A little region selection question

[David Eagle]

Hi, I thought, from reading the LM documentation, that wherever my playhead is, that region should be selected? But it appears that I sometimes have to navigate to the region first. 

I have LM set up so that pressing left or right takes my playhead to that region. I pause my audio at the bit I want to split with control space.

I press command T to split the region.

I continue playback. Pause my audio at the next point and again, split my region.

I then move left to the region I want to delete and press Shift delete to delete the region and move the region to the right to the left, so there’s no gap.

This is when I lose focus. I have to remember to press left arrow again to get me to the region, so that I can make further splits.

Ideally when I press play, that region would automatically select itself, but it doesn’t.

I assume that what is happening is expected behaviour? But I”m just checking.

I just need to remember to press left arrow after deleting my region, otherwise I make two splits, then go to delete the middle region and realise that no splits have happened, even though Voice Over announces that the region has been split.

The workflow is pretty quick once I get used to it, but if possible it would be good to have the region under playhead auto select, negating the need for an extra key press.

Thanks.

--

David Eagle

Best Variety Show "Flying Solo" Leicester Comedy Festival 2024
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Member of three-time BBC Radio 2 Folk Award Winning band The Young'uns

Website: http://www.davideagle.co.uk
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/thedavideagle"

[TheOreoMonster]

What you are describing is normal behavior yes. When a region is deleted  nothing is selected. However, if Logic Magician is on, Command T should always select and split the region under the playhead. This was a work around we came  up with  to avoid the very issue you are encountering. Are you disabling and enabling Logic Magician? 

If Logic Magician is off then Command T won’t split at the play head if the region isn’t selected. If Logic Magician is on Command T should always split at the playhead. If you have Logic Magician on after pressing shift Delete when you play and pause Command T should still split under the playhead even if no region is selected. Is this not the case on your end?

Also remember in the latest version of Logic Magician Command Option T pauses and splits at the playhead in case you want to trade two key commands for one. I believe that key command is detect tempo when Logic Magician is off though so you want to make sure Logic Magician is on for that one to work.

-T.O.M
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[David Eagle]

HI Steve, no, for me pressing shift delete and then trying to make further splits after unpausing audio does not split a region. If it works for you then presumably I’ve got something different with my setup. LM is definitely on. I also don’t get a region name being announced whenever I move between regions. It says in the LM documentation that it will move the playhead and announce the name. I’m actually quite pleased that it doesn’t announce the name because I prefer the silence. So if this is something else that is different on my Mac compared to yours, it’s an issue I’m rather happy with. Often when I split a region I’ll press arrow left anyway, and then often press option left a couple of times to nudge my region start position, so it’s not too much of an inconvenience that it’s not selecting a region, but it would be interesting to know why and if I can fix it, if it’s working for you.

Thanks.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/logic-accessibility/F36315D3-BE28-43E6-9AC2-0AA6BCC2D5A3%40logic.band.

[TheOreoMonster]

There are different modes you can select for how regions speak when you use left or right arrows. One is speaking region name, one is moving the playhead to the start of the selected region and announcing the region start position. And of course no speech for those that want the default non Logic Magician behaviour.

Have you tried the new pause and split? Would be nice to figure out why you are having different behaviour.  If you are on the discord server we can meet in a voice channel there and you can share your screen and we can try to work it out. 

-T.O.M
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[David Eagle]

Thanks for the speedy response, Steve. I always have it set to the option where moving to a region moves the playhead. But for me it doesn’t speak the region, it just moves my played to it. Weirdly, when I select that option VoiceOver spells out the name of he option, rather than saying it. I’ve not really used the pause and split option because I tend to pause, then check where I am, and then move forward or back by a 64th value before making my split, and then often moving to next transient and maybe back a 64th from that before splitting again. I’m currently editing spoken word stuff.

Just to clarify, the split works as expected, up until the point that I’ve pressed shift delete, and then the region doesn’t get selected.

I may well have knocked some zoom setting or something on the Mac, as I’ve frequently hit the wrong buttons, given I’ve only had the Mac for a month.

As for Discord, it would be lovely to join you at some point, although I don’t know how all that works, and I feel like I’ve learnt so much in the last month and my brain is exploding with newly acquired knowledge.:D

But do feel free to let me know how to get up and running with Discord, and or to any tutorial or tips on accessibility  regarding Discord,  and I’ll do my best to show up.

Thanks so much for all the help. It’s greatly appreciated.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/logic-accessibility/198EBAAD-D78C-4BB8-9BE9-D74F3B450151%40logic.band.

[TheOreoMonster]

If you have the option selected it will only speak the playhead position not the region name. Yeah I think in some versions of Mac OS it spells it out  because it’s written with no spaces and first letter of each word capitalized. For some reason some versions of Mac OS/VoiceOver reads it fine, some spells it out.

I figured it was spoken word work you were doing given  the wanting to get rid of the gaps.

Alternatively you can try instead of splitting the second time, trim the region to start where the play head is with Command Shift Left Bracket, then press option Left bracket to shuffle the region back to start where the previous region ends. This way you always have a region selected. 

Click the discord link in my signature as it takes you to a page with some written instructions for using discord on Mac OS.

-T.O.M
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[David Eagle]

Hm, I don’t even get the playhead position announced when I press left or right. It just moves the playhead to the region start. I also don’t get the bars read out when I press comma and period. I just assumed that was expected behaviour too. I don’t really need the bars to be read out because I can just press shift slash if I want to know where I am. So I wonder if somehow I’ve changed something in verbosity in VoiceOver utility. Maybe it’s because I’ve got my verbosity down to the lowest setting?

I 

will experiment with the shuffle idea at some point. It probably will require the same amount of key presses, but just different ones. And right now I’ve got the region splitting down rather well and it’s become muscle memory. Maybe you/we could do a little survey of the community to see whether they still have a region selected when they press shift delete. 

I will check out the discord link at some point, thanks.

I shall now return to this podcast editing.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/logic-accessibility/9CD52640-714D-4B33-A87A-B5EA0E203656%40logic.band.

[TheOreoMonster]

I wonder if you have everything unchecked in Settings > General >Accessibility? I think I leave scrubbing checked and uncheck playback and recording.

Yeah if anyone else has Logic Magician on and after you delete  will Command T not split a region?

?

-T.O.M
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[David Eagle]

Ah yes, you’re quite right about the settings in Logic’s accessibility menu. I forgot that I changed those to not announce things, which is what I want, so that’s all good.

I will try and diagnose this weird region not selecting issue at some point, once I get a bit of time. I could try reinstalling LM, but I’ll wait until I’m not knee deep in a project.

Another thing I notice is that if I pause the project, I can’t move forward and backwards by a bar or by division. I have to press space to start playing, then I can press space to stop, and then move. This seems a bit weird to me, but is this expected behaviour, or is this something else that I’ve managed to break? By the way, this isn’t new. This has always been the case.

Thanks.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/logic-accessibility/44C519A6-BAE5-4523-BB4E-51090BA8EF7A%40logic.band.

[Laid Civic]

Hey David

Let me clarify things a bit. 

With LM on, you don’t have to have region selected, just navigate to desired position with comma and period, pause then hit Cmd + T, or use option + Cmd + T which will pause and split both at the same time. In order to split a region in logic, something has to be selected, and LM takes care of it every time you press cmd + t or option cmd + t, the split won’t happen before regions get selected, so you should never worry about that part. 

However, after you remove a region, remaining regions on a track get all unselected. You actually understood the docs right, you just stretched your expectations a bit further lol.

Region auto select on pressing play is something I’ve been experimenting with, but with scripts it becomes very slow, and having it in LM as default feature would be mainly annoying, because it would add a second or two of latency every time you press spaceBar, which is something that nobody wants I’m sure.

So after you remove a region, you can do what you’ve been doing already, or hit shift + option + N LM key, which will select a region under a playhead if available. It’s experimental feature we added to LM few months ago. From what I remember, it’s a feature which works well for the most people. It will miss only if you have multiple tracks with same name, 

Since it’s experimental feature, I’d certainly ask you to try it out and report back, how it works in your workflow.

User feedback is very important for LM, so don’t hesitate to write about it. I personally prefer if you write on discord as I don’t check mail that often, but even if you write here, theOreoMonster will most probably catch it, so either way is fine. 

[David Eagle]

Wonderful to meet you, Lucky, thanks for the response. I’ll definitely check out Discord soon, and thanks also for your amazing work on Logic Accessibility. 

So it seems as if I have everything working as expected, which is nice to know.

Pressing left again to select the region is an extra step that I could do without, but it’s certainly not a massive problem. I wonder, if there’s an issue with re-selecting all regions after deletion when pressing space, could it be made so that the regions auto select after deleting? I don’t understand scripting, so this may not be easy to achieve, but if regions could auto select upon a region deletion, then this might work better?

Unfortunately, Option Shift N doesn’t seem to do anything for me. 

I’m not sure as to why I can’t pause a project and then move by bar or division value without first having to press space and then space again to toggle playing on and off. But I expect maybe this is moe of a Logic thing, than an accessibility issue?

Thanks again for the brilliant work, and I look forward to joining you on Discord soon.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/logic-accessibility/9CCC8CD1-0EAA-4454-9922-6AEA8EF541BB%40gmail.com.

[TheOreoMonster]

Expected behaviour. When you pause period and comma or moving by division value is scrub. If you have sound during scrubbing enabled and you hold down period or comma you will hear it scrub. I have not found a way to disable this behaviour and didn’t include scrubbing key commands in LogicKeyboardNinja for years since this functionality was built into Logic. However in recent years after reviewing and removing some redundant key commands I did add scrub to LogicKeyboardNinja since people had requested it. 

Unfortunately you will want to double tap the space bar quickly to play/stop before you can move by bars/division value again.

-T.O.M
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[TheOreoMonster]

I experimented with the workflow David explained in his earlier messages and for me after split, split left arrow, shift delete, play then pause and split  command t still splits under the playhead like it should. Very interested to figure out why it’s not working for him.

-T.O.M
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[David Eagle]

Ah thanks Steve, good to know that things are seemingly working as expected here.

[Laid Civic]

Hi

Thanks for your kind words, I appreciate it.

No, regions getting unselected after deletion is not any kind of issue or bug, it’s just how logic works.

On shift option N, technically it should be working after you use shift delete, not just delete. Remember, its only function is to select a region under playhead, if exists of course. It’s supposed to work during playback too, so play around with that. If you’re sure that you have a region under playhead and that key doesn’t work, then it is issue of course.

On pause behavior, I don’t know of any way to disable it. I remember thinking that turning scrub off in settings would disable it, but it doesn’t. So eventually I just accepted it. 

Finally on your suggestion on selecting regions after deletion, technically it could be done, that’s something I may consider for future. That could be faster then actual auto select on play and it didn’t come to my mind before, so I’ll definitely put it to the to do list, thanks for suggestion.

 

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/logic-accessibility/CAEuqf6KTcqYa02YQoRmMkQDLr7ysR0GTdAesjjRbk2fuWzNeqg%40mail.gmail.com.