Searching German Contact, Problems Hardware

[Andy PausB]

Hello Together

I have bought an APS Placer. Removed the complete Electronic and just use the mechanics. At the moment i replaced all Servo Motors to Servostepper from Sorotec 180W. Use Smoothieboard via TCP.  It works. Also Endstops and so on are used. Now i have a little bit trouble to understand the config.txt file. I have AXIS X and y. Work. Also Z high is working. But where do i tell the rotation Axis and what is the name in open pnp. 

Question is, How to configure the otehr AXIS (Smoothiboard has 5) in config file ?!

Maybe there is someone out there who i can contact directly. Because i think there are some simple question s i dont want to post here, because they  are in my opinnion to small. 

Is there somebody in germany who i can contact ? 

Thanks a lot

Andy

[Andy PausB]

Hello Together

i get angry by this.......

nothing works anymore.

i have flashed sometimes the firmware for cnc, older one, the normal ones, etc....

I can connect via TCP to the board but no axis works. 

Detect Firmware shows this: 

FIRMWARE_NAME:Smoothieware, FIRMWARE_URL:http%3A//smoothieware.org, X-SOURCE_CODE_URL:https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware, FIRMWARE_VERSION:edge-f7df5f1, PROTOCOL_VERSION:1.0, X-FIRMWARE_BUILD_DATE:Aug 14 2021 21:00:32, X-SYSTEM_CLOCK:120MHz, X-AXES:3, X-GRBL_MODE:1, X-ARCS:1, X-CNC:1, X-MSD:1

 

As config file i use standard config file, just modified the network to connect. 

If i want to move i get the message: Move to command missing- fix in solutions. But there is nothing to fix ?!

What do i do wrong ? 

I am so sad.

Thanks for your help.

[mark maker]

Hi Andy,

Calm down, no point in getting angry.

> nothing works anymore.

OpenPnP creates backups of your configuration, so if this worked before, you can go back:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/FAQ#how-can-i-go-back-to-an-oldworking-configuration

However, your firmware is not the recommended one, so either you flashed it recently, or you never had the ideal setup.

I propose you use Issues & Solutions to help you. It will tell you (almost) everything, that needs to be done. It will also point you to the right firmware. Press the blue [ i ] buttons to get help from the Wiki. The upper one is general info, the lower one specific to the issue that you selected in the list:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Issues-and-Solutions

_Mark

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "OpenPnP" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to openpnp+u...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/b30a65e9-40e0-4e59-86f6-5f72d2ac37cfn%40googlegroups.com.

[Andy PausB]

Thank you Mark

Just a simple question: Which firmware is the right one for using with open pnp with Smoothieboard ?

 I only see firmware standard and for firmware cnc. (Each in 2 Versions). Which one is the propoesd one for open pnp. 

And where can i get a config file with 4 Axis definded with no extruder ? (As example for this firmware) 

I read a lot, but i understand some points not realy.

Thanks a lot.

[mark maker]

Hi Andy,

I recommend updating to the latest OpenPnP testing version, it has many goodies and is very stable. It will be made the new regular version very soon.

https://openpnp.org/test-downloads/

Then (as I said) use Issues & Solutions:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Issues-and-Solutions

Among other things, Issues a& Solutions will at some point say, that your firmware should be updated to the special OpenPnP version. If you press the blue button, it will lead you to right firmware, probably to this link:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Motion-Controller-Firmwares#smoothieware

It links to my blob, where I explain, why the official firmware is not good enough, and that unfortunately, the Smoothieware Project did not want to accept the needed extensions (if you care, you can read all about the discussion in the Pull Requests, I made with them).

https://makr.zone/smoothieware-new-firmware-for-pnp/500/

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/91b1c37c-49d8-495c-8839-dedee7c57651n%40googlegroups.com.

[Andy PausB]

Hi Mark

Thank a lot.

Yesterday i find the problem. It was a problem by using the rigth Gcode. Issues and solutions helped. 

I also switch to Serial USB communication, seems more stable. I miss a little bit an alive light on the screen for correct connection.....(just a wish).

General:

I deinstalled openpnp (older Version) and installed it new, to get a "fresh" start. But the openpnp has the settings i made not erased, means the Driver settings and so on were not on "new". What do i have to do to install a fresh one ? 

Is there a possibiliy to make a "Werksreset" in open pnp? 

I will install your openpnp Version above, and the other firmware you post. 

Where can i find a config file with delta stepper configured ? Because at the moment it is unclear how to configure in openPNP the rotating axis with standard config file ?! 

I always find in standard config file the extruder defined. But i use a 4 Axis for rotating not extruding.

Last question: When i change settings in config file of smoothie, is there a possibility to restart via console ? i disconnect everytime the Supply, USB, Vbb,5V,.....

Just for information: I use a 64Bit Windows system. 

Thank you

[Andy PausB]

Hello 

I find information to configuration. I will use the gamma, delta, epsilon,......like in the config description. I will try. 

Sorry, i am a little bit confused to find the right descriptions.....

Just one question: How to restart Smoothieboard via Software possible ? 

[mark maker]

> What do i have to do to install a fresh one ?  Is there a possibiliy to make a "Werksreset" in open pnp?

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/FAQ#how-do-i-reset-my-configuration

(make a backup first)

> Where can i find a config file with delta stepper configured ? Because at the moment it is unclear how to configure in openPNP the rotating axis with standard config file ?!

Wait, did you say "Delta", as in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_robot ? I haven't found anything about that "APS Placer" you mentioned in the OP, care to send images/data/links?

I'm asking, because as far as I know, all attempts to use delta robots for smd pick & place in the "DIY" domain have failed so far. They simply couldn't achieve the needed precision/linearity etc. Most famously, the FirePick Delta project failed:

https://groups.google.com/g/openpnp/c/5koTWtJalXQ/m/fmt1exukCAAJ

So this should be interesting!

As to Smoothie config, for the above-mentioned reasons, I guess you would need to do that from scratch with help from the Smoothieware project:

https://smoothieware.org/delta

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/8ccf811b-852e-4d29-9d55-ae689f4f0ff1n%40googlegroups.com.

[mark maker]

Not aware of a way. You have to ask at the Smoothieware project.

[Andy PausB]

Hello 

I am sorry to make confussion: I have no delta. 

The APS Novastar Sytsem you can see here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4LByg75odc

I replaced complete electronic. Remove Stepper X/Y to JMC Servos, C and Z Stepper stayed using Stepper driver from Smoothieboard.

All endstops uses as they are.

Status actual:

X/Y Works.

Endstops work. 

Homing Works, also Z. 

Problem at the moment:

Z and rotating Axis (Gamma and delta config) did not move by jog. 

But: Z Moves by homing ?

FInd Issues has no topic for that. Using Async driver by TCP or USB makes no difference. 

Have you an Idea why ?

Sometime in the past it did........ ?!?!

[mark maker]

One frequent confusion is if you do not have the nozzle as the selected tool.

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Setup-and-Calibration:-Nozzle-Setup#selecting-a-nozzle

Often, the camera is selected, especially if you use the Auto tool select option on the machine.

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Setup-and-Calibration:-Machine-Setup#the-machine-setup-tree

The camera has its own virtual axes, i.e. they move "invisibly" when you jog them. Read here, why this is useful:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Machine-Axes#use-case--example

So, if you specifically want to jog the nozzle, you must select it first.

_Mark

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "OpenPnP" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to openpnp+u...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/66ccaede-8072-4f7d-b5c4-6055549ea00en%40googlegroups.com.

[Arthur Wolf]

On Thu, Jun 2, 2022 at 5:53 AM mark maker <ma...@makr.zone> wrote:

Hi Andy,

I recommend updating to the latest OpenPnP testing version, it has many goodies and is very stable. It will be made the new regular version very soon.

https://openpnp.org/test-downloads/

Then (as I said) use Issues & Solutions:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Issues-and-Solutions

Among other things, Issues a& Solutions will at some point say, that your firmware should be updated to the special OpenPnP version. If you press the blue button, it will lead you to right firmware, probably to this link:

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Motion-Controller-Firmwares#smoothieware

It links to my blob, where I explain, why the official firmware is not good enough, and that unfortunately, the Smoothieware Project did not want to accept the needed extensions (if you care, you can read all about the discussion in the Pull Requests, I made with them).

I don't want to get back to this for the 1000th time, but if you're going to present it this way, I have to make a note...

We did not "not want to accept" anything. There is a process, that is designed to make sure all of the consequences of a given change are found, understdood by all, and managed, and your changes have simply not gotten to the end of that process. You did (and the smoothie community did) do a lot of the work/process, it just was never finished. Other PRs/changes that do finish that process, do get merged.

Part of the problem has been issues with people taking things personally, and people not being familiar with how to contribute to Smoothie (see the PRs for the full story), part of the problem just has been that there is a procedure, and it hasn't been followed to the end.

We still want your changes, we absolutely do not want there to be a pnp-specific flavor of Smoothie, there is no good reason for this to be the case. I encourage you to continue to work to get your changes merged, it'll benefit everybody in the end.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/58453acf-323b-23aa-d55a-5f3ef7109d77%40makr.zone.

--

勇気とユーモア

[mark maker]

Hi Arthur,

> we absolutely do not want there to be a pnp-specific flavor of Smoothie, there is no good reason for this to be the case

I agree.

> I encourage you to continue to work to get your changes merged

I did. I tried. Hard. Multiple times, and multiple iterations each time. At some point it became just obvious that rejection was based on pretexts and outright false statements decorated with insults about me not understanding.

If anybody wants to read the PR lore 😎, it is all in there:

First a demo of the bug in a real use case of OpenPnP.

https://youtu.be/o0v4W6YA34k

Now the PR (that I actually submitted a year earlier, based on experiments):

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1323 (rejected)

Might also point out the comment, where I was prompted to fork Smoothieware  if I wanted to move XYZ axes at the same time as ABC axes (imagine OpenPnP could not do that!):

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1323#issuecomment-491636352

Then fork, I did.

At some point the Smoothieware project tried to fix the bug themselves. Event after turning down my code, I tried to help, but to no avail, a complete fail:

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1398

Then the second attempt. This was OK, but just fixing one of the bugs:

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1403

Then another missing feature: reporting the ABC axes in M114.

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1487

Rejected 4 minutes after requesting! The discussion after that is very telling, especially the last comment.

I also mailed you, Arthur, privately on 2021-05-26, 10:34. If you still have that mail, I think it is all in there.

Further bugfixes I sent to you directly, I'll quote this here:

Hi Arthur

in my OpenPnP Smoothieware fork I fixed a problem with Gcode decimal parsing. Smoothieware uses the strof() function, which mistakenly interprets some character sequences that may actually be the next G-code letter. For example "0X" (hexadecimal prefic) or "E" (exponential).

So this valid G-code is interpreted wrong:

G1A0X10

will be interpreted as

G1 A16

instead as

G1 A0 X10

This is the fix:

https://github.com/markmaker/Smoothieware/commit/23a1f0db14f4d0549f5bbdc0ac197b934c8313c8

I won't bother to make yet another PR that will be rejected. But I thought you wanted to know.

This is the user case where it appeared:

https://groups.google.com/g/openpnp/c/28OikkcsC9Y/m/Pwyb6isCBgAJ

Ref:

https://makr.zone/smoothieware-new-firmware-for-pnp/500/

_Mark

So I'm still trying to help. But I'm doing this in my spare time, an I'm too old to waste my time.

The code is open source. I suggest you tell you-know-who to take my changes and re-implement them in his personal style. I don't care about the glory.

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAMHZkm6PrzKLhvx_VBT7RchH0uE%3D%2Bz8eZ4%2Bs9qJfB6zYT9JYBQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[mark maker]

Sorry I forgot one PR: Mid-axis homing for machines with shared Z axis driven nozzles:

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1423

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/f18c3911-b9a9-cb7d-7811-2a95a06b09b6%40makr.zone.

[Arthur Wolf]

On Tue, Jun 7, 2022 at 12:37 PM mark maker <ma...@makr.zone> wrote:

Hi Arthur,

> we absolutely do not want there to be a pnp-specific flavor of Smoothie, there is no good reason for this to be the case

I agree.

> I encourage you to continue to work to get your changes merged

I did. I tried. Hard. Multiple times, and multiple iterations each time. At some point it became just obvious that rejection was based on pretexts and outright false statements decorated with insults about me not understanding.

I just went over one of the PRs again, and that's not what's going on. The remarks/requests for improvement are reasonable. We merge things all the time, we just make sure the quality is up to par and it doesn't break anything else.

About "not understanding", you *both* at some point got upset at each other, Jim still went on with the process though, you ended up stopping before the end.

If you kept the process up, it would end with a successful resolution...

Keep the changes small, clearly explain what they do, what the reason is, and make sure it doesn't negatively impact the rest of Smoothie uses, and it 1000% will get merged. We have merged 100s of such contributions.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/f18c3911-b9a9-cb7d-7811-2a95a06b09b6%40makr.zone.

--

勇気とユーモア

[mark maker]

I just beg to differ. I think people can read. 😂

For instance read this:

Pull request title "Proper G92 offset for ABC axes...". It was closed 4 minutes after submitting. Then a series of 100% false "wisdom", plus the usual insults. When I proved beyond any doubt that he was wrong, the last comment by him:

"Oh I thought you meant XYZ. ABC only have machine position as there is no offset or WCS for ABC."

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1487#issuecomment-847739427

But still, the PR remains closed. No further reaction after that.

Or this last comment on a previous PR:

https://github.com/Smoothieware/Smoothieware/pull/1423#issuecomment-847701367

That was a year ago. No reaction after that.

PRs to Smoothieware truly are a "unique" experience. It is the only project so far where my contributions are very clearly not welcome.

In any case, for those who simply want to make it work for OpenPnP, here you go:

https://makr.zone/smoothieware-new-firmware-for-pnp/500/

And for people wanting full and ongoing original firmware support, go for the Duet 3D boards. They were actively inquiring with me for how to make it work for Pick & Place, and quickly accepted the one PR that was still needed after that, without any problems:

https://github.com/Duet3D/RepRapFirmware/pull/471

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Motion-Controller-Firmwares#duet3d

The PR enabled this (Simulated Jerk Control):

https://makr.zone/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/SimulatedJerkControl.mp4

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAMHZkm4abe6O3CKxRvWR5tVaFkbOfU%2BPbBQj%2B26tKRoNKRW9Nw%40mail.gmail.com.

[Andy PausB]

Thanks to all. 

I am not shure what this discussion at the end has to do with my topics. But maybe  i did not understand syntax of google groups (-;

Status:

All works in Hardware. 

All Stepper moves, all steppers are calibrated. 

All endstops are connected. Homing works perfect.

Cameras are connected, lights are working (by console using M800- M812)

Vacuum works. Vacuum pump works via Relais, Vaccum Valve works. Both seperate over M8xx code. 

Just a question: I did not find where to tell the software which Mxxx Code is for which function ? 

Where can i tell the Software that the Lights Down are for ON M801 and OFF M800.

Also for Valve, ligths up,......i searched but did not find it ? Or do i have to change the names in the config file of Smoothieboard ? 

Sorry for the "simple" questions.

Thank you a lot. 

[Arthur Wolf]

On Tue, Jun 7, 2022 at 3:46 PM mark maker <ma...@makr.zone> wrote:

I just beg to differ. I think people can read. 😂

For instance read this:

Pull request title "Proper G92 offset for ABC axes...". It was closed 4 minutes after submitting.

See that's once again the issue: why do you get upset at that???

That's the normal way of operating: if we think there is something with a PR that does not permit continuing in its current state, we explain what and we close it. Re-opening it takes *one second*. It's about only keeping open PRs that are in a state of current progress. it's about project management, not about being mean to you.

It's not an insult. It's something we do for *everybody*, it's not specific to you.

But *you* get upset...

Again and again and again...

Then a series of 100% false "wisdom",

I just read it, and I don't see any false wisdom there.

You seem to confuse "disagree" and "insult".

plus the usual insults.

I see zero insults there.

Let me tell you my perspective as project maintainer here:

The last time the two of you got upset at each other, I talked to Jim, I explained you two got off on the wrong foot, not to get upset at you even if you got upset at him, and that I'd explain to you to make smaller PRs, and to not get upset when you're told something breaks compatibility or something needs to be changed.

Then I talked to you, and explained to you to make small PRs for small features, and to make sure nothing breaks compatibility, and to not get upset when you are told something breaks compatibility or needs to be changed etc.

Then, you two started talking in PRs again for a bit. Then you got upset again... AGAIN you thought you were insulted when you were not (similar to the issue with "closing in 4 minutes" above. I don't remember exactly, just that it wasn't justified...)

Then I had to do this all again, calm everybody, which is exhausting, then things started moving again.

Please stop with the insults/complaints/war with Jim. It's exhausting, and it's not to the benefit of anyone in either project.

Having to have a pnp fork SUCKS. There is no reason your changes can't be merged if everybody keeps their ego in check.

The reason most of the PRs are currently in pause is because a year ago I had to start a job (thanks to the worldwide shortage of LPC1769 preventing v1 production), and Jim started working all his time on Smoothie v2 (leaving very little time for v1).

If you look at project activity, you'll see it's (AGAIN) not specific to you, ALL (or nearly all) PRs are left hanging.

PLEASE stop thinking this is about you, and put the agressivity behind you.

Both OpenPNP and Smoothie will benefit from it.

Just keep PRs to the smallest possible size you possibly can, do not get upset/do not take things personally, and they WILL get merged.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/5d3bbd0f-067b-6604-deb0-9ad18a7a32b7%40makr.zone.

--

勇気とユーモア

[mark maker]

Hi Arthur,

I appreciate the effort to explain, but while I'm ready to sharing some of the blame on the "personality" front, I can't reconcile what you say with the reality of what happened, or what I can still read, in factual, technical terms.

I just read it again, now, and even with the best of intentions and much effort to put myself in your shoes, I cannot understand, how you could see that differently. These rejections by Jim are simply 100% technically wrong. And despite my hardest efforts, I cannot find any another reasonable explanation, except for them to be aimed at just getting rid of me and my contributions, fast. In no way can I see that my changes are "breaking compatibility" (or whatever) in the ways alleged.

If you two see things so completely differently, I have to assume that I'm just not compatible with you guys. That no amount of bending backwards and letting myself be pushed around will change this. I tried. It is just a different kind of reality. Granted, it could be my reality that is skewed. I have to live with that, and will try to contribute stuff where it is welcome, despite my flaws.

Plus this would be the fourth time (at least), I tried a restart. Last time you guys didn't even bother to respond. 

Enough!

Like I said, my code is there for the taking. If it needs "conversion" to your reality, please do it yourselves. I will try to help in prose, like last time.

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAMHZkm7q2oxiN1-wTqHNZS2pvHMyzpSd7Tq_%2Bm-XWkTzcEGO3g%40mail.gmail.com.

[Arthur Wolf]

On Mon, Jun 13, 2022 at 1:33 PM mark maker <ma...@makr.zone> wrote:

Hi Arthur,

I appreciate the effort to explain, but while I'm ready to sharing some of the blame on the "personality" front, I can't reconcile what you say with the reality of what happened, or what I can still read, in factual, technical terms.

I just read it again, now, and even with the best of intentions and much effort to put myself in your shoes, I cannot understand, how you could see that differently. These rejections by Jim are simply 100% technically wrong. And despite my hardest efforts, I cannot find any another reasonable explanation, except for them to be aimed at just getting rid of me and my contributions, fast

You're being paranoid.

I just went over 3 of these PRs this morning (including the one you just linked), and you systematically are the first to get upset/see evil where there was none.

Just over the offset one, you immediately go agressive with "Closed after 4 minutes. Must be a new record." when that is absolute nonsense. (and you even make it worse later with « I just wanted to PR this, so nobody can say I didn't try. » )

How can you expect a normal conversation after that?

I PROMISE if you stop doing this sort of stuff, you will get a normal PR experience like so many contributors have over the years.

I can do nothing but tell you there is nothing there, because that's the truth, and encourage you to keep going, because that's what will benefit OpenPNP the most.

If Jim is ever mean to you in the future (without provocation...), just tell me, and I will *publicly* admonish him about it and tell him to apologize.

Nobody can force you to do the right thing here, I'll just have to hope.

Thanks for what you did so far.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/4a96ff26-6d0a-af19-612a-33dbbea7e946%40makr.zone.

--

勇気とユーモア

[bert shivaan]

Andy, Sorry for all this extra off topic conversation in your thread.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAMHZkm62i_5WRHe3H2XrUqbkcWTKyECOqHRVXxLbqJytuTOAxw%40mail.gmail.com.

[mark maker]

@Andy, I'm sorry we hijacked this thread. This will be my last response.

Arthur,

> You're being paranoid.

> How can you expect a normal conversation after that?

Read again, what came before that. Jim said:

"I am sorry but the limitations to M114 were by design. M114 is not to be used anyore for hosts you should use ? (as grbl does) and you will get all axis that are enabled.
So I have to reject the changes to M114 as this would break 3d hosts.

Technically just wrong. He goes on...

"I'll look at the other things you have done, but I suspect the outcome will be the same. I'll update this when I have studied the rest of the changes."

Does this sound open-minded?

After that he closed the PR. And despite what you keep repeating, that is not "normal" behaviour. PRs stay open until either rejected, abandoned for a long time or merged. That's just GitHub etiquette. And note, he did say "I have to reject the changes". This was in no way ambiguous.

I suggest you also read the PR description itself. There is a lot of thought and effort in it, including some of the hours of testing, just for you guys. I wanted to make this a universally valid PR, not just for OpenPnP.

So slamming the door in your face 4 minutes after you finally post that work is not utterly offensive?

Jim still had time to add three more post before my first response:

"Additionally you should not be using G92 as this is a gobal offset and discouraged in CNC operations. You should use the WCS settings like G10 P1 Lxx etc which does work for all enabled axis."

Technically wrong, and sadly G10 is not supported for axes ABC in Smoothie.

"The G92 settings are also the way they are for the ABC axis to accomodate 3d printers that use them for reseting the extruder positions, and again this would break backward compatibility for 3D printers.

If you cannot use ? and G10 as I have suggested then again it looks like openPNP usage of smoothieware will need to maintain their own fork.

We cannot break 3d printer usage (and backward compatibility) to accomodate openPNP.
I do believe the functionality you require is already there if you use the correct gcodes and query commands."

Technically wrong on all counts (in more than one way).

"Ok having looked at these changes I have to confirm these would break backward compatibilty for 3d printers hosts.

You need to use ? as I have said not M114 (which is a 3d printer host command and not to be used in CNC applications).
and as G92 was already being used by 3D printer hosts (incorrectly I may add, but we are stuck with it). You will need to use G10 L10 (or L20) to set WCS instead of G92. This should all work as expected and as 3d printer hosts do not use either they are setup to work work with CNC machines corrctly.
If you want code or examples of using both ? and G10 please look at the Smoopi code base."

Still, technically wrong, there is nothing he has "confirmed". If he really had a serious look at the code, he would have seen. . What he suggested (? or G10) does not work for axes ABC in Smoothieware (as I later demonstrated in my response). 

How can you expect I won't be a bit sarcastic after that? How out-of-place is "Closed after 4 minutes. Must be a new record" in that context?

And when I said "I just wanted to PR this, so nobody can say I didn't try", I was replying to his "looks like openPNP usage of smoothieware will need to maintain their own fork. I don't see how this makes me "paranoid".

End.

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAMHZkm62i_5WRHe3H2XrUqbkcWTKyECOqHRVXxLbqJytuTOAxw%40mail.gmail.com.

[Arthur Wolf]

On Mon, Jun 13, 2022 at 3:08 PM mark maker <ma...@makr.zone> wrote:

@Andy, I'm sorry we hijacked this thread. This will be my last response.

Arthur,

> You're being paranoid.

> How can you expect a normal conversation after that?

Read again, what came before that. Jim said:

"I am sorry but the limitations to M114 were by design. M114 is not to be used anyore for hosts you should use ? (as grbl does) and you will get all axis that are enabled.
So I have to reject the changes to M114 as this would break 3d hosts.

Technically just wrong. He goes on...

You clearly disagree on whether this is technically wrong or not.

I just talked to him, he doesn't think this is wrong.

I just went over the statement two times, and I can't see what's wrong with it in any obvious way...

At best, you don't understand each other in some way, there is some miscommunication issue.

But this couldn't be further from "he's being mean to you and rejecting for no good reason on purpose".

Again: You're being paranoid...

 

"I'll look at the other things you have done, but I suspect the outcome will be the same. I'll update this when I have studied the rest of the changes."

Does this sound open-minded?

Sure...

You clearly come to this conversation with some kind of preconception, and despite numerous requests that you get rid of it, you just don't...

After that he closed the PR.

For the THOUSANDTH time, that does not MEAN A THING.

Closing a PR is not some sort of insult or agression towards you. It's how we manage ALL of our prs...

 

And despite what you keep repeating, that is not "normal" behaviour. PRs stay open until either rejected, abandoned for a long time or merged.

That is not true. I know this, because I have to explain this to somebody at least once a year, who gets surprised or upset at their PR getting closed when they didn't expect it to.

 

That's just GitHub etiquette.

That's nonsense. Every project has different ways of managing PRs. We have a tiny team, and we try to keep the project extremely clean, for everybody's sanity.

At this point you're pretty much just outright calling me a liar...

And note, he did say "I have to reject the changes". This was in no way ambiguous.

I do not see what the issue is with saying this. Changes that can not be merged are rejected, if they are changed so that they can be accepted, they are accepted. This is not an attack towards you...

This seems to be again the same misunderstanding/paranoia repeating itself...

I suggest you also read the PR description itself. There is a lot of thought and effort in it, including some of the hours of testing, just for you guys.

That's great, and that's true of all contributors, but it doesn't change anything to what we are discussing...

 

I wanted to make this a universally valid PR, not just for OpenPnP.

It's great that you tried, but it's Jim's evaluation that you did not get all the way there right away, and that there were still things to discuss/change/some reasons this could not be merged.

This does not mean he's saying you did no effort, just that he's saying there is not enough that this can be merged...

TELLING YOU YOUR WORK IS NOT COMPLETE IS NOT INSULTING YOU.

MOST PRS have changes/discussions/requests/modifications etc. Even ones that "tried to make it a universally valid PR".

So slamming the door in your face 4 minutes after you finally post that work is not utterly offensive?

NO IT IS NOT OH MY GOD HOW MANY TIMES DO I NEED TO REPEAT THIS.

I do not know what to do about this. This is exhausting, and at this point, I'm starting to get a bit upset at you, so I'll (also) just stop this.

I hope you take a big step back, realize this wasn't the insult you thought it was, and it was just how we do things, and at some point in the future, take into consideration the interrest of the OpenPNP project, and move on.

I don't have much hope you will, at this point, but I can't do much more than telling you the truth.

 

Jim still had time to add three more post before my first response:

"Additionally you should not be using G92 as this is a gobal offset and discouraged in CNC operations. You should use the WCS settings like G10 P1 Lxx etc which does work for all enabled axis."

Technically wrong,

Tell HIM that, not me. I don't know who's right. That's what the discussion is for. If you're wrong, how will we figure that out if you get upset. If HE is wrong, how will we figure that out if you get upset???

Just keep going, and you'll get to the bottom of what's up here.

But getting upset just because you think somebody is wrong, is just not an adult way of managing this situation, sorry...

and sadly G10 is not supported for axes ABC in Smoothie.

"The G92 settings are also the way they are for the ABC axis to accomodate 3d printers that use them for reseting the extruder positions, and again this would break backward compatibility for 3D printers.

If you cannot use ? and G10 as I have suggested then again it looks like openPNP usage of smoothieware will need to maintain their own fork.

We cannot break 3d printer usage (and backward compatibility) to accomodate openPNP.
I do believe the functionality you require is already there if you use the correct gcodes and query commands."

Technically wrong on all counts (in more than one way).

Same.

"Ok having looked at these changes I have to confirm these would break backward compatibilty for 3d printers hosts.

You need to use ? as I have said not M114 (which is a 3d printer host command and not to be used in CNC applications).
and as G92 was already being used by 3D printer hosts (incorrectly I may add, but we are stuck with it). You will need to use G10 L10 (or L20) to set WCS instead of G92. This should all work as expected and as 3d printer hosts do not use either they are setup to work work with CNC machines corrctly.
If you want code or examples of using both ? and G10 please look at the Smoopi code base."

Still, technically wrong, there is nothing he has "confirmed".

At this point *you* are insulting him by calling him a liar, and that's just not an ok thing to do.

 

If he really had a serious look at the code, he would have seen. . What he suggested (? or G10) does not work for axes ABC in Smoothieware (as I later demonstrated in my response). 

How can you expect I won't be a bit sarcastic after that?

OH MY GOD.

YES

YES YOU SHOULD NOT BE SARCASTIC AFTER THAT

GROW UP

FUCK

RAAAAAAAAH!!!

THIS IS THE SORT OF NONSENSE OVER THE YEARS THAT NEARLY GOT ME TO COMPLETELY GIVE UP ON OPEN SOURNCE

aiunecntsauiauiuiealau.qmpetnruitgnuietgrnuie

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/15576b92-4595-86fc-7e5d-24490c70387d%40makr.zone.

--

勇気とユーモア

[Jon Raymond]

Maybe it's time to move away from Smoothieware.  RepRap Firmware, Klipper and FluidNC now seem to be the most commonly used motion control firmware's.

[Arthur Wolf]

On Mon, Jun 13, 2022 at 4:18 PM Jon Raymond <dirtye...@gmail.com> wrote:

Maybe it's time to move away from Smoothieware.  RepRap Firmware, Klipper and FluidNC now seem to be the most commonly used motion control firmware's.

Why?

Because Mark got upset at his issue being closed after 4 minutes?

Because he keeps bickering at any objection Jim has to his issues?

We've implemented tons of stuff OpenPNP wanted/needed over the years, accepted even more contributions from the outside.

There's an ego/personal issue here clearly, but even assuming Mark can't get over it, I really don't see how that somehow disqualifies the Smoothie project.

PLEASE actually read the PRs in which he says he's been insulted.

PLEASE.

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/2caab9db-ec92-4ac9-8dc4-3c451292a455n%40googlegroups.com.

--

勇気とユーモア

[Jason von Nieda]

That's enough Arthur. You and Jim have made your choices, and that is fine, but you do not need to derail threads on this list. I will be emailing you both privately. Please do not respond to this thread any further with Smoothie related posts.

Thanks,

Jason

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/CAMHZkm5nSmEzffv6E6F3oQqCmgf%3DZs4mHe6oW%2BwntWx41fVd-w%40mail.gmail.com.

[mark maker]

Hi Andy,

again I apologize for participating in the hijacking of your thread. 😕

As you your last question:

> Just a question: I did not find where to tell the software which Mxxx Code is for which function ?

> Where can i tell the Software that the Lights Down are for ON M801 and OFF M800.

This should be handled by Issues & Solutions. it should detect when the command is missing and then you can enter them here:

More in the Wiki (which I just updated):

https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/wiki/Setup-and-Calibration:-Actuators#assigning-commands

Btw. please open a new thread with your next question. Each question should have its own thread.

...and we would also like to close this one up for good now. 😅

_Mark

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/openpnp/d332b345-ba64-4369-9d65-5e73ef21e9afn%40googlegroups.com.