NumPy proposal to remove the financial functions.

[Warren Weckesser]

NumPy is considering a NEP (NumPy Enhancement Proposal) that proposes the deprecation and ultimate removal of the financial functions from NumPy.    The functions would be moved to an independent library.  The mailing list discussion of this proposal is at

    http://numpy-discussion.10968.n7.nabble.com/NEP-32-Remove-the-financial-functions-from-NumPy-tt47456.html

or

    https://mail.python.org/pipermail/numpy-discussion/2019-September/079965.html
   
The first message in that thread includes the proposed NEP.

There have been a couple suggestions to ask about this on the Pandas mailing list.  Contributions to the thread in the numpy-discussion mailing list would be appreciated!

Thanks,

Warren

[Graham Duncan]

Hi Warren, 

I don't know how commonplace this is, but speaking on behalf of myself and perhaps a dozen or so colleagues of mine, this functionality is incredibly helpful and used regularly. Probably not a huge inconvenience if we would have to use another library, but it has been nice being able to access this within numpy. Furthermore, I imagine that the financial calculations do not require a whole lot of maintenance. 

Thanks for the heads up and I'm sorry if this is annoying!

Best, 

Graham

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

Graham H. Duncan

o: 866.515.1552 x 718
d: 919.819.4302
f:  866.515.1552
e: gdu...@huguenotfuels.com

ᐧ

ᐧ

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[Warren Weckesser]

On 9/8/19, Warren Weckesser <warren.w...@gmail.com> wrote:
> NumPy is considering a NEP (NumPy Enhancement Proposal) that proposes the
> deprecation and ultimate removal of the financial functions from NumPy.
> The functions would be moved to an independent library. The mailing list
> discussion of this proposal is at
>
>
> http://numpy-discussion.10968.n7.nabble.com/NEP-32-Remove-the-financial-functions-from-NumPy-tt47456.html
>
> or
>
>
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/numpy-discussion/2019-September/079965.html
>
> The first message in that thread includes the proposed NEP.

A nicely rendered version of the NEP is now available at

https://numpy.org/neps/nep-0032-remove-financial-functions.html


Warren

>
> There have been a couple suggestions to ask about this on the Pandas
> mailing list. Contributions to the thread in the numpy-discussion mailing
> list would be appreciated!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Warren
>

[Warren Weckesser]

On 9/8/19, Graham Duncan <gdu...@huguenotfuels.com> wrote:
> Hi Warren,
>
> I don't know how commonplace this is, but speaking on behalf of myself and
> perhaps a dozen or so colleagues of mine, this functionality is incredibly
> helpful and used regularly. Probably not a huge inconvenience if we would
> have to use another library, but it has been nice being able to access this
> within numpy. Furthermore, I imagine that the financial calculations do not
> require a whole lot of maintenance.
>
> Thanks for the heads up and I'm sorry if this is annoying!

Thanks Graham! This is not annoying at all. On the contrary, the
point of sending out the email was to get feedback like this.

Warren

>
> Best,
> Graham
>
>
> . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

> Graham H. Duncan
> *o*: 866.515.1552 x 718
> *d*: 919.819.4302
> *f*: 866.515.1552
> *e*: gdu...@huguenotfuels.com <jmgr...@huguenotfuels.com>
> ᐧ

>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pydata/8458a06f-ead7-4f7e-b288-4a15a6002482%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>> .

>>
>
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>

[Warren Weckesser]

On 9/8/19, Warren Weckesser <warren.w...@gmail.com> wrote:

FYI: The proposal to accept the NEP to remove the financial functions
has been made on the NumPy-Discussion mailing list:
https://mail.python.org/pipermail/numpy-discussion/2019-September/080074.html

Warren

>
> Thanks,
>
> Warren
>
> --
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> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
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>

[Brendan Barnwell]

Hi Warren,

I'm somewhat late to this discussion but I too have used the financial functions.  I looked at the discussion and the NEP and one thing I don't understand is how the maintenance burden is alleviated if the functions are moved to a separate library.  Is the intent of the Numpy devs to just "dump" these functions into numpy_financial and then not maintain them?  If not, what is achieved by moving them out of numpy?

On Thursday, September 19, 2019 at 8:25:52 AM UTC-7, Warren Weckesser wrote:

On 9/8/19, Warren Weckesser <warren....@gmail.com> wrote:
> NumPy is considering a NEP (NumPy Enhancement Proposal) that proposes the
> deprecation and ultimate removal of the financial functions from NumPy.
> The functions would be moved to an independent library.  The mailing list
> discussion of this proposal is at
>
>
> http://numpy-discussion.10968.n7.nabble.com/NEP-32-Remove-the-financial-functions-from-NumPy-tt47456.html
>
> or
>
>
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/numpy-discussion/2019-September/079965.html
>
> The first message in that thread includes the proposed NEP.
>
> There have been a couple suggestions to ask about this on the Pandas
> mailing list.  Contributions to the thread in the numpy-discussion mailing
> list would be appreciated!


FYI:  The proposal to accept the NEP to remove the financial functions
has been made on the NumPy-Discussion mailing list:
https://mail.python.org/pipermail/numpy-discussion/2019-September/080074.html

Warren

>
> Thanks,
>
> Warren
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "PyData" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an

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[Warren Weckesser]

On 9/21/19, Brendan Barnwell <bren...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Warren,
>
> I'm somewhat late to this discussion but I too have used the financial
> functions. I looked at the discussion and the NEP and one thing I don't
> understand is how the maintenance burden is alleviated if the functions are
>
> moved to a separate library. Is the intent of the Numpy devs to just
> "dump" these functions into numpy_financial and then not maintain them? If
>
> not, what is achieved by moving them out of numpy?

Brendan,

There have been some more recent comments on the github issue that are
relevant; take a look:

https://github.com/numpy/numpy/issues/2880

It is true that when the functions are moved to numpy_financial, they
will receive less attention from the core NumPy developers. Indeed,
that is the point of the move. As you can see from the comments in
the github issue and those quoted in the NEP, there is no interest
among the current developers in maintaining these functions in NumPy.

By having a smaller and more focused library that is explicitly for
financial functions, it is possible that new developers with greater
interest and expertise in that domain will be motivated to contribute.
See, for example, Graham Duncan's recent comments in the github issue.
It remains to be seen whether we'll end up with a significantly
*better* library for financial calculations once the transition is
complete.

For the most visibility among the NumPy developers, it would be best
to continue the conversation in a NumPy venue, either the github issue
or the NumPy mailing list. I've cc'ed this email to the NumPy mailing
list.

Warren

>
> On Thursday, September 19, 2019 at 8:25:52 AM UTC-7, Warren Weckesser
> wrote:
>>

>> > email to pyd...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>.

>> > To view this discussion on the web visit
>> >
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pydata/8458a06f-ead7-4f7e-b288-4a15a6002482%40googlegroups.com.
>>
>>
>> >
>>
>

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