Translating some tutorials?

[Alina Strohaya]

Hello,

I think it could be useful translate some tutorial documentation (I'd translate into Russian). I'm looking at https://www.jenkins.io/doc/developer/tutorial/ in particular, it seems like useful entry-level knowledge and I feel like translated guides can ease entry a little.

I however am not sure of where to put it really? I see a dropdown to switch the whole jenkins.io site to Chinese, but I highly doubt a couple tutorial pages warrant an entire copy of the site. Adding some link to the English tutorial with the translated version, or something like that?

[Oleg Nenashev]

Hi! My recommendation would be to start in a separate resource, e.g. by publishing tutorials on Medium or Habr.com

It would give more traffic than just publishing on jenkins.io IMHO, especially given the fact it would be difficult to maintain iot for new features.

P.S: Happy to promote through https://twitter.com/jenkins_ru and the Russian community's Telegram channels

[Alina Strohaya]

I'm kind of surprised that you said this about maintenance, because if it's in OSS, and gets outdated, or people notice something they want to improve, they can file a PR and add to it. The community can review and assist. On an article on this kind of site, I'm the sole author. If I don't maintain or update it, no one will, it's just me.

[Daniel Beck]

On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 11:59 AM 'Alina Strohaya' via Jenkins Developers <jenkin...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

I'm kind of surprised that you said this about maintenance, because if it's in OSS, and gets outdated, or people notice something they want to improve, they can file a PR and add to it. The community can review and assist. On an article on this kind of site, I'm the sole author. If I don't maintain or update it, no one will, it's just me.

True in the general case, but translations might be special in that a relatively small group (contributors and reviewers) becomes even smaller (contributors and reviewers fluent in a specific language). Additionally, neither many contributors nor the majority of users will be able to even identify content problems, and if they're identified, getting them addressed other than just deletion is a new challenge. When KK merged anonymously contributed translations without review, there was some embarrassing nonsense included in Jenkins for several years.

In general, we've not had great experiences in the past with bigger translation projects specifically. https://plugins.jenkins.io/localization-zh-cn/ , for which there's an entire JEP, has had two contributions and no releases in the last two years. Two other contributors wanted to go this route in core PRs #4306 and #4775 (first step: delete all translations that already exist…), and there was very little followup when we suggested they start contributing regular translations first.  The Chinese localized version of jenkins.io is badly outdated: https://www.jenkins.io/zh/changelog-stable/ is probably the most easily understandable example.

In the case of a localized tutorial, it is unclear what would need to be done when the source text is substantially updated. In core, we generally delete affected translations, resulting in a fallback to the updated English text for a few more strings on the UI, and IIRC there've been some interesting discrepancies when we didn't do that. Deleting an entire tutorial doesn't seem practical.

I absolutely do not want to discourage you from contributing translations! As a project we need to consider how this plays out long-term, including after you've moved on or lost interest. If you have suggestions how we would navigate that, it'd make your proposal much stronger.

[Alina Strohaya]

This still seems kind of in favor of OSS/Github to me - even if you delete for the user to see it as untranslated but updated, the work is not entirely lost, it's still there in the commit history (example: this file that has been initially badly encoded, got mojibaked even worse in another commit and became completely unrecoverable, but through the commit history I could dig out the version that was recoverable) That'd necessitate some kind of information that the deleted file initially existed though. 

I have definitely noticed outdated Jenkins UI translation chunks, and also have been wondering what could be done better about propagating changes to translations. I'm not sure how doable it'd be to, for example, create issues for the propagation after making changes to lines, or would a huge number of them just clog the system.

(In that example, I feel like "without review" is definitely the key. That mojibake also probably happened because the text hasn't been at least looked at with a cursory scroll.)

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