On first racking

[Daniel Waksman]

Hi guys, hope you are all good.

I have loads of questions. But ill try not to overwhelm.

This particular time i am in need for clarification on the first racking process. I have read everywhere that from primary to secondary fermentation, it is recommended to make a racking to ditch lees. I think that my fermentation temperature was too high so after 10 days or so the batch it was already near 1000. I decided not to rack and as so it ended the secondary on lees. It turned out not so bad. Nevertheless i consulted a local enologist (wine related, not knowing anything about cider) and he said that what i did is standar process for wine. I mentioned that cider requires an intermediate racking and he was a bit surprised and he mentioned things like stalling fermentation and so. 

So if I may ask a little bit more clarification on why that raking is made and how it benefits the process I would be so grateful. It will help me put my ideas in order and understand the process from a more technical level.

Thanks so much!

[CGJ]

Hi Daniel,

You're going in the correct direction with "stalling fermentation".
Basically, when you rack, you are removing nutrients, so the yeast can
no longer grow, and fermentation slows, or may even stop, leaving you
with a product with residual sugar and a moderated alcohol level.

There are two books generally recommended to cover many of these
questions, each written by frequent contributors here. Both are worth a
read, and having on hand as references:

"The New Cider Maker's Handbook: A Comprehensive Guide for Craft
Producers" by Claude Jolicoeur
"Craft Cider Making" by Andrew Lea.

Happy cidering!
Carl Johnson
West Barnstable, Massachusetts

[Claude Jolicoeur]

Your enologist is right - it is completely normal for wine to ferment to dryness in a week (maximum 2 weeks).

For cider, in the industry they will also often make such fast ferments, but craft makers generally prefer much slower fermentations over Winter, to be ready for bottling in Spring.

[Daniel Waksman]

Thanks Guys. I already have Claude's book. Ill buy Andrew's now.

Nevertheless It is still not clear to me why the first racking is to be done.  I will go back to both books to try to find the answer but if you have any clue i would appreciete it. 

Thanks so much

Best

[John Were]

Hi Daniel,

I don't bother with racking mine off the lees for at least 6 months and often longer. This is partly efficiency/laziness but also I haven't found any detriment to leaving it on the lees. Our 2020 is still bubbling slowly away for the most part. We use wild yeast rather than a commercial yeast strain and I have heard (probably on this forum) that leaving on the lees is more successful with wild fermentations than commercial. ymmv.

The additional benefit of not racking an additional time or more, is that there is less chance for oxygen to get into your cider.

Best,
John

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[CGJ]

Daniel,

There is a finite amount of (for example) nitrogen in the raw apple
juice; there will never be more. This nitrogen is required for the yeast
to grow. When an individual yeast cell dies and drifts to the bottom of
the container, it is effectively taking its nitrogen out of the
inventory available for other yeast to grow. (Some small fraction may be
returned to solution through lysis of the dead cells, but we're talking
broad brush concepts at the moment.)

With an first early racking, you may be leaving a fair portion of the
nitrogen, vitamins and other nutrients still in solution to support
yeast growth. So, a very early first racking might slow, but not
completely stop, fermentation. It might then be easier assess when to do
a later racking that would further reduce the fermentation rate to
achieve the level of sweetness you're hoping for (assuming that your
purpose in multiple rackings is to control the final residual sugar).

Is that perhaps a bit more useful?

Cheers,
Carl

[Andrew Lea]

Just to add to what others have said ...

In mainstream cidermaking you don’t rack until fermentation is finished. Sometimes cider is left on its lees for months, sometimes not. The danger of leaving for long periods on the lees is from yeast autolysis and subsequent off-flavours.  Anecdotally, this is more of a problem if you have a fast nutrient-moderated fermentation with a cultured yeast. If you use a slow wild fermentation with no nutrient additions, off-flavours from autolysis are less likely.  I often leave such ciders on their primary lees from 6 months to a year.

However, in craft cidermaking, many people try to do arrested (wild) low-nutrient fermentations to conserve unfermented sugar. If this is what you wish to do then you would rack before the cider has gone to dryness, and maybe more than once. Claude’s book covers this. So does mine, but in less detail. 

However, the two styles of cider are rather different and you need to plan which style you are making before you begin. 

Also please note there is no such thing as secondary fermentation in cidermaking or winemaking.  That’s because cider is a wine and all the fruit sugars are fully fermentable. In brewing, once the primary glucose and maltose are gone then the remaining complex wort sugars (maltotriose and higher) are hard to ferment and this stage is called “secondary” fermentation.  

The term “secondary” is however sometimes used by cidermakers to refer to in-bottle fermentation to give a carbonated product, or occasionally to refer to the malo-lactic fermentation. 

Hope this helps

Andrew

Wittenham Hill Cider Portal
www.cider.org.uk

On 29 Jun 2021, at 16:18, Daniel Waksman <dwak...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks Guys. I already have Claude's book. Ill buy Andrew's now.

[Daniel Waksman]

Hi there!

Thanks to all. I think I have a bettter understanding on the whithertos and whyfors.

Ill keep on styding :)

Thanks again

Best

Daniel