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Shawn,
You said the 500 frames are numbered in ascending order from 1928 for the GT frame. I think that is only partially true since I have frame number 2951 made in 1935. I can't believe Guzzi made that few 500cc machines between '28 and '35. Doubt they started with #1 either, maybe #101 or #1001. But what do I know?😕 I've always thought the frames were numbered as you say too..... My GTW is 46146, made in late 1937. Two years and 2951 to 46146 seems unlikely. Makes one wonder where they all went?
Actually, the problem is that the commercial frames and the contract (police/military) frames were numbered differently although the frames are the same. For instance, frame #2951 started out as a 1935 GT17, but it is identical to my GTW. So there is more than one numbering system for the same product and because time has intervened and parts mixed, it is really hard to find out much about production dates even from the factory records.
Not that this all matters very much.....
Cheers,
JerryK
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Shawn, right. frame 7449, engine 46146. Even so, that is still a lot of bikes for 2 years and I don't think Guzzi's production numbers are that high for 500 cc bikes.
JerryK
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Hi all, I am not sure if this adds anything of value but I had my Super Alce checked out against the factory records. Its engine number AV 97221 is and its frame number is AV 30716 and it was sold on the 14th January 1952 to the army in Turin.
Does anyone know how the “two letter and two number” sequence progresses. How does the system progress sequentially from AA 00 onwards?
I have a couple of Cardellinos that have this numbering system.
Cheers
Phil
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On Jul 2, 2021, at 9:32 AM, Steve in Bend, Oregon <bris...@gmail.com> wrote:Sport or Tourismo?<Guzzi Falcone (1).JPG><Guzzi Falcone (3).JPG>
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<Guzzi Falcone (3).JPG><Guzzi Falcone (1).JPG>
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Looks Sport to me.
Low bars, alloy rims, toe brake…..
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That’s interesting because straight cut gears are more efficient for power transfer. Would think they would be found it “Sport” model bikes.
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of Alan Comfort
Sent: Friday, July 02, 2021 10:46 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] Re: How to identify a frame and engine by stamped numbers?
Smoother and faster shifting both up and down is easier with a constant mesh transmission. Helical gears are engaged by dogs rather than straight
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Most motorcycle gearboxes I can think of are constant mesh or sliding pinnion with straight cut gears. Most have helical cut primary gears though.
I did just notice one more difference between Chris’ bike and the photos Steve is sharing in the speedo drive. Chris’ bike uses a telescoping rod to a fitting on the right stanchion. The instrument itself is a Smiths in a black case. Any of the things I noted could have been changed between years or even in running production line changes. Moto Guzzis are nowhere near as bad as early Ducati but as many know, Ducati dealers never knew what they were getting when they uncrated new bikes.
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com]
On Behalf Of Alan Comfort
Sent: Friday, July 02, 2021 11:09 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] Re: How to identify a frame and engine by stamped numbers?
I believe that all of the Guzzi singles had crash boxes until the late forties or early fifties. I wonder if the Dondolinos, Gambalungas, Albatros and other works racers ran constant mesh transmissions in the Fifties? I think that some of the early V7 Sports from the sixties had straight cut gears.
The constant mesh gearbox in my Airone seems to be totally modern when compared to my '37 500S and my Astore/Falcone hybrid.
Alan in Roberts Creek
On Fri, Jul 2, 2021 at 10:50 AM 'Rick Yamane' via Guzzi Singles <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
That’s interesting because straight cut gears are more efficient for power transfer. Would think they would be found it “Sport” model bikes.
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com [mailto:guzzi-...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Alan Comfort
Sent: Friday, July 02, 2021 10:46 AM
To: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] Re: How to identify a frame and engine by stamped numbers?
Smoother and faster shifting both up and down is easier with a constant mesh transmission. Helical gears are engaged by dogs rather than straight
cut gears "crashing" into one another. Hence the term "crash box". The smooth shifting of gears in a crash box requires the input and output shafts to
be turning at the same speed (relatively speaking). It requires a bit more skill and gear changes must be slow and deliberate.
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On Jul 2, 2021, at 10:19 AM, Alan Comfort <alan.c...@gmail.com> wrote:
Visible indicators such as headlight ears, footrest mounts and brake pedal are consistent with the Sport variation. It is relatively easy to convert aTourismo to this configuration, but If it has a domed piston, constant mesh gearbox and a 29mm carb, it's a pretty safe bet that it began life as a Sport.But, as they say: they made X number of Sports and there are only 2X left.Alan in Roberts Creek
On Fri, Jul 2, 2021 at 9:32 AM Steve in Bend, Oregon <bris...@gmail.com> wrote:
Sport or Tourismo?<Guzzi Falcone (1).JPG><Guzzi Falcone (3).JPG>
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Here is another question regards to Frame and Engine Numbers.
We have a 250cc Airone which we are told is a Sport version. However the carb is of the Turismo size so we have some doubts. The engine number is 50178VP and the frame number is VP66EH. Can any of you fine people identify what bit actually is?
Cheers
Phil
From: guzzi-...@googlegroups.com <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Steve in Bend, Oregon
Sent: 05 July 2021 21:25
To: Guzzi Singles <guzzi-...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [guzzi-singles] Re: How to identify a frame and engine by stamped numbers?
Here is the carburetor in question. Seems it is a Tourismo. Thanks to everyone helping identify this bike with such detailed information. Much appreciated.
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Hi,
Thanks for the reply,
I must apologise for getting the engine and frame numbers totally mixed up with another motorcycle. (an 850GT)
The 250 Airone has engine number 81529 and frame number 15540. When purchased, we were told it was an early (1950) Airone Sport.
However it has some mix and match parts fitted which makes it very difficult to pinpoint which model it actually started life as.
Are there any distinguishing features on the motor or frame that would identify the model?
I would welcome any comments or suggestions.
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