Fwd: About Evac

[Jaziar Radianti]

Hi,

I'm trying to build 2 floors building using FDS EVAC. I have a problem that the humans did not enter the egress (doors, stairs that lead to exits in the second floor). I have tried to look at examples that come with FDS and read the recent manual; test the evacuation with stairs in smaller environment. When I expand it to a bigger environment, it doesn't work. What could be the problem? I used FDS 6. And the model is attached.

Thank you in advance,

Dian

[TimoK]

Check the fds+evac web page: http://www.vtt.fi/proj/fdsevac/?lang=en
And there the "Documentation" subpage: http://www.vtt.fi/proj/fdsevac/fdsevac_documents.jsp?lang=en

There you find: How to debug your input file: Readme_InputErrors.txt
and the "Readme_InputErrors.txt" is a link to the readme file.

In Smokeview: Show/Hide => Geometry => Surfaces => Exterior should be taken
away, so you do not see the -z nor +z face of the evacuation meshes as solid
(default color something like yellow).

So, I modified your file as:

&MISC EVACUATION_DRILL=.TRUE. / This you had (at the bottom of the file,
                                I just moved it here, so all these thigs are here.
 Timo: To speed up the initialization phase (just evacuation, no fire now)
&RADI RADIATION=.FALSE. /
 Timo: Plot the guiding flow fields for the evacuation movement
&SLCF PBZ=1.0, QUANTITY='VELOCITY', VECTOR=.TRUE., EVACUATION=.TRUE. /
&SLCF PBZ=4.0, QUANTITY='VELOCITY', VECTOR=.TRUE., EVACUATION=.TRUE. /
 Timo: To debug, do not show inclines, just the true two-dimensional floor plans are shown
 EVSS XB=7.2, 8.0, 9.0, 12.0, 0.9, 1.1, IOR=+1, ID='Landing_0',
      FAC_V0_UP=1.0, FAC_V0_DOWN=1.0, FAC_V0_HORI=1.0,
      HEIGHT=1.4, HEIGHT0=1.4, MESH_ID='EvacMesh1' / pagard
 EVSS XB=8.0,10.38,  10.6,12.0, 0.9,1.1, IOR=-1, ID='FlightUpper',
      FAC_V0_UP=0.4, FAC_V0_DOWN=0.6, FAC_V0_HORI=1.0,
      HEIGHT=3.0, HEIGHT0=1.4, MESH_ID='EvacMesh1', COLOR= 'RED' /

 EVSS XB=8.0,10.38,  9.0,10.4, 0.9,1.1, IOR=+1, ID='FlightLower',
      FAC_V0_UP=0.4, FAC_V0_DOWN=0.6, FAC_V0_HORI=1.0,
      HEIGHT=1.4, HEIGHT0=0.0, MESH_ID='EvacMesh1', COLOR= 'RED' /

After this you can easily see that your doors are not correct. And your stairs (I check
just the left one) is a sealed zone. You have your EVSS defined at the lower mesh,
so the agents should not have any OBST or DOOR (puts automatically an obst) between
the ground floor space and the stairs space, where you have the EVSS. So, make a hole
at the "LeftDoor1st" and modify your doors like:

&HOLE XB= 10.59,10.61,8.99,10.21, 0.8,1.20, EVACUATION=.TRUE. /

&DOOR ID    ='LeftDoor1st',
      IOR    =+1,
      FYI    = 'This is the First left door',
      COLOR    ='ORANGE', EXIT_SIGN=.TRUE.,
      TO_NODE    = 'LeftDoor2end',
      XB    = 10.4,10.4,10.8,12.0, 0.9,1.10,
      XYZ= 10.6,9.6,1.0,
      KEEP_XY    =.TRUE. /

Note: XYZ added so that the "green cone" is put at a place, where the agents can
see it. The default is abut the middle of the XB and now the XB is inside the stairs
so the agents can not see. If you had chosen the stairs to be in the upper mesh
(EVSS in the upper mesh), then your door => door connection would have been
where xyz is now placed and the agents would have seen this door.

 DOOR ID    ='LeftDoor1st',
      IOR    =-1,
      FYI    = 'This is the First left door',
      COLOR    ='ORANGE', EXIT_SIGN=.TRUE.,
      TO_NODE    = 'LeftDoor2end',
      XB    = 10.6,10.6,9.0,10.2, 0.9,1.10,
      KEEP_XY    =.FALSE. /

&DOOR ID= 'LeftDoor2end',
    IOR     = -1,
    FYI    ='This is the second left door',
    COLOR    ='ORANGE', EXIT_SIGN=.FALSE.,
    XB    = 10.6, 10.6, 10.8,12.0 ,3.9,4.1,
     /***JAZIAR REMOVED KEEP XY    = 0.1 , 11.3, 4.0,
 NOTE: XB is now such that the door is at the correct side of
the stairs wall (I changed xb as: x=10.4 => x=10.6)

 DOOR ID= 'LeftDoor2end',
    IOR     = -1,
    FYI    ='This is the second left door',
    COLOR    ='ORANGE', EXIT_SIGN=.FALSE.,
    XB    = 10.4, 10.4, 10.8,12.0 ,3.9,4.1,
    TO_NODE    ='ExitD2-1' /***JAZIAR REMOVED KEEP XY    = 0.1 , 11.3, 4.0,

Now the agents go inside the stair space that is a part of the ground floor. At the
"end of the stairspace" there is a DOOR that moves the agent to an another
door (specified by the TO_NODE) that is located at the same place (x,y), but
one floor up. And the agents go through this door => door and they find themselves
at the upper mesh and there they head towards the exit (the TO_NODE door has
now no exit_sign and no to_node, so the agents do not "accidentally" use the
door => door connection in the wrong way, i.e., going from the upper mesh to the
ground floor mesh.)

So, put the EVSS back and see that they have correct IORs, HEIGHT and HEITH0
parameters so that the agents have correct z-coordinates inside the stairs. And
do similar changes to the right stairs.

TimoK

[Jaziar Radianti]

Hi Timo,

Thanks a lot for your quick answer. I have followed your links and suggestions, implement the changes as you suggested. 

1) If I fully follow your line, I always got this message:

ERROR: Specify orientation of VENT   4, MESH NUMBER  2

2) Sometimes the error message is like this: 

ERROR: DOOR LeftDoor1st KEEP_XY Problem

I changed my lines as follow (just the left side):

&HOLE XB= 10.59,10.61,8.99,10.21, 0.8,1.20, EVACUATION=.TRUE. /

&HOLE XB= 10.59,10.61,10.99,11.99, 0.8,1.20, EVACUATION=.TRUE. /

 

&DOOR ID ='LeftDoor1st',

      IOR =-1,

      FYI = 'This is the First left door',

      COLOR ='ORANGE', EXIT_SIGN=.FALSE.,

      TO_NODE = 'LeftEntr',

      XB = 10.6, 10.6, 9.0, 10.2, 0.9, 1.10,

      XYZ = 11 , 9.6, 1.0,

      KEEP_XY =.FALSE. / 

&ENTR ID='LeftEntr', IOR=+1,

      FYI= 'Comment line',

      COLOR='RED',

      XB= 10.6,10.6, 10.4,12.2, 3.9,4.10, /

&DOOR ID= 'LeftDoor2end',

IOR = +1,

FYI ='This is the second left door',

COLOR ='ORANGE', EXIT_SIGN=.FALSE.,

XB = 10.4, 10.4, 10.8,12.0 ,3.9,4.1,

        XYZ = 10.2 , 11.4, 4.0,

TO_NODE ='ExitD2-1',

        KEEP_XY =.FALSE. / 

&EXIT ID='ExitD2-1', 

XB = 60.0, 61.2, 6.0, 6.0, 3.9, 4.1, 

XYZ     = 60.6, 6, 4, 

COLOR = 'YELLOW',

IOR = -2/     

&HOLE XB=  59.95, 61.15, 5.59, 6.3, 3.00, 5.00, EVACUATION=.TRUE./

See the results in the attachment. Note that the doors in the right side is WITHOUT &HOLE and in the leftside is WITH &HOLE. The agents entered the second floor from both sides but they did not enter the stairs  (whether or not the have door holes). Do I have to reduce the speed of the agents? or EVSS parameters?

Thanks a lot for your advise!

Kind Regards,

Dian

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[TimoK]

Well, attached is the file that I modified last week. It runs nicely with Version: FDS 6.1.1,
Compilation Date : Thu, 10 Jul 2014. Well "nice" means that no input errors or warnings.

ERROR: Specify orientation of VENT   4, MESH NUMBER  2

Well, that error you should not get. If you get it, then it is some kind of a bug.
For the DOORs and EXITs there should always be a solid OBST behind automatically
in FDS6 style evacuation input. I force "permit_hole=.false." for these automatic
OBSTs that are sometimes needed behind the doors. But it might be, that these
automatic OBSTs are just put there, if there is no "usual user given OBST" there already.
So, it might be that some HOLE is taking away the OBST behind some EXIT/DOOR.
But as I said, this is a kind of a bug that should be fixed. So, could you submit an Issue
to the Issue Tracker, where you attach an input file, that produces this error. And please,
tell also the FDS version and svn number and compilation date that are shown at the
beginning of the CHID.out file.

KEEP_XY Problem: This means that the XBs of the DOOR => DOOR (or DOOR => ENTR)
connection do not match or the IORs are not correct. If you want the agents to keep their
position "sideways" when going through the door=>door connection, then your doors
should be at the same position "sideways"  and they should same width also. If
you move the agents to "some other position", which means that the agents (x,y)
coordinates can not be changed continuously, then you should set KEEP_XY=.FALSE.
for this connection. The default is KEEP_XY=.TRUE. (if I remember correctly). This means
that the agents "just jump upwards/downwards" when going throug the door=>door connection.
Well, they jump also a little bit forward in the connection, because the agents are put not at
the target door XB line, but a little bit away from this line, so that they do not touch the
door. The door XB line is a solid wall, so the agent body "ellipse" can not be inside a
solid wall => the agent should be placed to an empty space in front of the door.

TimoK