limitations, being in the world interconnected and being free !

[Rani Madhavapeddi]

Rani Madhavapeddi Patel

[Jeffrey Angelson]

Thanks Rani

I like these kind of things.  

Jeff Angelson

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[Rani Madhavapeddi]

🙏🏻💐

Rani Madhavapeddi Patel

On Jun 8, 2026, at 7:57 PM, Jeffrey Angelson <jeff.a...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Paul Rezendes]

Why would one want to free him or herself from the world? Would that even be possible?

Paul

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[Rani Madhavapeddi]

I think he or she is talking about the psychological world that creates conflict, and pain for ourselves and others through separation. 

Rani Madhavapeddi Patel

On Jun 9, 2026, at 5:19 AM, Paul Rezendes <pho...@paulrezendes.com> wrote:

Why would one want to free him or herself from the world? Would that even be possible?

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[Dan Kilpatrick]

All, 

Along the same lines, are we not the world? Are we somehow separate from it or beyond it? What would we be without it? It feels strange to speak of the world as an it, as if we know it's totality, as a thing....

-Dan

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[Dan Kilpatrick]

Sorry Rani, I wrote my post before your latest one came in. If your impressions are accurate, it is a confusing way for her to put it, at least for me.

-Dan

[Paul Rezendes]

Why do we humans seem to be always trying to escape to someplace where we are untouched? Escape from my own mind, the psychological? What's that all about? Do we see a place where we can hide from certain things? Is the psychological separate from the physical? Is there a place where we can go and escape change, what we call death? Have our minds created such spaces?

Just wondering.

Paul

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[michael luce]

This attempt to escape seems to be a major theme of my life. My interest in spirituality is all based on a hope that I can find a way to escape from the pain of existence. Is it not natural to try and move away from something that’s painful? I’m not sure how to get around it. It seems like my entire life is built around this fear/ inability to accept what’s painful. What to do with that…

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 9, 2026, at 10:31 AM, Paul Rezendes <pho...@paulrezendes.com> wrote:

Why do we humans seem to be always trying to escape to someplace where we are untouched? Escape from my own mind, the psychological? What's that all about? Do we see a place where we can hide from certain things? Is the psychological separate from the physical? Is there a place where we can go and escape change, what we call death? Have our minds created such spaces?

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/diehard-group/FE7B9E4E-B0FF-4FAD-AE1B-4A841B7A8CF4%40paulrezendes.com.

[Dan Kilpatrick]

All,

So does the freedom being spoken of here lie in no longer trying or needing to escape anything? Hard to see this from within the movement that wants to be free..... It would seem that all of this assumes a certain capacity to become free, implying choice, control, effort and so on. And as Paul asked, free from what? Ourselves as we are? Is this at all possible?

I guess all this boils down to what the word freedom is pointing to here. Possibly no longer needing to escape or be "free" from anything, because it's impossible and really holds no meaning?

More questions,

-Dan

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[Dan Kilpatrick]

Mike, 

I just wanted to say how much I appreciate your openness here. For me, acknowledging all this seems to carry its own meaning, just being it...... 

So it raises another question: is it necessary to get around it?

Thanks, -Dan

[michael luce]

I’m not sure if it’s necessary to get around it.  It sure seems like there’s a deeply ingrained assumption that it’s a problem followed by an endless attempt to move away from the “problem”. At least that’s how it seems to be playing out here. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 9, 2026, at 10:58 AM, Dan Kilpatrick <kilp...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Paul Rezendes]

Mike,

I hear you. I came to a place in my life where I seriously wondered if all of life was just about avoiding pain and seeking pleasure. Yes, it feels very natural to move away from pain; we all do it. The Buddhists sometimes talk about this in terms of two arrows. The first arrow sticks into your leg, and there is pain. That's enough to deal with, but then we shoot the second arrow: I shouldn't have done certain things, and this wouldn't have happened. Now I'm having more pain. Through the course of my life, losing two families, there was a lot of pain. When I met Paulette, I realized that if I was going to commit to her and totally give myself to her and be vulnerable to her, to love her completely without protecting myself from the fact that the same thing could happen, there could be pain because of the relationship. Holding back would mean I wouldn't have an intimate relationship. I realized deeply that I needed to fully accept all the possibilities, to fully embrace the pain and joy of life she could bring me, either or both. So it seems to me, to embrace life fully is not to escape from it but to embrace all of it, even if some of it's not pretty. Do we have a choice? As I said previously: people have sought all kinds of ways to avoid the ultimate pain of death, the eternal soul as in Christianity, or identifying with eternal awareness.

While I was writing this response to you, Dan came in. Your endless attempts to solve the problem sure sounds like a lot of arrows being shot at the problem. It all hurts. Are the arrows helping?

Paul

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[Rani Madhavapeddi]

It is from the sense of separation between it from ourselves or the world that’s what is being pointed to. For those who don’t see a separation there is no problem isn’t it? It’s from where you are looking at? 

If I feel the world is separate from me there is conflict. If I don’t see myself separate there is no conflict. 

Anyway that’s my 2 cents !

Love peace and joy 

Rani Madhavapeddi Patel

On Jun 9, 2026, at 7:52 AM, Dan Kilpatrick <kilp...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Rani Madhavapeddi]

Till one sees that unity and flow one feels separate and in separation there is an identification with I me myself suffering, wanting to escape till a realization of this IS it. Nowhere to go no place to be isn’t it? 

Love peace and joy! 

Rani Madhavapeddi Patel

On Jun 9, 2026, at 8:33 AM, Rani Madhavapeddi <rmadha...@gmail.com> wrote:

It is from the sense of separation between it from ourselves or the world that’s what is being pointed to. For those who don’t see a separation there is no problem isn’t it? It’s from where you are looking at? 

[Dan Kilpatrick]

Mike, Paul, All,

Mike, I think Paul did a wonderful job of illustrating how our very living circumstances are where understanding ultimately comes, not in trying to figure out a way to live. So we are already in the midst of it all, wherever we are, right here and now. Even this moving to escape etc is where we are right now, it is not outside whatever is happening.....  The point might be, again, that escaping might be its own illusion. Truly coming to see this might already be having its own action, which is never a way out of anything. The whole notion of finding a way out may already have left the room, simply because it doesn't hold any meaning anymore. 

Again, this is non-conceptual, just in the very circumstances of our living, no longer avoiding them, living just as it is right now.... 

Thanks Mike, -Dan

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[Jeffrey Angelson]

Dan Paul Mike Rani All

What I hear in this is not a call to escape the world, but to understand our relationship to it.

We spend a lot of time trying to get away from what is here—our circumstances, our thoughts, our feelings, our limitations. Yet wherever we go, here we are.

Perhaps freedom is not found in leaving life behind, but in no longer resisting it.

Not resignation.

Not passivity.

Acceptance.

Meeting life as it appears.

The rain, the sunshine, the joy, the disappointment, the confusion, the clarity.

This too.

As Paul often reminds us, we are already in the midst of it. Life is not happening somewhere else. It is this moment, exactly as it is.

Maybe the freedom we seek is not from the world, but from our endless effort to escape what has already been given.

Jeff Angelson

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[Paul Rezendes]

Jeff,

Not that you don't understand this... What Dan was actually trying to point out is that even the endless effort to escape is accepted as well. It is not accepted intentionally, of course. There's an understanding there that doesn't need to fight.

Peace,

Paul

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[Jeffrey Angelson]

Paul Everyone

Agreed. The effort to escape is included too. Seeing it as something separate to be overcome may itself be the activity of the self appearing again.

Jeff Angelson

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[Dan Kilpatrick]

Paul, Jeff, Mike, All,

Paul, thanks for clarifying things, this was very clearly shared, to me.

With appreciation, -Dan

On Tue, Jun 9, 2026 at 1:26 PM Paul Rezendes <pho...@paulrezendes.com> wrote:

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[Jeffrey Angelson]

Miracle. I understand and agree 

Jeff Angelson

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[Paul Rezendes]

Jeff,

You said, "Seeing it as something separate to be overcome may itself be the activity of the self appearing again.” Yes, and there's no fighting with that.

Peace,

[Paul Rezendes]

Dan, thanks.

Paul

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[JIM PETERSON]

Hey Mike and All,

 

I wanted to respond to this much earlier but I've just been tied up all day.  Mike, you've received a lot of thoughtful and helpful responses, and I'm not at all sure that what I say here can add anything to it.  But your comments reminded me of an old story or parable, a Buddhist one I think.  I'm sure you've heard it perhaps many times.  My Buddhist brother in law refers to it sometimes.  It goes like this: You're working on a project, and a tool you need is in the storage room.  The light switch in the room doesn't work and there's just a little light coming from windows.  You start into the room, but something catches your eye on the floor in a corner.  It's a snake coiled up ready to strike.  You stop in your tracks.  Poisonous snakes have been known to get into people's houses around here.  A kid was bitten just recently and had to go to the hospital.  You slowly back out of the room without getting the tool you need.  You pace in the hallway.  You're afraid to run in there and try to grab the tool.  And anyway you've got to get the snake out of the house, but how?  Call animal control, but they're disrespectful, and half the time they don't show up.  How are all these snakes getting into your house?!  You find a flashlight and creep to the threshold of the room's door.  You turn on the light and shine it to the far corner, and sure enough, there it is, and it's a big one.  It's very quiet, very still, so you creep a little closer.  It's too quiet, too still.  You walk closer, and in the light you see it: a coil of rope.  The snake is actually a coil of rope.  You put it there yourself two weeks ago and forgot about it.  Relief floods your body and mind.  You laugh out loud at yourself.  The fear has disappeared.  These dark stories you tell yourself are coils of rope.  The rope is still there, but it isn't what you thought it was.  The story is still there, but it isn't what you think it is.  You give it power with your interpretation, your already nailed-down belief.  You can see that happening right in the moment that it's happening.  Discovering how it works becomes interesting in itself.  Fascinating even.  That discovering is the light.  Forgive me Mike for going on like this, but I have gone through what you're going through.  Seriously.  You and I are not alone.  Seeing that my dark stories and thoughts were just coils of rope and not snakes eventually brought great relief.  A certain kind of freedom.  The rope is still there, but it's not a snake.  One doesn't need to escape a coil of rope.  The emotional and psychological pain turns into laughing at yourself.  Get the tool.  Finish the project.

 

Jim

 

 

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