learning javascript or jumping straight to Node.js

[Kevin Bueno]

Ive done a lot of research, and I want to know what you y'all think? I understand the advantages of already knowing JavaScript, but is it worth the time to put into it?

[Nathan White]

In reality learning JavaScript with node is actually a little easier since your dealing with one environment. The browser(s) aren't quite as friendly since you start juggling the DOM api. This only applies if your comfortable with the command line already.

I say this because the native Apis to node is actually quite small. Much smaller when you start considering all the html5 Apis like ambient light, canvas or geolocation.

> On Feb 16, 2015, at 7:12 PM, Kevin Bueno <kingkev...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Ive done a lot of research, and I want to know what you y'all think? I understand the advantages of already knowing JavaScript, but is it worth the time to put into it?
>

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[Tim Davis]

I recommend jumping straight into node and getting some JavaScript books. You can expand your knowledge of JavaScript at the same time. Having a project in mind is the best way to learn in my opinion. But expanding from your specific goal into general language mechanics and design patterns helps a lot.

[Suk Khoi]

On Tuesday, 17 February 2015 07:42:29 UTC+5:30, Kevin Bueno wrote:

Ive done a lot of research, and I want to know what you y'all think? I understand the advantages of already knowing JavaScript, but is it worth the time to put into it?

actually javascript is big and quite hard to learn iam learning javascript 3 books ,iam reading, 1 book has over 1000 pages and  another two have around 200

you will have to learn javascript, since you wont be able to understand syntax properly and will take long time to coding, u will get stuck up every now and then

[Mad Frode]

You use JavaScript in NodeJS, so you must know JavaScript, but as already suggested, you can perfectly well learn JavaScript and NodeJS at the same time. Then you will learn only the kind of JavaScript that is normally used in Node, and skip the set of JavaScript-challenges you would have if you where to use it in the browser, since you do not need that. So I would recommend read Node tutorials and JavaScript tutorials that are not so focused on the browser (and DOM-manipulations).

[mgutz]

I think learning javascript in the browser first is easier. Do a single page app and the browser has everything you need, an interactive debugger, inspectors, etc. If you go into node.js first, you'll be fighting installation, callbacks, modules, etc

[zladuric]

The most efficient way to learn Node.js is to do something with it. Nice of you to do the research first, very smart!

There are two approaches to this:

1) Try to build something "real".

If you have prior programming experience, you'll know that the language has it's quirks. Watch Douglas Crockford "the good parts" if you haven't already, to figure out basic gotchas that will stop you, then go straight into a project.

It doesn't matter what, as long as it's relatively simple. Maybe a simple website that displays a form or two and loads and saves this from the database, maybe a command line program that converts a .csv into an xml or json.

Then build on that program, expand it or make a new one. Try to build something that you've already built with the language you're currently using.

2. Do some "boring work" first

Still with Node, only focusing more on general programming concepts. I would recommend this if you didn't do any coding before.

Take something like this list here (just something off of Google):

http://www.programcreek.com/2012/11/top-10-algorithms-for-coding-interview/

Go ahead, try it, pick one and do it right _now_. And try to make two more today, and then another three tomorrow. (Granted, it's meant Java, but you can work on those things with JavaScript just fine. It will teach you a lot about syntax, and a about JavaScript specifics.)

The first will get you a little closer to Node.js typical usage sooner. The second approach will teach you more about JavaScript sooner.

But if you want to get good at any of this, you should know both JavaScript and Node.js specifics well.

But the rewards?

The reward is that you can, once you get good at it, deliver complex REST APIs in a week or two, something that would take three people 2 months until very recently, and even now it would take a lot in many other languages and platforms.

The reward is that you feel the expressiveness of JavaScript, that you feel that you can take any library and bring it about and make it suit you just perfectly. 

The reward is that you can think much more about the problem at hand, then about which library to use and is it compatible with some other library.

The reward is that even after years of Node.js work, you still feel excited like a kid on each new project because you get to try and learn new stuff.

That's a humble advice that I feel would be good for myself, and I hope it also helps you.

Zlatko

[Steven Stanton]

Suk, how many of those pages are for Dom and Apis. Probably most of them. Murach books do a great job of teaching JavaScript and when you cut out Dom and helm you have maybe 200 pages including examples

[alessio]

Please no offence Kevin, but this question does not make a lot of sense in the first place.

JavaScript and node.js are two completely different things and not comparable in such a way. The former is a programming language, while the latter is a runtime environment based on an interpreter for JavaScript.

If you "learn" node.js (or better its specific API) you will automatically "learn" JavaScript as well.

On Tuesday, February 17, 2015 at 3:12:29 AM UTC+1, Kevin Bueno wrote:

[Tim Davis]

Speaking JavaScript intentionally leave out most of the DOM. I can recommend that book.

On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 6:12:29 PM UTC-8, Kevin Bueno wrote:

[Suk Khoi]

i am 12+ yrs of development vb,asp and asp.net, but i was using JavaScript for validation and alerts thats it, iam reading books loudly understanding little, and continuing reading, javascript syntax is not very friendly and kinda weired, since i want to use node i have to learn javascript so iam reading it as the time goes i will be understanding more of it, just came to know that we can pass any no. of parameters to a function, even if there is no parameter option

[Sam Roberts]

On Thu, Feb 19, 2015 at 9:36 AM, mgutz <mario.l....@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think learning javascript in the browser first is easier.

I think you are a front-end developer, Mario!

I've never written a line of front-end js, I learned node directly.
Well, first I spent about a day reviewing js syntax/semantics,
ignoring all the browser horribleness, and then started coding in
node.

> On Monday, February 16, 2015 at 6:12:29 PM UTC-8, Kevin Bueno wrote:
>> Ive done a lot of research, and I want to know what you y'all think? I
>> understand the advantages of already knowing JavaScript, but is it worth the
>> time to put into it?

If your goal is to learn node, don't waste time in the browser, its a
very different environment, with a different set of tools. The only
commonality is js syntax, and that's the easiest part. Just don't pick
it up by "example", js is a simple language, but you actually have to
understand its variable scope and type models. Don't skip the language
basics.

[Sam Roberts]

On Sun, Feb 22, 2015 at 11:27 PM, Suk Khoi <aminn...@gmail.com> wrote:
> i am 12+ yrs of development vb,asp and asp.net, but i was using JavaScript
> for validation and alerts thats it, iam reading books loudly understanding
> little,

Browser-based js books make it look worse than it is in node. For
example, the bizarre workarounds for no modules,
and crazy hacks to prevent leaking vars into global scope.

> just came to
> know that we can pass any no. of parameters to a function, even if there is
> no parameter option

That's how python, ruby, lua, lisp, scheme (off the top of my head)
work, too, so now that you've got that, you are on your way to another
half dozen languages!

Soon you'll come to the point where you stop saying "not like VB" and
start saying "better than VB" :-)