Trademark sublicense request: Jenkins WeChat Account in China

[arch]

On behalf on Alauda, I'd like to request the permission to use the following name that uses 'Jenkins' in it: "Jenkins WeChat Account".

WeChat is a very popular app in China. Most of the people have a WeChat account in here. So I thought it's a great place to help grow the Jenkins Community. We will post some events like JAM on it. And some articles (original or translated from jenkins.io) is helpful for many Jenkins users.

You can find out more about discussing details in here: https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTGjLOg7m1uzXHxZaxTd4QFiRXjknBNOsegQ4JjTkkyH2g%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer

Thank you.

Best!

Rick (Zhao Xiaojie)

[Kohsuke Kawaguchi]

I'm really excited with the prospect of Jenkins project getting WeChat presence. I've been to China a few times myself, I have my own WeChat account, and I know how big and ubiquitous this is over there.

That said, where I disagree with Oleg in the email thread linked is that I don't think it's right that Alauda is tied to this account, or any other participant for that matter. The idea of this WeChat account is for it to be the "official" Jenkins account on WeChat. Trademark sublicensing request is to allow the requester to use the name in question for their purposes outside official community activity.

From the community's perspective, where this manifests as a question is how to share the access to this account with others. For example, what if Alauda moves on and stops engaging the Jenkins community? What if it gets acquired? I'm not assuming any malice or meaning to distrust anybody here, but it's a part of the basic safe guards for shared community assets. This asset is to be controlled by the community, not by Alauda --- I think everyone agrees on that here, but let's be very clear about that!

I think the right thing to do is to setup an account that does not require any company, Alauda or not, to proxy this. Then provided that this is reasonably easily possible, this account should be tied and owned by the email address of some community team, say infra team or Chinese Localization SIG. Then when it comes to the actual operation of this, I think it's great that Xiaojie is stepping up to the plate. All the powers to him!!  IIUC, that's "subscription account" and not "service account."

None of this should involve trademark sublicensing, because this IS the official community effort whose authority is chained to the existing governance structure.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTFvfAKco%3DRxJ6jXCmwX39%2ByexfC1s8TZLwGSZ4dTLberQ%40mail.gmail.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

Kohsuke Kawaguchi

[arch]

Hi,

I totally agree with the idea that Jenkins WeChat running under the community organization. It's fair for every contributor. My dream is that let more and more people join Jenkins party. But I met some situations during the process.

First, I probably must use a personal email to register. I need to receive a verification code to complete the form. But the contact email could be jenkins-chinese-...@googlegroups.com.

Second, the subscription account may be the best solution. There are five types of WeChat Account Entity. They are government, media, company, individual and other organizations. I want to register the account as an organization. But I need an organization name and code. Oleg told me that there is not a real entity for Jenkins. I also do some homework about this. So my advice is that we register this account as an individual.  More detail page is here https://mp.weixin.qq.com/acct/contractorpage?action=showreg&step=3&lang=zh_CN.

It’s really great to get your support. I want to take the initiative. And I think the Chinese Localization SIG team members are happy to help the Jenkins WeChat. We have a regular video meeting. Every contributor could get the meeting time in the calendar https://jenkins.io/event-calendar/. This’s open for everyone.

BTW, if there is no other concerns or questions. Once you think ok with my solution and advice, then I will begin my job.

Best,

Rick (Zhao Xiaojie)

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAN4CQ4xu0s7qMZUhx1LJrjKU5BtF2tc8kogsoE3K1e9fdxD6_w%40mail.gmail.com.

[Oleg Nenashev]

That said, where I disagree with Oleg in the email thread linked is that I don't think it's right that Alauda is tied to this account, or any other participant for that matter... I think it's great that Xiaojie is stepping up to the plate. All the powers to him!!  IIUC, that's "subscription account" and not "service account."

My suggestion was based on Rick's preference towards a "service account" in the thread.

Personally I do not have any preference.

I want to register the account as an organization. But I need an organization name and code. Oleg told me that there is not a real entity for Jenkins. I also do some homework about this. So my advice is that we register this account as an individual

Perfectly fine with me

Best regards,

Oleg

 

On Sunday, November 4, 2018 at 6:39:37 AM UTC+3, Rick wrote:

Hi,

I totally agree with the idea that Jenkins WeChat running under the community organization. It's fair for every contributor. My dream is that let more and more people join Jenkins party. But I met some situations during the process.

First, I probably must use a personal email to register. I need to receive a verification code to complete the form. But the contact email could be jenkins-chinese-localization-s...@googlegroups.com.

[arch]

Yes, I prefer the service account at first. But this kind of account must base on a company entity. For now, the subscription account is ok.

On Mon, Nov 5, 2018 at 9:10 PM Oleg Nenashev <o.v.ne...@gmail.com> wrote:

That said, where I disagree with Oleg in the email thread linked is that I don't think it's right that Alauda is tied to this account, or any other participant for that matter... I think it's great that Xiaojie is stepping up to the plate. All the powers to him!!  IIUC, that's "subscription account" and not "service account."

My suggestion was based on Rick's preference towards a "service account" in the thread.

Personally I do not have any preference.

I want to register the account as an organization. But I need an organization name and code. Oleg told me that there is not a real entity for Jenkins. I also do some homework about this. So my advice is that we register this account as an individual

Perfectly fine with me

Best regards,

Oleg

 

On Sunday, November 4, 2018 at 6:39:37 AM UTC+3, Rick wrote:

Hi,

I totally agree with the idea that Jenkins WeChat running under the community organization. It's fair for every contributor. My dream is that let more and more people join Jenkins party. But I met some situations during the process.

First, I probably must use a personal email to register. I need to receive a verification code to complete the form. But the contact email could be jenkins-chinese-...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/9fc4a631-95d6-46cc-8567-3a6e8709595e%40googlegroups.com.

[arch]

There is still have a problem with the trademark. I want to use Jenkins as the name of WeChat subscription account name. Do I still need to request the trademark? Actually, I already met the issue. WeChat platform said I need submit the permission of Jenkins trademark.

[Oleg Nenashev]

WeChat platform said I need submit the permission of Jenkins trademark.

Then it would be better to get approval for it tomorrow. It is already in the agenda for the Governance meeting, so I do not expect it to be a problem to get approved.

What is the form of approval you need to get? Would a link to https://wiki.jenkins.io/display/JENKINS/Approved+Trademark+Usage do the job? Or do you need a kind of confirmation letter?

BR, Oleg

You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/jenkinsci-dev/UveOvVO-gwQ/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTFa0vmONtxygeDvmE3cr7wZiK3sEAsH4bbpriCLvbGNoQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[arch]

I would expect a confirmation letter. And It's better to record this in wiki.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAPfivLDLaYZU9%2BGA%2BCaSZOZRDgGiExd2ZoQsYSOAiANYkv15Bg%40mail.gmail.com.

[Olblak]

It's a very good initiative.

The fact that the jenkins project is not an organization is a regular issue especially regarding third service accounts.             

But It's important that several people can access quickly the account and 'reset' the password in case of emergency.

It regularly happen that community initiatives are blocked because one single person is not available for whatever the reason(timezone, vacation, ...).

And we should try to avoid that situation as much as possible.

Would it be a good idea to create a private mailing list 'wechat...@list.jenkins-ci.org' for only 2-3 people and use that email for individual account if it's not possible to have an organisation account?

So several people can be notified by any changes made to that account and we don't have to rely on only one person?   

If I understand correctly,

service account means "one" person has access to the account

subscription account means several people share the same account

And we would go with the service account, right?

---

-> gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key 52210D3D

---

To view this discussion on the web visithttps://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTFvfAKco%3DRxJ6jXCmwX39%2ByexfC1s8TZLwGSZ4dTLberQ%40mail.gmail.com.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

Kohsuke Kawaguchi

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visithttps://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAN4CQ4xu0s7qMZUhx1LJrjKU5BtF2tc8kogsoE3K1e9fdxD6_w%40mail.gmail.com.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/9fc4a631-95d6-46cc-8567-3a6e8709595e%40googlegroups.com.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.

To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/jenkinsci-dev/UveOvVO-gwQ/unsubscribe.

To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTFa0vmONtxygeDvmE3cr7wZiK3sEAsH4bbpriCLvbGNoQ%40mail.gmail.com.

For more options, visithttps://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAPfivLDLaYZU9%2BGA%2BCaSZOZRDgGiExd2ZoQsYSOAiANYkv15Bg%40mail.gmail.com.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTE234B_4p3g4ponc9Tm5Gh0Cavd88iow%2Boh2fZvDdhDOg%40mail.gmail.com.

[arch]

The service account must control by an organization or a company. So I'm going to register the subscription account.

OK, allow me to introduce more details about the WeChat. There are 5 people could running the subscription account by a long term. And there are 20 people could running the account by a short-term (one month). So don't be worry about one person could block.

Another situation is that everyone just could have one WeChat account(personal account). He must bind his bank card, phone number. And I'll be the initial person to running this. We will create a process to share this platform.

Yes, my idea is that create a repository in jenkins-infra. Put all articles on that. Every contributor could create a PR to publish the article. And the good news is that WeChat supports web api. Finally, we will develop a program to publish these articles.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Jenkins Developers" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to jenkinsci-de...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/1541533813.954363.1567849448.586ABBE0%40webmail.messagingengine.com.

[Kohsuke Kawaguchi]

So in the meeting today we reaffirmed that this isn't the case for trademark sublicensing. I took the action to write a signed letter, as per your request, explaining that you are acting on behalf of the rightful owner of the trademark.

I wrote a letter, but the printer at the office is acting out so I can't provide you a signed PDF right now. I'll do that once I get back home later today.

Thanks Rick for clarifying that once created, the subscription account can be operated by multiple personal accounts. It does help with the bus factor problem, we don't have to deal with a shared secret this way.

But I still agree with Olivier, in that I think it's important that the email address tied to the community be used to create an account: wechat-ad...@list.jenkins-ci.org. This isn't meant to exclude you from anything, slow you down, or distrust, but as I understand it, it's a part of the hygiene to ensure the chain of control is connected all the way up to SPI.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAMM7nTFfAF%3Ds8USwNSB-ncU4rCE98eNh%3D6sCZNH9MNeZcFjgCg%40mail.gmail.com.

For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

Kohsuke Kawaguchi

[Kohsuke Kawaguchi]

This is just a thought, but alternatively, if it's easier, we can ask Olivier (or I) to create a WeChat subscription account, deal with whatever authorization process it needs, and add your personal WeChat account as the operator of the Jenkins subscription account.

That might reduce the roundtrips?

--

Kohsuke Kawaguchi

[arch]

I agree with the ideas to use wechat-ad...@list.jenkins-ci.org. Please let me in once you created it. And I think the letter is very important to me and Jenkins Chinese Community. This could let our people know that the Jenkins Community think the WeChat subscription account is valuable and important.

About your suggestion. I'm ok with that. I believe that we all want to build a great Jenkins Chinese Community. It's no matter who will create the account.

In addition, I have another request. I wonder if you (KK, Olivier, Oleg) could write a welcome or introduce text about the WeChat account. First, it's good to let Chinese Jenkins fans know you. Second, I think it's good for getting more focus from my people.

Good wish.

Rick (Zhao Xiaojie)

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/jenkinsci-dev/CAN4CQ4yxoM1%2B_sxfPiqNjHXpgrkV4soA9tm%3DEmH_v3__F7TYnQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[arch]

Hi, KK, Olivier

I'll make a presentation about Jenkins X in KubeCon CloudNativeCon China. I wish I could introduce Jenkins WeChat to other people. So if you are free to help me register Jenkins WeChat subscription account. Here is the register link https://mp.weixin.qq.com/?lang=en_US.

Thanks

Rick (Zhao Xiaojie)

[Kohsuke Kawaguchi]

Signed letter attached.

I've also asked this be added under jenkins.io here, https://github.com/jenkins-infra/jenkins.io/pull/1878 in the hope that this helps reinforce the chain of trust.

--

Kohsuke Kawaguchi

[Olblak]

I tried to create the mail alias but I don't have the correct permission so I sent a request to OSUOSL support.

You can follow the evolution here INFRA-1847

Email had 1 attachment:

• WeChat jenkins account.pdf
  
    155k (application/pdf)
  

[Kohsuke Kawaguchi]

The change was merged, so the content is accessible from http://jenkins.io/wechat.pdf 

--

Kohsuke Kawaguchi

[arch]

Thanks for everyone. Once the email was created I'll continue this.