022 2:01 PM

To: quantu...@googlegroups.com

Subject: RE: [Quantum Owners] Fuel tank grommet/seal

 

My next comment may or may not help…….

It may be possible that large grommets of the type needed are available from boat chandlers?

Martin Scott

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/6319e7b5.2e0a0220.19d09.a4c9SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING%40gmr-mx.google.com.

[susanandmartin]

 

Indeed – In my search for E10 hose I found that the pipes specified for boat use generally far exceeded that for cars (possibly the danger in a boat fire presents as more difficult to escape than with a car?) I got the hose from Car Builder solutions in the end, although I suspect they don’t have fuel grommets. Certainly you are correct though Jim, the material spec needs to be checked.

Martin Scott

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/7E0886C55A4F4BAEB6930A8FBFF58ADC%40JimQuad.

 

[chris...@btinternet.com]

When I changed mine I discovered the seals for MK1 and MK2 are the same part but with different part numbers.

My filler neck was made wider with a short length of metal tube where it goes into the tank. Then the filler neck went inside with a short section of flexible hose attached.

 

Chris G

 

From: list...@liberator-systems.co.uk

Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2022 8:40 PM

To: Quantum Owners Group

Subject: [Quantum Owners] Fuel tank grommet/seal

 

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

Several folks have stated MK1 & MK2 filler neck seals are the same but from what I have found this is not always the case.

One complete tank & filler pipe I have is an earlier side mounted sender type - the seal on that one takes Ford mm metal filler pipe.

The other tank I have in saloon is a later top mounted sender type - the seal on that one also takes a 50mm filler pipe.

However the aperture diameter on these tanks where filler seal fits is completely different - the later tank is much bigger.

So far I have found and tried 2 different Fiesta seals listed by suppliers.

The first one supplied would be the correct one for the early type tank.

The second one supplied is bigger OD but is not correct for my later tank (it takes a pipe approx 55mm diameter but fits in a smaller diameter tank aperture than aperture in my tank) . I think this type is for tanks using later plastic filler pipe

So there are at least 2 types of standard Fiesta tank seal and so far I have not managed to find a seal which fits my later tank aperture - this implies my later tank is either non standard or there was at least one other type of seal used at some point in production.

My old seal is rock hard but otherwise decent condition so I hope to get a reproduction made using it as template. If that fails it looks like I would need to change tank and modify filler to a setup for which seals are available ;-(

John

.

[Jim Hearne]

Looking on the Ford parts catalogue.

The 32 litre side sender tank was used on Mk1 XR2 from 1.10.1981, to
31.08.1983 and non Mk1 and Mk2 Fiestas until 1986
The Finis code for this seal is 1492183

The 40 litre top sender tank was used on Mk1 XR2 from 31.08.1983 and all Mk2
XR2, and non XR2 Mk2 Fiestas after 1986 , the seal for this tank is Finis
code 1549720

These are the only 2 seals listed.


It looks like there were at least 3 different filler pipes, a metal one for
the 34L tank, a metal one for the 40L tank on pre 1986 cars and the plastic
one for the 40L tank on all the later cars.

You can see all the details on a online version of the Ford

https://ford.catalogs-parts.com/#{client:1;page:part;lang:en;category:car;catalog:4;param:no;group:0;groupsubgroup:1518;subgroup:15140;subsubgroup:65647}#13

You might need to join those lines together.

Jim

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/6dae77f2-003d-44bc-918a-69a6ae6e2884n%40googlegroups.com.

[susanandmartin]

Going off at a tangent……. Is there a possibility that similar era tanks from different car manufacturers may be worthy of investigation? Maybe Land Rover, MG or Triumph or other classics with good spares backup?

The question of suitability for petrol including ethanol need answering though.

Martin Scott

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/6dae77f2-003d-44bc-918a-69a6ae6e2884n%40googlegroups.com.

 

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

@Jim

Thanks - I did search the various Fords parts catalogs before I got the seals to try. As you say only 2 different types are ever listed (which are the ones I got).

But the later seal is definitely not correct fit in my tank aperture. I believe the original donor for my car was pre 86 XR2  - that fits with my metal filler pipe (not sleeved).

It is is possible I guess that tank is an aftermarket item and was supplied with seal to fit non standard aperture. Tank is heavily painted now so any codes etc. are obscured - a camera inside might find something if it was stamped on _ might try later.

@Martin

I think it unlikely to find any other suitable donor tanks given the tight fit of Fiesta tank. Probably easier to get an alloy tank custom made.

John

[susanandmartin]

I was thinking of tank seal/grommet, not fuel tank 😊

Martin

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/1237dd76-118b-4d15-8dfe-e07d3a38980cn%40googlegroups.com.

 

[list...@liberator-systems.co.uk]

@Martin

Oh yes LOL misunderstood you there!.

I am sure you are right in that somewhere out there is the right replacement seal 

Problem is finding which donor(s) it comes from because no parts listings I have found specify the  seal dimensions you required to determine suitability.

Anyway my reproduction seal is now on its way so to me so hopefully problem will be solved :-)

 

John

[susanandmartin]

John,

May I ask where a custom seal can be sourced – that’s useful info for many a kit or classic builder!

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quantumowners/b286939c-65e1-4860-b5a6-70005fddfae5n%40googlegroups.com.