The Open Discovery Institute(ODIN) is Opening a DIYBio Store Soon!

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Josiah Zayner

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Apr 25, 2014, 2:22:35 AM4/25/14
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Hey everybody.
I have been working hard lately to build a store that provides consumables and materials and equipment to small labs and DIYBio people and it is almost ready to open.
You can check out some of the initial stuff that will be available at http://www.the-odin.com
I probably will not start shipping things till June so know that if you order and pay for anything don't expect to receive it next week.
I am still in the process of purchasing more things and adding more things to the store but I need help and feedback. So I figure before it was really open I would look to this list.

What things do you want to see in the store? (some equipment is coming i.e. refurbished PCR machines, Microcentrifuges they just need to be tested and shit)

Do you think the prices on the website are reasonable? Would you be willing to pay more or rather it be less?

Is there a country that you would like me to find shipping quotes to?

One thing I am having a problem obtaining is gel boxes and power supplies. Both of these I have made myself before for < $5 each but I would not sell them to anyone as they are pieces of shit. Does anyone know where? how? to obtain gel electrophoresis setups(box, tray, power supply) for < $100. Anyone out there know anything about manufacturing? I mean I can find platinum wire for pretty cheap and install it myself if I can just have the boxes.gel trays made and banana plugs installed.

Any other questions.comments?

Also, feel free to email me directly at:
josiah....@nasa.gov

Thanks,
     Josiah


Dan

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Apr 25, 2014, 3:39:38 AM4/25/14
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Truly great. Thank you for all the hard work and cheap prices. Love light dark plasmids and antibiotic project.
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Nathan McCorkle

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Apr 25, 2014, 3:42:53 AM4/25/14
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Looks good,
Maybe add some more in-line(syringe) filters... I was looking at
getting a box of these... they seem like the upper end of the spectrum
as far as chemical resistance:
http://www.amazon.com/Whatman-6900-2502-Sterile-Syringe-Filter/dp/B007KN00ZA/ref=sr_1_11?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1381868480&sr=1-11&keywords=0.2+micron#productDescription

$3 for PVDF seems reasonable, maybe overkill for some applications,
could be cheap for times when you aren't sure and don't want you
filter melting and contaminating downstream stuff...


Are those ladder prices for real? That's a really good price! I'll
need 10bp ladder soon, though I doubt there'd be enough demand for you
to stock that. (but let me know if there is!)
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Cory Tobin

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Apr 25, 2014, 5:43:42 AM4/25/14
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> Do you think the prices on the website are reasonable? Would you be willing
> to pay more or rather it be less?

Prices look good. If you make shipping really easy and are willing to
ship to residential addresses you could probably charge a little more
for the convenience. So many lab supply companies are set up to
service universities and make it difficult for the rest of us to order
from them. Some companies will only ship with a required signature.
I'm not at my home 24/7 to sign for packages so that's a problem. And
many refuse to ship to residential addresses, even if the order is
just a bottle of agarose. Make it easy for us and we'll buy from you
even if the price is a little inflated.



> One thing I am having a problem obtaining is gel boxes and power supplies.
> Both of these I have made myself before for < $5 each but I would not sell
> them to anyone as they are pieces of shit. Does anyone know where? how? to
> obtain gel electrophoresis setups(box, tray, power supply) for < $100.
> Anyone out there know anything about manufacturing? I mean I can find
> platinum wire for pretty cheap and install it myself if I can just have the
> boxes.gel trays made and banana plugs installed.

Check out IORodeo.com They have unassembled gel boxes for ~$50 but
they also give away the design files so you could have the parts laser
cut yourself. If you dig around on their BitBucket site they have
some python code that will spit out design files for a gel box of
arbitrary dimensions.


-cory

Patrik D'haeseleer

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Apr 25, 2014, 6:37:54 AM4/25/14
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Gel boxes can be improvised from a plastic food container, so $50 for laser cut acrylic is still overkill. A gel box that could be stamped out for a couple bucks from vacuum formed plastic would be awesome.

A good DIY electrophoresis power supply is still lacking though. IORodeo has a nice $65 kit, but at that price, I'd love to be able to go above 100V, have a current or power readout, and/or an option to switch between constant voltage, current or power. 

Any decent electrical engineer can design a power supply to whatever specs you want. Someone who knows how to work with the hardware manufacturers in China or Mexico could in theory build a power supply like that for well under $100. Assuming you can get the volume - but if you undercut the professional power supplies by more than an order of magnitude, that may be possible...

Patrik

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 25, 2014, 11:12:26 AM4/25/14
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Of course I will ship to residential addresses that is the whole point!

Yep, all current prices are for real. The prices will fluctuate though based on the supplier prices. Also, at the moment I am more trying to get stuff out there instead of make a shit ton of money. Still working a day job as I can't imagine the demand is very very high at the moment for all these things. But who knows?

Nathan, I will look into the 10bp ladder for ya'.

I agree with Patrik. $50 is overkill for a gel box without the platinum wire. The plastic should cost < $5 and maybe $5 to assemble and then the platinum wire should cost ~$10



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Koeng

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Apr 25, 2014, 5:09:33 PM4/25/14
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Looks great! I just placed an order... it is AMAZING that you have the lambda red recombination plasmids because it was getting difficult for me to apply some of the stuff I am using for a minimal Bacillus for E coli (since i am removing so many genes the natural competence is the only advantage: but I can't neglect that that E coli is a great tool as well)

BTW: I think it would be great if you expanded the strains area: I think there should be like one Bacillus strain in there (I know you don't like Bacillus that much, but for somethings it would be better because of natural competence but most of all sporulation (I killed my strains of E coli quite some time ago because of neglect, getting a DH5a from the store). 

Also expansion of the plasmid page would be useful... The 2 plasmids you have there are actually 2 I have been looking for xD but I think some other people would enjoy plasmids like pUC19 or pUC18, or some lambda lysogens, or maybe pSB1C3 

It would also be cool if people who make plasmids for DIYbio could deposit plasmids then you resell them, kinda like addgene, but with the ability to ship to residential address. Also would be pretty profitable: Just sell each plasmid for like 10-50 bucks. If it was 10 I would buy every new plasmid that came :) just incase.

-Koeng

Koeng

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Apr 25, 2014, 5:11:27 PM4/25/14
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if you need a 10bp ladder, can't you just order a 10bp primer and run that? I get an almost visable smear when I do pcrs (I add a lot of primer because I am lazy and it usually works) for 40bp primers. 

Nathan McCorkle

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Apr 25, 2014, 5:15:14 PM4/25/14
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On Fri, Apr 25, 2014 at 2:11 PM, Koeng <koen...@gmail.com> wrote:
> if you need a 10bp ladder, can't you just order a 10bp primer and run that?

a 10bp ladder would mean fragments of increasing length in increments
of 10bp. so 10 to probably 100 or 150bp.

Koeng

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Apr 25, 2014, 5:32:42 PM4/25/14
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Sorry, I kinda interpreted that wrong ... I was wondering what you could be doing with 10bp of DNA. 

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 25, 2014, 5:42:55 PM4/25/14
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The plasmid.strain stock is great idea! I have been talking to people about making this happen because the $65 of addgene is awful.
Currently, I am just offering ones I think would be useful. I also have pUC19 and many others and obviously the list will grow.
I think allowing people to sell their own plasmids.strains would be great and hopefully I can make that happen later in the year.
I am attempting to keep the prices low at the moment to make things available so I don't want $50 plasmids... yet. At least until things get established and I have a workflow.
Because this is a registered.licensed company if you need specific chemicals or something that is non-hazardous I would be glad to purchase it and ship it to you. I think that is the biggest problem with Science. Companies not even willing to ship NaCl to a residential address because of some guidelines made by a board of directors that have never done Science, that make no sense to me.



On Friday, April 25, 2014 2:15:14 PM UTC-7, Nathan McCorkle wrote:

Cory Tobin

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Apr 25, 2014, 6:44:25 PM4/25/14
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> Of course I will ship to residential addresses that is the whole point!

Cool, just making sure :) As long as I don't have to wait at home to
sign for the delivery I'll definitely send some business your way.
Ain't nobody got time for dat.


> I agree with Patrik. $50 is overkill for a gel box without the platinum
> wire. The plastic should cost < $5 and maybe $5 to assemble and then the
> platinum wire should cost ~$10

Yeah, 50 is overkill. I just mentioned laser-cut acrylic since a lot
of hackerspaces seem to have laser cutters these days, so you may have
access to one for cheap. Otherwise vacuum forming is probably the way
to go.


One other random idea - lyophilized enzymes. I know it's possible
because Genomikon ships their T4 ligase lyophilized in little PCR
tubes and I've also seen lysozyme shipped in bulk that way. I'm not
sure how cheap/easy it is, though. It would be super convenient for
people who don't have access to a -20 freezer; store it in their frig
and rehydrate a small amount when they need it. Although, maybe
enzymes actually survive hydrated in a refrigerator for a long time,
I've never tried.


-cory

Koeng

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Apr 25, 2014, 6:49:38 PM4/25/14
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Btw when it comes to enzymes I actually have a few expression strains for common enzymes that use the maltose binding protein if you are interested. I never tested them though, got distracted with other projects.

I have SpeI (not cloned yet), T5 exonuclease, Taq, and I think i have T4 ligase somewhere around. (Was cloning all the enzymes for gibson assembly/ biobricks)

Also i am thinking of synthesizing pfu polymerase, so if you purify enzymes in house I would be willing to send ya an expression strain. (with a trade of some of the produced enzymes)

-Koeng

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 25, 2014, 7:11:41 PM4/25/14
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The thing is that most enzymes especially polymerases can last at RT. They are thermostable.... and most restriction enzymes are used at 37C and they don't die. I have never actually tested how most restriction enzymes will react but i definitely will and I think it will be on the positive side. That they don't need to be shipped cold. 

I have a Taq strain and plasmid that I will put it on the website but purchasing enzymes is just really cheap and I can't compete with the prices that suppliers have. 

Also, no time for testing at the moment. But I would be glad to host plasmids and strains just give me a month or two to work it out.



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Mega [Andreas Stuermer]

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Apr 26, 2014, 3:59:58 PM4/26/14
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How long wil the shoping cart keep the information? I filled it, but will order in a few weeks. Do I have to choose againg? 

Btw, the pipette tipes come sterilized? 

Can you send the shoping cart to a friend via email :D 

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 26, 2014, 5:24:56 PM4/26/14
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If you create an account it should store your cart indefinitely. Otherwise it is cookie based. So if you kill your cookies you lose your cart.
You cannot share your cart but you can create a wish-list and share that.

The pipette tips may or may not be sterilized. If you are looking for RNAse free pipette tips only choose the ones that are listed as that. 
If you mean autoclaved pipette tips, I probably will not carry those unless there is a great need as anyone can just stick the tips in an autoclave. If you don't have access to an autoclave you can use a conventional oven at ~74C(165F) for 30-60 minutes and it will sterilize them. Maybe I will just autoclave them to save people time? We will see. Just make sure you read the description before your purchase it should state the condition.




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Andreas Stuermer

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Apr 26, 2014, 5:31:48 PM4/26/14
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Ok thanks!


Actually, my order will be for a project partner. I'll send him a pipette and tips. He hasn't molecular bio knowledge AFAIK, but that's not important.
Maybe he has a pressure cooker, but maybe he also has reservations sterilizing bio equipment in a food container.

Why don't dou add 2$ to the prize and sell it autoclaved (including thd heavy metal tape to show it has been sterilized)
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Aaron Vollrath

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Apr 27, 2014, 2:06:58 AM4/27/14
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>>The thing is that most enzymes especially polymerases can last at RT. They are thermostable.... and most restriction enzymes are used at 37C and they don't die. I have never actually tested how most restriction enzymes will react but i definitely will and I think it will be on the positive side. That they don't need to be shipped cold.

"A larger trial of 23 different restriction enzymes held at room temperature for one week showed that all enzymes retained significant activity. As a practical demonstration of the usefulness of this finding, enzymes were posted to Africa by conventional mail (cost $1 US) and shown to retain activity upon arrival after three weeks in transit (compared to a cost of $1000 US by cold-chain transportation)"

http://www.biotechniques.com/multimedia/archive/00011/00293st06_11772a.pdf


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Josiah Zayner

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Apr 27, 2014, 2:19:24 AM4/27/14
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Avery louie

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Apr 27, 2014, 3:03:37 AM4/27/14
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Master mix on the other hand, may not be a thing you want to ship wet/warm.  The enzymes could act on the DNTPs.  Still, a wet, two part mix could probably work.

--A


Josiah Zayner

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Apr 27, 2014, 3:14:14 AM4/27/14
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Avery: maybe. but without primers I don't see that being very dramatic.

Anyways, it ships fine I am not worried about the polymerase.master mix and I guess not restriction enzymes either now.


Mega [Andreas Stuermer]

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Apr 27, 2014, 3:44:39 AM4/27/14
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I would fear that ATP and its friends would decay. A proff told me the half live of the dNTPs is just 15 mins at room temp. AMP inhibits the PCR then?

Avery louie

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Apr 27, 2014, 3:45:07 AM4/27/14
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It has certainly worked fine in the past.

--A


Mega [Andreas Stuermer]

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Apr 27, 2014, 3:45:50 AM4/27/14
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Tat's why you freeze the ligase buffer, btw. ATP is needed by the ligase

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 27, 2014, 4:11:54 AM4/27/14
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Hydrolysis of phosphodiesters has a half life of > 100,000 years in DNA.

I can't believe dNTPs degrade in 15 minutes at RT unless of course you know of some data to back this up but this is also off topic and besides the point as I said. It has been tested and there is no issue with shipping the master mixes.


On Sun, Apr 27, 2014 at 12:45 AM, Mega [Andreas Stuermer] <masters...@gmail.com> wrote:
Tat's why you freeze the ligase buffer, btw. ATP is needed by the ligase
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Cathal Garvey

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Apr 27, 2014, 4:53:10 AM4/27/14
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I don't have data to point either way, but phosphodiester bonds in DNA
are a 1:1 sugar:phosphate ratio, whereas ATP is 1:3, with the phosphates
daisy-chained directly to one another. There's a strong electrostatic
force pushing ATP apart, that's where the energy comes from when it's split.

So, I'd expect ATP, a very high-energy molecule, to have a much shorter
half-life than DNA even ignoring the redox potential of ATP outside of a
reductive cell environment.
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Koeng

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Apr 27, 2014, 10:52:49 AM4/27/14
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Just take some mastermix, leave it at room temperature for a week, then take it out and test it against mastermix that has been frozen all that time.

Anyone got any mastermix?

John Griessen

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Apr 27, 2014, 11:58:50 AM4/27/14
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On 04/25/2014 05:44 PM, Cory Tobin wrote:
>> Of course I will ship to residential addresses that is the whole point!
> Cool, just making sure:) As long as I don't have to wait at home to
> sign for the delivery I'll definitely send some business your way.
> Ain't nobody got time for dat.

Not doing delivery signatures is more convenient and good sense for under $200 shipments.
But losing one would hurt. "They" say that 1 in 500 (0.2%) of USPS packages get lost, so some insurance
that costs 1% of value makes money for the insurer and keeps you from taking the hit randomly
too often or getting some fraud attack, and they investigate the fraud and are set up for it.

In my fledgling kit business I sometimes insure packages with this 3rd party -- insurepost.com.
I have not gotten above maybe 4 sales per month yet, so I use it one at a time with trackable
shipments. If you get above one a day, they have a subscription for $30 (AFAI recall) you could
switch to and then no filling forms per shipment. The forms are only 4 choices, cut and paste
the tracking number, pay with a paypal link and login, so it takes several minutes, but I just figure that
as part of the shipping process.

More power to your venture and I hope it goes above 50 sales per month really soon!

I'll think about some good semi UV clear plastic, (polypropylene?), for molding a gel box that
can be illuminated from below with UV. UV degrades polypropylene, especially when it is not pigmented,
but if inexpensive enough and easy to transfer the Pt wire... How bad is stainless steel wire?
Does polycarbonate vacuum form? probably...
Still finishing up some construction work, so not this week, but I will be active in kit
manufacturing soon instead of just to blather on this list.

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 27, 2014, 1:57:38 PM4/27/14
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Thanks John I will check that out.
What kind of kits do you sell.make?

John Griessen

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Apr 27, 2014, 2:20:29 PM4/27/14
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On 04/27/2014 12:57 PM, Josiah Zayner wrote:
> Thanks John I will check that out.
> What kind of kits do you sell.make?

So far just a plugin extender cable kit for Tektronix 7xxx scopes,
but it sells in Europe, Oz, and the US/Canada.

Dan

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Apr 27, 2014, 4:13:15 PM4/27/14
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We do at LAB I'll be there in 20 minutes.

Josiah Zayner

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Apr 27, 2014, 4:24:06 PM4/27/14
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Hey Dan, thanks. 
I will have gel pictures to post soon. I ran a PCR with some 2x Taq Master Mix that has been at room temp for about a week and it worked fine. Now I am running it again with extra dNTPs to see if it is dNTP limited. 


Andreas Stuermer

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Apr 27, 2014, 5:39:54 PM4/27/14
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A week is fine, but if you have the time try to keep it at RT for a month. Then there will be no doubt ;) 



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Patrik D'haeseleer

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May 2, 2014, 3:25:06 PM5/2/14
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Newb pipette questions:

What does it mean that your pipettes are "H series", rather than the P series I tend to see around more commonly? And how do you think yours compare to the $44 pipettes that Mac Cowell is selling?

Also, any recommendation on what brand pipette tips will work with these? Matching pipettes and pipette tips has proven to be a big headache, given the amount of mismatched second hand and donated equipment we're working with.

It would be awesome if someone could do a good side-by-side review of the low-end pipette options, including what tips they are compatible with. Maybe toss in one of Carolina's $150 pipettes as well.

Patrik



On Thursday, April 24, 2014 11:22:35 PM UTC-7, Josiah Zayner wrote:
Hey everybody.
I have been working hard lately to build a store that provides consumables and materials and equipment to small labs and DIYBio people and it is almost ready to open.
You can check out some of the initial stuff that will be available at http://www.the-odin.com
I probably will not start shipping things till June so know that if you order and pay for anything don't expect to receive it next week.
I am still in the process of purchasing more things and adding more things to the store but I need help and feedback. So I figure before it was really open I would look to this list.

What things do you want to see in the store? (some equipment is coming i.e. refurbished PCR machines, Microcentrifuges they just need to be tested and shit)

Do you think the prices on the website are reasonable? Would you be willing to pay more or rather it be less?

Is there a country that you would like me to find shipping quotes to?

One thing I am having a problem obtaining is gel boxes and power supplies. Both of these I have made myself before for < $5 each but I would not sell them to anyone as they are pieces of shit. Does anyone know where? how? to obtain gel electrophoresis setups(box, tray, power supply) for < $100. Anyone out there know anything about manufacturing? I mean I can find platinum wire for pretty cheap and install it myself if I can just have the boxes.gel trays made and banana plugs installed.

Any other questions.comments?

Also, feel free to email me directly at:
josiah....@nasa.gov

Thanks,
     Josiah


Josiah Zayner

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May 2, 2014, 5:14:38 PM5/2/14
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Hey what's up Patrik?

I have used these pipettes for a while in my home lab. Have tested their repeatability and precision and they work great. The H Series is really no different than the P series. They will use the same pipette tips and everything. I will add to the pipette tip descriptions which pipettes they match.

If you are looking for stuff for the labs send me an email and I will try and help you out.

Also, because you are so close anything that doesn't match you can just exchange back to me.

Josiah

Mega [Andreas Stuermer]

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May 5, 2014, 4:08:31 AM5/5/14
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Hi!  a UV lamp for seeing GFP and EGFP would be nice. Beginners may buy the wrong lamp and don't see anything. 


Even I once bought two cheap blacklight bulbs which then didn't work. Probably too weak 




Btw, can't share wishlist. Delete and Edit is possible, share not

Josiah Zayner

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May 5, 2014, 6:28:09 AM5/5/14
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Are you signed in? If I create a normal account I can share wish-lists. If I goto the Wish Lists link next to Order Status


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Mega [Andreas Stuermer]

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May 5, 2014, 7:50:28 AM5/5/14
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Attached the screen view. 

Share i not underlined. 

When I place the mouse cursor on "share" nothing happens. When I place it over "Delete" it shows a hand and it lets it happen
share.jpg

Mega [Andreas Stuermer]

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May 5, 2014, 7:53:25 AM5/5/14
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Ah ok. Found it out. You have to press Edit and then set public

Josiah Zayner

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Jun 2, 2014, 5:20:36 PM6/2/14
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Hey everyone, I am shipping most of the stuff available in the store now. Except for things that say "pre-order".

Feel free to email me if there is something you need that I do not have available.

Also, shipping prices are only setup for the US and UK so email me if you are from some other place. So I can setup shipping quotes for that country!

Thanks,
     Josiah Zayner, Ph.D.
     NASA ARC Space Bioengineering 
     Founder The ODIN
     http://www.the-odin.com
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