WRONG CALCULATION OF THE WALK TIME

[danilo baggini]

In OSMAND:

with installed the pluging Linee isoipse for the elevation and with the plugin enabled

loading a track of 5.45 km length

and with an elevation change from 200 m to 1930 m (inside the track there are the elevations also, track enclosed)

the time supplied for the walk is one hour

This time is obviously wrong.

I wait comments

Danilo

[Bart Eisenberg]

OsmAnd doesn't take elevation gain into account for time estimates. From App profiles/Walking/Vehicle paramaters/Default speed, you can set a minimum, default and maximum speed.  That might help for some situations, but for a hike that steep, I would guess your own personal estimate would come closer.  

[danilo.baggini]

Thanks for the answer.

I have a computerized mathematic metod of time calculation based on a Swiss table and I can give you.

I work with Italian CAI Project for a paths catalog based on OpenStreetMap.

Here you can see what:

https://hiking.waymarkedtrails.org/#?map=13!46.0204!8.527

The Italian Infomont is this but it is developing so it is not full operating:

https://infomont.cai.it/Sentieri/loader.html?ProjectID=CAI

Best regards

Danilo

-------- Messaggio originale --------

Da: Bart Eisenberg <bartei...@gmail.com>

Data: 16/01/20 04:14 (GMT+01:00)

A: Osmand <osm...@googlegroups.com>

Oggetto: Re: WRONG CALCULATION OF THE WALK TIME

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[Bart Eisenberg]

If you're thinking the method might be usefully incorporated into OsmAnd, you might suggest it at the project's Github site: https://github.com/osmandapp/Osmand.

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[A Thompson]

Actually, for walking OsmAnd does now use Naismith's rule to factor ascent into the time estimate. But it seems that it doesn't do this is you are following your own .gpx track. If I take the start and end of the .gpx track and allow OsmAnd to plan its own walking route, then the estimated time changes from about an hour to about four hours when "use elevation data" is activated in the route planning options. 

Unfortunately I can't see a way of  achieving the same thing when the .gpx route is selected!

[Bart Eisenberg]

@A Thompson--I didn't know that: thanks!  I got the similar results to yours when having OsmAnd plan the route. 4:25 up, 1:45 down.  (I had to set an intermediate waypoint for the downhill route to keep it on the GPX) 

 @ danilo.baggini: this video might help. https://youtu.be/UXpvjE1vmbI . In general, assuming it's feasible, you're better off having OsmAnd calculate the route than following the GPX, including more information about the route and better turn-by-turn directions.

[Danilo Baggini]

Thanks to all for the clear considerations.

I reach with OsmAnd the same yours time resul for the A34 very step path.

For your information the OsmAnd time of about 4 hours is for very very fast hikers .... the normal time is 5-6 hours. I am an Alpinist and Climber from long long time and I know very well all the paths of my zone Ossola, Valgrande and Val Pogallo. Almost all the paths you can see here (https://hiking.waymarkedtrails.org/#?map=13!46.0194!8.3798) are been inserted in OSM by me.

Best regards and happy new year
Danilo

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[Bart Eisenberg]

I'm not surprised your estimate is longer: that's a steep trail.  

Thanks for your OSM contributions. On the map, at least, it looks like a nice part of the world.  

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 11:07:30 PM UTC-8, Danilo Baggini wrote:

Thanks to all for the clear considerations.

I reach with OsmAnd the same yours time resul for the A34 very step path.

For your information the OsmAnd time of about 4 hours is for very very fast hikers .... the normal time is 5-6 hours. I am an Alpinist and Climber from long long time and I know very well all the paths of my zone Ossola, Valgrande and Val Pogallo. Almost all the paths you can see here (https://hiking.waymarkedtrails.org/#?map=13!46.0194!8.3798) are been inserted in OSM by me.

Best regards and happy new year
Danilo

Il 17/01/2020 00:40, Bart Eisenberg ha scritto:

@A Thompson--I didn't know that: thanks!  I got the similar results to yours when having OsmAnd plan the route. 4:25 up, 1:45 down.  (I had to set an intermediate waypoint for the downhill route to keep it on the GPX) 

 @ danilo.baggini: this video might help. https://youtu.be/UXpvjE1vmbI . In general, assuming it's feasible, you're better off having OsmAnd calculate the route than following the GPX, including more information about the route and better turn-by-turn directions.

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 1:00:31 PM UTC-8, A Thompson wrote:

Actually, for walking OsmAnd does now use Naismith's rule to factor ascent into the time estimate. But it seems that it doesn't do this is you are following your own .gpx track. If I take the start and end of the .gpx track and allow OsmAnd to plan its own walking route, then the estimated time changes from about an hour to about four hours when "use elevation data" is activated in the route planning options. 

Unfortunately I can't see a way of  achieving the same thing when the .gpx route is selected!

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 3:14:20 AM UTC, Bart Eisenberg wrote:

OsmAnd doesn't take elevation gain into account for time estimates. From App profiles/Walking/Vehicle paramaters/Default speed, you can set a minimum, default and maximum speed.  That might help for some situations, but for a hike that steep, I would guess your own personal estimate would come closer.  

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[Kevin Kenny]

On Thursday, January 16, 2020 at 11:07:30 PM UTC-8, Danilo Baggini wrote:

For your information the OsmAnd time of about 4 hours is for very very fast hikers .... the normal time is 5-6 hours.

 

On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 10:34 AM Bart Eisenberg <bartei...@gmail.com> wrote:

I'm not surprised your estimate is longer: that's a steep trail.  

If I'm calculating 'guidebook time', I presume that an average party will take 30 min to go a mile (20 min to go a km) on unpaved trail on level ground, and then, for a loop or out-and-back, add an hour for every thousand feet (20 min/100 m) of elevation gain.  For a linear trip that doesn't return to the starting point, I recognize that going down slows the party as well as going up, and change that to 30 min/mile (20 min/km) plus 40 min for an ascent of 1000 ft/300 m, 20 min for a descent of the same amount.

That figure is probably more realistic if you're not leading a party of athletic young adults or trained mountain troops, which is the sort of person that the original Naismith rule was targeting. It works pretty well for the typical crew that will turn up for a hiking club outing. Also, hikers don't mind finishing a little earlier than estimated, but they and their loved ones do get peevish when they're back signficantly late. (Don't even ask about my wife's reaction the time that my daughter and I were a day late getting back from an outing!)

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73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin