Cannot reset embargo date

[Carolyn Sullivan]

Hello,

I'm trying to reset an embargo date on a bitstream, following the documentation provided here under 'Embargo an item via edit item' : https://wiki.lyrasis.org/display/DSDOC7x/Embargo+an+item

The trouble is, EVERY TIME we try to reset the embargo, it appears to save, but then reverts to the original embargo date.  For example, I go into Edit Item > Status > Authorizations:

Then I try to edit the start date:

I edit it to 2025-03-01.  I save it.  

The notification box in the upper right-hand corner tells me 'Operation successful'.  All lies.  I check the Start date:

The embargo start date remains completely unchanged :O  

Please, if anyone knows WHY this is happening or how to fix it, help.  I am seriously at a loss.  Attempts to add an additional policy of Type_Custom have been unsuccessful.

Best,

Carolyn Sullivan

uOttawa Libraries

[Lrellis D'erth]

Hello Kimberly,

Thanks so much for your response.  I'm trying to have the embargo lifted on the date March 1, 2025, and I want the material not to be visible to anyone but the administrators.  I'm basing this off the behaviour I see in the embargoed materials that we've migrated from version 6.3 that already have an embargo applied.  For example, no link appears for this particular thesis, and the bitstream policy reads:

I see though that I put 'Administrator' for group in the policy I was trying to configure instead of Anonymous... maybe that's the issue...?  Nope

.

Okay, weirdly though, the directions to put the embargo lift date in 'End Date' seem to work for editing the bitstream embargo in NEW submissions, ie:

It really doesn't make sense.  Plus, it's kind of counter-intuitive that when a user submits an embargo for an item (not a bitstream, mind), they put the date in the start date window:

It's just extremely bizarre.

Suggestions?

Thanks,

Carolyn.

On Thu, Mar 7, 2024 at 12:48 PM Chapman, Kimberly A - (kimberlychapman) <kimberl...@arizona.edu> wrote:

Hi Carolyn,

 

I’m a little confused by your screenshots which show you adding an embargo start date rather than an embargo end date. (The wiki instructions you sent show adding information to the embargo end date.)

 

Can you clarify if you are trying to start the embargo on the date you’ve indicated (does that mean the item is available now and you want to embargo it in the future? I have heard of use cases for that but we don’t do that here, so I’m trying to understand what I’m seeing on your screen). Or do you want to end the embargo on that date?

 

All best,

 

Kimberly

 

From: dspace-c...@googlegroups.com <dspace-c...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Carolyn Sullivan
Sent: Thursday, March 7, 2024 9:23 AM
To: DSpace Community <dspace-c...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [EXT][dspace-community] Cannot reset embargo date

 

External Email

Hello,

 

I'm trying to reset an embargo date on a bitstream, following the documentation provided here under 'Embargo an item via edit item' : https://wiki.lyrasis.org/display/DSDOC7x/Embargo+an+item

 

The trouble is, EVERY TIME we try to reset the embargo, it appears to save, but then reverts to the original embargo date.  For example, I go into Edit Item > Status > Authorizations:

 

Then I try to edit the start date:

I edit it to 2025-03-01.  I save it.  

The notification box in the upper right-hand corner tells me 'Operation successful'.  All lies.  I check the Start date:

The embargo start date remains completely unchanged :O  

 

Please, if anyone knows WHY this is happening or how to fix it, help.  I am seriously at a loss.  Attempts to add an additional policy of Type_Custom have been unsuccessful.

 

Best,

Carolyn Sullivan

uOttawa Libraries

 

 

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[Lrellis D'erth]

Addend to my original message:

Looking at this part of the documentation, it appears that you SHOULD be able to alter the value for the embargo date, unless I'm misinterpreting it... 

'Thus, although an administrator can assign a new value to the metadata field holding the terms after the item has been installed, this will have no effect on the embargo, whose 'force' now resides entirely in the 'lift date' value. For this reason, you cannot embargo content already in your repository (at least using standard tools). '

https://wiki.lyrasis.org/display/DSDOC7x/Business+Logic+Layer#BusinessLogicLayer-Authorization (see 'Embargo Model and Life Cycle', #2 Terms Interpretation/Imposition).

Very odd!

[Jorge Gustavo Spertino]

Hello everyone,

In my opinion I think you have explained it very well.

Always according to my knowledge to try to generate a "standard" embargo; The action must take into account the anonymous group but not the administrator group.

And the second thing is that effectively, the end date of the embargo is the start date of the reading permission, so when we include a start date for the reading permission, it is effectively the end date of the embargo for the group in question, date on which you can begin to see the object.

I don't see any contradiction, although it is true that it can be a bit confusing until you understand the logic.

My cordial greetings,

Jorge

FAMAF, National University of Córdoba

[Lrellis D'erth]

Hello Jorge,

How do I change an embargo that was created when the object was submitted to my repository though?  And why does the official documentation say that we should put the embargo lift date in the 'End date' field instead of the 'Start date' field, when all of the materials migrated into the repository have embargo in the start date field?

Thanks,

Carolyn.

[Jorge Gustavo Spertino]

Hello Carolyn,

I don't think I could help you with that. Apologies really. I think I understand what you're saying, but I don't have that knowledge. Just looking at the example that was shown, I made the observations that I thought were convenient to make from the administrative interface. But I don't know how to act from the configuration.

Following the example that was presented only as an idea, I could say that perhaps by creating a second policy for the object, and later deleting the original, the system allows you to do it and you can solve that problem in that specific record.

Additionally, I don't know the context, and I don't know if in this section you have any configuration that conflicts with the operation you want to perform.

My cordial greetings,

Jorge

[Lrellis D'erth]

Thanks.  Unfortunately, this also doesn't seem to work :/

[Fitchett, Deborah]

The instructions at https://wiki.lyrasis.org/display/DSDOC7x/Embargo+an+item referring to the end date just look wrong to me. In their example with an Anonymous policy with no dates, and an Admin policy with an end date, I’d expect Anon users would be able to always access the bitstream, and Admin users would theoretically be prevented from accessing the bitstream after that date (but in practice wouldn’t be prevented because they’re admins).

 

The documentation at https://wiki.lyrasis.org/display/DSDOC7x/Embargo#Embargo-ManagingEmbargoesonexistingItems only refers (as I’d expect) to editing the start date.

 

The behaviour you describe looks like a bug that we initially saw when we were first implementing v7.4. Our host/support folk solved it for us so I don’t know the technical details sorry (except that I had ruled out local caching issues by testing in incognito browsers and different devices). But if it helps, I’ve got a note that while they were working on it, we had a temporary workaround of adding a new policy from scratch and then deleting the old one….

 

Deborah

 

From: dspace-c...@googlegroups.com <dspace-c...@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Lrellis D'erth
Sent: Saturday, March 9, 2024 7:54 AM
To: Jorge Gustavo Spertino <jgspe...@gmail.com>; DSpace Community <dspace-c...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [dspace-community] Cannot reset embargo date

 

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Hello Jorge,

 

How do I change an embargo that was created when the object was submitted to my repository though?  And why does the official documentation say that we should put the embargo lift date in the 'End date' field instead of the 'Start date' field, when all of the materials migrated into the repository have embargo in the start date field?

 

Thanks,

Carolyn.

 

 

On Fri, Mar 8, 2024 at 12:11 PM Jorge Gustavo Spertino <jgspe...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello everyone,

 

In my opinion I think you have explained it very well.

 

Always according to my knowledge to try to generate a "standard" embargo; The action must take into account the anonymous group but not the administrator group.

 

And the second thing is that effectively, the end date of the embargo is the start date of the reading permission, so when we include a start date for the reading permission, it is effectively the end date of the embargo for the group in question, date on which you can begin to see the object.

 

I don't see any contradiction, although it is true that it can be a bit confusing until you understand the logic.

My cordial greetings,

Jorge

 

 

FAMAF, National University of Córdoba

 

El jue, 7 mar 2024 a las 13:22, Carolyn Sullivan (<lrelli...@gmail.com>) escribió:

Hello,

 

I'm trying to reset an embargo date on a bitstream, following the documentation provided here under 'Embargo an item via edit item' : https://wiki.lyrasis.org/display/DSDOC7x/Embargo+an+item

 

The trouble is, EVERY TIME we try to reset the embargo, it appears to save, but then reverts to the original embargo date.  For example, I go into Edit Item > Status > Authorizations:

 

Then I try to edit the start date:

I edit it to 2025-03-01.  I save it.  

The notification box in the upper right-hand corner tells me 'Operation successful'.  All lies.  I check the Start date:

The embargo start date remains completely unchanged :O  

 

Please, if anyone knows WHY this is happening or how to fix it, help.  I am seriously at a loss.  Attempts to add an additional policy of Type_Custom have been unsuccessful.

 

Best,

Carolyn Sullivan

uOttawa Libraries

 

 

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[Jorge Gustavo Spertino]

Hello,

It seems to me that the first problem that is noticed in the presentation of the initial case through the screenshots sent by the colleague is that; For the bitstream block, the policy for anonymous has disappeared, and that is what causes an anonymous user to not be able to see the bitstream.

In this policy, unless another rule exists, a read permission will always be created by default for the anonymous user. If this policy at the bitstream level does not exist explicitly for the anonymous user, in my opinion, he will not be able to see it, and if, as in this case, it is restricted for the administrator user, then no one will be able to see it.

In this particular case, it would seem that this policy was edited at the time, and the anonymous group was changed to administrator, in addition to restricting the read permission. That's why the block for anonymous probably won't appear. Or perhaps the collection in general was even restricted from reading permission for anonymous.

The strange thing is that it doesn't let you create a new policy, except perhaps as a possibility that you don't have permissions on the administrator group and only have permissions on the particular community or collection, in which case you could access to see the policy, but perhaps not modify the existing one regarding the administrator group. I can't think of any other options at the moment, although there surely are.

Kind regards, Jorge

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