Nilgiris: Creeper for identification 191112MK01

[Muthu Karthick]

Dear all,

Please help me to identify this creeper plant found on the grasslands of high altitude Nilgiris. Commonly seen on wet soil. Is this Ranunculaceae?

Date: 20 Oct 2012

Place: Mukruti NP, Nilgiris, TN

Alt.: 2350 m asl

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Muthu Karthick, N
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[Gurcharan Singh]

Geranium sp. I hope.

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

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[Gurcharan Singh]

The basic difference between Geranium and Erodium is that leaves of former are palmately lobed and in latter pinnately lobed or divided. The flowers and fruits look similar.

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Pat <pgo...@seghea.com> wrote:

I think it might be Erodium sp. We have a species here, Erodium texanum, that greatly resembles the photo. Erodium is classified with Geranium.

http://www.fireflyforest.com/flowers/category/view-plants/pink-flowers/page/4/

Lower right photo.

The most remarkable feature for identification would be the seed pod, which "looks" like a stork's bill. It has a long, tapering pointed part, resembling a bird's bill, attached to a rounded case. This plant has medicinal uses, and if it is not native, someone may have imported it.

Photos taken west of Phoenix, Arizona. Notice in the middle photograph, upper left, two seed pods.

Pat Goltz
Arizona, USA

[Pat]

I think it might be Erodium sp. We have a species here, Erodium texanum, that greatly resembles the photo. Erodium is classified with Geranium.

http://www.fireflyforest.com/flowers/category/view-plants/pink-flowers/page/4/

Lower right photo.

The most remarkable feature for identification would be the seed pod, which "looks" like a stork's bill. It has a long, tapering pointed part, resembling a bird's bill, attached to a rounded case. This plant has medicinal uses, and if it is not native, someone may have imported it.

Photos taken west of Phoenix, Arizona. Notice in the middle photograph, upper left, two seed pods.

Pat Goltz
Arizona, USA

On 11/19/2012 11:04 AM, Gurcharan Singh wrote:

[Muthu Karthick]

Yes Patji, 

I am sorry for putting up two plants in same post.

First two pics: Erodium moschatum (L.) L' Herit is the only plant reported in Nilgiris for the genus. Next time when I visit the place, I try to look at the bill-like fruits. Attaching one more picture of the same. E. moschatum is a European origin.

The last three pics may be Geranium sp.

[Gurcharan Singh]

Not Erodium Muthu ji as indicated earlier. I have photographed Erodium moschatum here in  California, with much larger pinnate leaves. 

     "ALL SPECIES OF GERANIUM HAVE PALMATELY LOBED LEAVES, AND THOSE OF ERODIUM PINNATE LEAVES"

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 

[Gurcharan Singh]

Muthu ji

If you can send me the list of species of Geranium and Erodium reported from the area, I may help to fix your species.

     Fruits of Geranium and Erodium look simlar with similar beaks.

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

[Pat]

Muthu ji,

No apology needed. It was readily apparent.

Yes, that new photo looks like Erodium. This plant is probably much more widespread than it might seem at first. The only difference between your plant and mine is that the flower of mine is a much more intense color.

One of your earlier photos looked like it had a partly decayed fruit, rather dried up.

Pat Goltz
Arizona, USA

[jmgarg1]

Forwarding again for Id assistance please.

Some earlier relevant feedback:

Geranium sp. I hope. -- Dr. Gurcharan Singh

The basic difference between Geranium and Erodium is that leaves of former are palmately lobed and in latter pinnately lobed or divided. The flowers and fruits look similar. -- Dr. Gurcharan Singh
I think it might be Erodium sp. We have a species here, Erodium texanum, that greatly resembles the photo. Erodium is classified with Geranium.

http://www.fireflyforest.com/flowers/category/view-plants/pink-flowers/page/4/     Lower right photo.     The most remarkable feature for identification would be the seed pod, which "looks" like a stork's bill. It has a long, tapering pointed part, resembling a bird's bill, attached to a rounded case. This plant has medicinal uses, and if it is not native, someone may have imported it.     Photos taken west of Phoenix, Arizona. Notice in the middle photograph, upper left, two seed pods.     Pat Goltz Arizona, USA

Yes Patji,

I am sorry for putting up two plants in same post. First two pics: Erodium moschatum (L.) L' Herit is the only plant reported in Nilgiris for the genus. Next time when I visit the place, I try to look at the bill-like fruits. Attaching one more picture of the same. E. moschatum is a European origin.

The last three pics may be Geranium sp.- from Muthu ji.

Not Erodium Muthu ji as indicated earlier. I have photographed Erodium moschatum here in California, with much larger pinnate leaves. "ALL SPECIES OF GERANIUM HAVE PALMATELY LOBED LEAVES, AND THOSE OF ERODIUM PINNATE LEAVES" -- Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Muthu ji

If you can send me the list of species of Geranium and Erodium reported from the area, I may help to fix your species. Fruits of Geranium and Erodium look simlar with similar beaks. -- Dr. Gurcharan Singh

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J.M.Garg

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[Gurcharan Singh]

These are two different species of Geranum. No question of Erodium, as I have indicated above. I had   uploaded Erodium moschatum and E. cicutarium separately to clear the doubt. 

Please see these

https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!searchin/indiantreepix/erodium/indiantreepix/nQC_uKR6xKQ/3k04Ga2uN8YJ

https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!searchin/indiantreepix/erodium/indiantreepix/7q_M_UeYcA4/oCtgvF-tjkYJ

-- 

Dr. Gurcharan Singh

Retired  Associate Professor
SGTB Khalsa College, University of Delhi, Delhi-110007
Res: 932 Anand Kunj, Vikas Puri, New Delhi-110018.
Phone: 011-25518297  Mob: 9810359089

http://www.gurcharanfamily.com/ 
http://people.du.ac.in/~singhg45/ 

[J.M. Garg]

I could not match these with anyone of the existing species in efi at ‎Geranium.

May I request some one to suggest the Id.

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'

Winner of Wipro-NFS Sparrow Awards 2014 for efloraofindia. 

For identification, learning, discussion & documentation of Indian Flora, please visit/ join our Efloraofindia Google e-group (largest in the world- around 2800 members & 2,65,000 messages on 31.3.17) or Efloraofindia website (with a species database of more than 12,000 species & 2,50,000 images).

The whole world uses my Image Resource of more than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image.

[J.M. Garg]

Thanks, Sasidharan ji.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: sasi, kfri
Date: 19 June 2017 at 15:49
Subject: Re: [efloraofindia:138610] Nilgiris: Creeper for identification 191112MK01
To: "J.M. Garg" <jmg...@gmail.com>

The images are of Geranium nepalense.

N. Sasidharan

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Dr. N. Sasidharan

Emeritus Scientist

Kerala Forest Research Institute, Peechi

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email: sa...@kfri.org, sasimedini...@gmail.com 

[J.M. Garg]

Thanks, Sasidharan ji.

But posted images look different from images of Geranium nepalense Sweet

I am unable to find out Geranium species found in wild in south.

May I request you to pl. let us know, if you are aware.

Further what last three images are of ? 

[Gurcharan Singh]

Forwarding for ID

Distributed as  Geranium species- Mukruti NP, Nilgiris, TN

Group discussion at

Nilgiris: Creeper for identification 191112MK01 (google.com)

[Gurcharan Singh]

Forwarding for ID

Distributed as  Geranium species- Mukruti NP, Nilgiris, TN

Group discussion at

Nilgiris: Creeper for identification 191112MK01 (google.com)

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Muthu Karthick, N <nmk...@gmail.com>
Date: Monday, November 19, 2012 at 3:52:41 PM UTC+5:30
Subject: Nilgiris: Creeper for identification 191112MK01
To: efloraofindia <indian...@googlegroups.com>

[Gurcharan Singh]

Forwarding for ID

Distributed as  Geranium species- Mukruti NP, Nilgiris, TN

Group discussion at

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Muthu Karthick, N <nmk...@gmail.com>
Date: Monday, November 19, 2012 at 3:52:41 PM UTC+5:30
Subject: Nilgiris: Creeper for identification 191112MK01
To: efloraofindia <indian...@googlegroups.com>

[J.M. Garg]

There appears to be some mix up.

1st two images are different and the only option as per species listed in FoPI is Geranium nepalense, to which it appears close, as the other species listed (Geranium ocellatum var. ocellatum and Geranium ocellatum var. himalaicum) look different. 

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With regards,
J.M.Garg