ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

[Arthur Hoffman]

Indian Spring Master Association (ISMA) recently sent out a proposed amendment to the Declaration of Maintenance Covenants and Restrictions for Indian Spring that concerns leases.  Basically, it restricts leases in Indian Spring to those that are at least three months in duration but not more than twelve months. 

There is no statement WHY this amendment is needed beyond a statement that it would prohibit “unwanted leasing within the community.”  Unwanted by whom?

I believe the purpose of this amendment is to prevent short term leases or rentals by those residents who rent their home or condo through AIRBNB (an online marketplace and hospitality service, enabling people to lease or rent short-term lodging including vacation rentals, apartment rentals, homestays, hostel beds, or hotel rooms).  I see no reason to prohibit a resident of Indian Spring who wants to make a few bucks from renting his unit through AIRBNB.  Moreover, I believe ISMA is overreaching and usurping the authority of individual POAs to regulate leases in their community.   ISMA should defer to POAs on this.

Consequently, I shall vote NO to this amendment and I hope you will too. 

Arthur Hoffman

[Art Hoffman]

Irv,

 

Your amendment goes beyond just those POAs governed by ISMA (currently, The Estates and J & J Patio Homes).  It also pertains to POAs that have not addressed leases in their documents.  That is usurping, in my opinion.  I believe in libertarian principles.  Besides, if ISMAs goal was, as you write, to close a gap ... , why does the proxy form give the reason as prohibiting unwanted leasing within the community?

 

Art Hoffman
Boynton Beach, FL

 

From: Irv Jacobs

Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2017 12:11 AM

To: Art Hoffman

Cc: Arthur Kaplan

Subject: FW: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

Art:

 

I think your post below is ill-advised.  If you have read the proposed amendment, you’ll note that it applies to “homes, lots, or condominium units that do not have leasing durations imposed by the governing documents of a sub-association.”  The rationale for the amendment was to close a gap that existed, viz., to apply to those POAs governed directly by ISMA and which do not have their own HOAs.  The provisions of the amendment are no more restrictive and are in fact the same as those in many HOAs, i.e., minimum lease of 3 months and the provisions to renew leases annually.

 

Irv Jacobs

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[Art Hoffman]

Howard,

 

Thanks for your comment.  Too bad you didn’t include indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com in your cc.  That way it would have gone to all subscribers to the BLOG.  That’s what I’m after: to generate conversation in the community.  Now I have with my reply to your email!

 

Art Hoffman
Boynton Beach, FL

From: Howard Needleman

Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2017 6:30 AM

To: Art Hoffman

Cc: Arthur Kaplan

Subject: Re: Fw: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

I believe the rationale of this amendment is to prevent very transient renters from staying in our community...without this amendment, a homeowner could rent their unit to different individuals every day, weekend or any period of time less than 3 months.  I'm in favor of a community-wide amendment and not leaving rental rules it up to the individual POAs.

Howard

 

Howard
Howard L. Needleman
hneed...@post.harvard.edu

(561) 292-3336 - FL
(781) 444-2776 - MA

(617) 939-7773 - C

 

On Wed, Apr 5, 2017 at 7:41 PM, Art Hoffman <ar...@comcast.net> wrote:

 

 

 

From: Art Hoffman

Sent: Wednesday, April 5, 2017 7:20 PM

To: Indian Spring Residents

Subject: Fw: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

Your privacy is important to me.  My policy is to remove any email address from my distribution list if you, the addressee, do not wish to receive these emails.  To remove your email address from this list, just reply to this email with the word REMOVE in the body of the reply.

 

 

 

This is a post on my “BLOG”.  It is being forwarded to you as I have a distribution list which includes your email address.  If you would like to subscribe to my BLOG, just reply to this email with the word “SUBSCRIBE”.

Indian Spring Master Association (ISMA) recently sent out a proposed amendment to the Declaration of Maintenance Covenants and Restrictions for Indian Spring that concerns leases.  Basically, it restricts leases in Indian Spring to those that are at least three months in duration but not more than twelve months. 

There is no statement WHY this amendment is needed beyond a statement that it would prohibit “unwanted leasing within the community.”  Unwanted by whom?

I believe the purpose of this amendment is to prevent short term leases or rentals by those residents who rent their home or condo through AIRBNB (an online marketplace and hospitality service, enabling people to lease or rent short-term lodging including vacation rentals, apartment rentals, homestays, hostel beds, or hotel rooms).  I see no reason to prohibit a resident of Indian Spring who wants to make a few bucks from renting his unit through AIRBNB.  Moreover, I believe ISMA is overreaching and usurping the authority of individual POAs to regulate leases in their community.   ISMA should defer to POAs on this.

Consequently, I shall vote NO to this amendment and I hope you will too.

Arthur Hoffman

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[Howard Needleman]

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[Art Hoffman]

Thanks for your opinion.  Others should opine as well.  And be sure to include indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com in your cc so your opinion is shared with others in the community.

 

Art Hoffman
Boynton Beach, FL

 

From: Babrbra

Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2017 12:31 AM

To: Art Hoffman

Subject: Re: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

I completely disagree with you. Do you really want Indian Spring to become a community of transients? I voted yes and I hope most residents will do the same. Barbara Niad

Sent from my iPad

On Apr 5, 2017, at 7:20 PM, Art Hoffman <ar...@comcast.net> wrote:

Your privacy is important to me.  My policy is to remove any email address from my distribution list if you, the addressee, do not wish to receive these emails.  To remove your email address from this list, just reply to this email with the word REMOVE in the body of the reply.

 

Art Hoffman
Boynton Beach, FL

This is a post on my “BLOG”.  It is being forwarded to you as I have a distribution list which includes your email address.  If you would like to subscribe to my BLOG, just reply to this email with the word “SUBSCRIBE”.

Indian Spring Master Association (ISMA) recently sent out a proposed amendment to the Declaration of Maintenance Covenants and Restrictions for Indian Spring that concerns leases.  Basically, it restricts leases in Indian Spring to those that are at least three months in duration but not more than twelve months. 

There is no statement WHY this amendment is needed beyond a statement that it would prohibit “unwanted leasing within the community.”  Unwanted by whom?

I believe the purpose of this amendment is to prevent short term leases or rentals by those residents who rent their home or condo through AIRBNB (an online marketplace and hospitality service, enabling people to lease or rent short-term lodging including vacation rentals, apartment rentals, homestays, hostel beds, or hotel rooms).  I see no reason to prohibit a resident of Indian Spring who wants to make a few bucks from renting his unit through AIRBNB.  Moreover, I believe ISMA is overreaching and usurping the authority of individual POAs to regulate leases in their community.   ISMA should defer to POAs on this.

Consequently, I shall vote NO to this amendment and I hope you will too.

Arthur Hoffman

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[A Rimler]

I disagree and strongly urge all to vote YES on this.  

The WHY is simple:   it will replace the amendment that had been in effect prior to Sept 2013 when ISMA Bylaws/Governance were revised. The amendment will restrict lease length only for sub-associations that do not have their own Bylaws/Governance regulations, i.e. The Estates and J&J Patio Homes.  If your POA has rules governing length of stay, your rules take precedence over the ISMA rule. 

Here's the biggest problem with the folks who have rented out their homes by the hour/night: do not vet their clients - except to ensure the checks cash.  If you're running a BnB, you need to pay taxes, carry the correct insurance and have the appropriate inspections required by the County.  I do not want a continued string of transients in my community usurping my privacy and security.  You talk big but I doubt you'd rescind the rule defining length of lease and allow hourly/nightly rentals it in your POA.  

Need it any more simply?  It doesn't usurp your liberties to vote YES unless you're renting out your property for less than 90 days.  It helps all other communities enormously. 

[Art Hoffman]

Ann,

 

Thanks for your opinion.  Many others were received that basically agree with you and few - very few - agree with me. 

 

Isn’t democracy great when opinions are offered on issues affecting our community?  Informed voters then make better decisions in my opinion.  And the community benefits.  That’s what this BLOG tries to do.

 

I’ll buy prohibiting un-vetted short term rentals in Indian Spring.  But, I’d leave that up to individual POAs, not ISMA.  To me, it’s a lot like ISMA trying to prohibit Indian Spring residents from using drones for recreational purposes, which was proposed at the last ISMA Board meeting.  Fortunately, it was tabled for further research.  More on this subject later.

 

Art Hoffman
Boynton Beach, FL

 

From: A Rimler

Sent: Thursday, April 6, 2017 2:44 PM

To: Indian Spring in Boynton Beach

Subject: Re: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

--

[A Rimler]

Again, Art, you're missing the point.  It is left up to individual POAs. Who. Have. Their. Own. Rules. And. Regs.  

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[aime...@gmail.com]

Bravo Arthur!

On Wednesday, April 5, 2017 at 7:05:05 PM UTC-4, Arthur Hoffman wrote:

[george tamas]

Mr. Hoffman

I have to respectfully disagree with your opinion. I believe that the intention of the majority of Indian Spring owners when buying in this community was to retire in a nice and quiet community, which Indian Springs is and not to start a hospitality service with the comings and goings this implies.

Thus I will vote yes for this amendment and hope that the majority of the home owners will do the same.

Respectfully

George Tamas

 

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De : indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com> de la part de aime...@gmail.com <aime...@gmail.com>
Envoyé : 13 février 2020 10:35
À : Indian Spring in Boynton Beach <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com>
Objet : Re: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

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[Jack Gross]

Mr. Hoffman,

I must agree with Mr. George Tamas.

Having your unit or home rented out for short term stays will lead to an unwanted element in the community.

If they make noise or trash the area, who is responsible? The Unit owner?

Till you get a remedy you will have angry (elderly) neighbors etc.

In addition they can have a party and invite who knows to the home and this will have a negative effect for all the neighbors.

Who will monitor the age class of those potential short term tenants.

I feel this is a huge mistake and you should revise your opinion to limit renting to 3 month minimum twice a year.

In addition there should be a clause that owner of the unit can and will be fined for full rental value earned during that period if tenant causes disturbance or damage.

Thus I will vote yes for this amendment and hope that the majority of the home owners will do the same.

Respectfully,

Jack & Judy Bregin-Gross

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[josef MARKS]

Although I am not a member of the club and living in IS any longer, I  agree,  with the majority that want to limit the effect of short term tenant..

Joe Marks.

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[dbrownst...@gmail.com]

realistically you will  never be able to stop airbnb or vrbo because they are typically micro-term (2 weeks or less) and do not use a lease as the contract between property owner and renter.  by the time an infraction is discovered, a complaint lodged and mailed to the unit owner, the even will be over and the unit owner back in compliance.  what do we care about those so long as the tenants do not disturb, interrupt, destroy, etc.?

On Wednesday, April 5, 2017 at 7:05:05 PM UTC-4, Arthur Hoffman wrote:

[george tamas]

Mr Brownstein

If we accept your logic, then why have any rules and regulations, what do we do when they disturb, interrupt and destroy etc...I don't think your logic is viable.

George Tamas

Get Outlook for Android

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From: indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of dbrownst...@gmail.com <dbrownst...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2020 4:22:55 PM
To: Indian Spring in Boynton Beach <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

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[Jack Gross]

Dear All,

If we don't allow short term rentals, (a no brainer) then we avoid issues since only home owners 

or responsible long term tenant will be in the development.

Seniors who bought in IS did so for a nice quiet community, not as an income generator.

If anyone wants to be in the rental business, sell at IS and buy outside.

JG

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[David Brownstein]

rules that you cannot enforce have no value except to rile people up. you do have rules about after-hour noise, disturbances, etc. in place and security can summons the offenders in real time and fines can be levied.

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 4:35 PM george tamas <cann...@hotmail.com> wrote:

--

Dave

[David Brownstein]

i'm not saying it's optimum, just realistic and enforceable. 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 4:35 PM george tamas <cann...@hotmail.com> wrote:

--

Dave

[Irv Jacobs]

It’s a done deal, folks.  The amendment was approved overwhelmingly by ISMA’s membership on 04/27/2017.

 

Irv Jacobs

 

From: indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com [mailto:indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of David Brownstein
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2020 4:52 PM
To: george tamas <cann...@hotmail.com>
Cc: Indian Spring in Boynton Beach <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

rules that you cannot enforce have no value except to rile people up. you do have rules about after-hour noise, disturbances, etc. in place and security can summons the offenders in real time and fines can be levied.

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 4:35 PM george tamas <cann...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Mr Brownstein

If we accept your logic, then why have any rules and regulations, what do we do when they disturb, interrupt and destroy etc...I don't think your logic is viable.

George Tamas

Get Outlook for Android

 

---

From: indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of dbrownst...@gmail.com <dbrownst...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2020 4:22:55 PM
To: Indian Spring in Boynton Beach <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

realistically you will  never be able to stop airbnb or vrbo because they are typically micro-term (2 weeks or less) and do not use a lease as the contract between property owner and renter.  by the time an infraction is discovered, a complaint lodged and mailed to the unit owner, the even will be over and the unit owner back in compliance.  what do we care about those so long as the tenants do not disturb, interrupt, destroy, etc.?

On Wednesday, April 5, 2017 at 7:05:05 PM UTC-4, Arthur Hoffman wrote:

Indian Spring Master Association (ISMA) recently sent out a proposed amendment to the Declaration of Maintenance Covenants and Restrictions for Indian Spring that concerns leases.  Basically, it restricts leases in Indian Spring to those that are at least three months in duration but not more than twelve months 

There is no statement WHY this amendment is needed beyond a statement that it would prohibit “unwanted leasing within the community.”  Unwanted by whom?

 

I believe the purpose of this amendment is to prevent short term leases or rentals by those residents who rent their home or condo through AIRBNB (an online marketplace and hospitality service, enabling people to lease or rent short-term lodging including vacation rentals, apartment rentals, homestays, hostel beds, or hotel rooms).  I see no reason to prohibit a resident of Indian Spring who wants to make a few bucks from renting his unit through AIRBNB.  Moreover, I believe ISMA is overreaching and usurping the authority of individual POAs to regulate leases in their community.   ISMA should defer to POAs on this.

 

Consequently, I shall vote NO to this amendment and I hope you will too. 

 

Arthur Hoffman

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Dave

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[george tamas]

Mr Jacobs

Thank you for your input.

Case closed

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From: Irv Jacobs <ir...@verizon.net>
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2020 5:00:24 PM
To: 'David Brownstein' <dbrownst...@gmail.com>; 'george tamas' <cann...@hotmail.com>

Cc: 'Indian Spring in Boynton Beach' <indian-spring-i...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: RE: ISMA floats an amendment on leasing in Indian Spring

 

[Joel Aragona]

Mr Brownstein

I agree that most ABB rentals are so short in duration that the renter may be gone before the issue is noticed, however, it’s likely that someone doing this for income will be repeating the behavior. If that were the case it’s important to have the rules on our side to prevent continuous renting.

If it’s an infrequent one off by just a few it will probably go unnoticed.

JA 

Sent from my iPad

On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:49 PM, george tamas <cann...@hotmail.com> wrote:



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[Arthur Hoffman]

My original posting on this matter was made April 5, 2017.  The amendment passed overwhelming (in spite of my comments).  The amendment establishes a default in Indian Spring that leases must be at least 3 months and not more than 12 months unless the sub-association's documents specify other terms.

The posting generated numerous subsequent posts and even more views.  That was GREAT.  After all, the purpose of this news group or BLOG is to enable the people in the community to express their opinions on matters important to the community.  Communication like that can only benefit the community so we find out what people think.  

On Wednesday, April 5, 2017 at 7:05:05 PM UTC-4, Arthur Hoffman wrote: