Horrible

[Mika Juhani]

Hi!

I tested ChromeVox in Ubuntu 18.04 to study how screen readers work and then later help other people to use as accessible sites as possible by building better services.

To be honest ChromeVox is horrible! 

Sorry!

I uninstalled it. The first thing, how to start and stop loud speaking. It should be the first option to do after installing the app. If you go to the upper right corner in Chrome, you cannot find a button labeled "on" and "off". The first step is missing - controls!?!?!?

You can try to set some shortcuts (keys) to do starting and stopping but my humble question is..

.. is that the way according to accessibility guidelines?

Very big disappointment.

Sorry,

With best regards,

Mika

Post Scriptum: I do not even know how is it possible to publish add-on without an option to easy ways switch it on and off. 

[Felix G.]

Hello,
ChromeVox as a Chrome extension on Ubuntu is not representative of how
a screen reader works, generally speaking. How about trying Orca on
Ubuntu, or ChromeVox on Chrome OS?
Best,
Felix Grützmacher

Am Fr., 26. Feb. 2021 um 13:08 Uhr schrieb Mika Juhani
<hermann....@gmail.com>:

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[kenny Hitt]

Hi. Based on your message, you are a cited person with no clue what it's like to be a blind person who depends on the screen reader. Of course there's a shortcut key to turn on and off The screen reader just like there is on every other modern platform. Sorry for the attitude, but you really need to get educated before posting such comments.

--

[kenny Hitt]

Sorry for my last message. however, I've really getting fed up with people who post with attitude while they are ignorant. You will go much further if you start out being polite. now, off to disappear and follow my own advice.

[Felix G.]

Also, if we wish to be understood by sighted people, we should call
them sighted rather than cited, lest we create the impression that
blind folks cannot spell. Now, enough attitude!
Best,
Felix

> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chromevox-discuss/CAMTadK6bTPc%3DUCHA_P4d301o6jX7X2mCTMasxapysXGxy_9pDQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[kenny Hitt]

Sorry for the spelling error. I normally fix those, but I've switched to multifinger gestures with TalkBack 9.0, and there are major issues. before I post anything else, I'll do a better job and switch to my iPhone.

I'm attempting to fix my errors on my Chromebook but I'm finding issues editing.

Looks like I found a topic for the meeting: how to successfully edit in gmail.

[Mika Juhani]

Hi!

How educated should I be before using ChromeVox? Or is there maybe some other ideological way to design software? 

It is true, I do not have a personal need to use screen readers but I would like to help people with needs to use aiding technology to survive in their everyday life.

If there is no button to switch the app on and off, it think something very important is missing. Or if there is the button but I have to be educated before finding it, something else is missing.

I am a cognitive scientist and usability is very important aspect of design thinking for me.

But if you think the app is now nice and ready and feedback is not needed, okay for me.

I just told you all in the group that the first contact with the app was very very bad and frustrating.

But hey, I wish you all get helped with the app. I focus on some other solution now. Sorry for my feedback

With best regards,

Mika

[kenny Hitt]

Hi. The correct ideological way to design software currently is to make sure the existing screen reader on the operating system works with the browser. After that, you focus on making sure the websites the users are visiting work correctly with your browser and screen reader setup. extensions were needed in the past, but they have been deprecated by modern accessibility approaches. I hope this helps.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chromevox-discuss/64eb0e57-42a0-4892-a05a-4a8bd48c6ddfn%40googlegroups.com.

[Felix G.]

Hello Mika,
please find my answers inline below:

> How educated should I be before using ChromeVox? Or is there maybe some other ideological way to design software?

There is no ideology going on. One possible source of confusion is
that ChromeVox has two incarnations, one as a Chrome extension, the
other as a built-in screen reader belonging to Chrome OS. The Chrome
OS variant has much of what you are missing. For example, it can be
switched on and off with ctrl+alt+z. The Chrome extension variant
assumes the user is already running some kind of screen reader without
which he or she would not have been able to install the extension.

> It is true, I do not have a personal need to use screen readers but I would like to help people with needs to use aiding technology to survive in their everyday life.

I like your approach a lot.

> If there is no button to switch the app on and off, it think something very important is missing. Or if there is the button but I have to be educated before finding it, something else is missing.

True. As I mentioned, on Chrome OS that button is the ctrl+alt+z
shortcut, which is all the education a user will need. When ChromeVox
is launched for the first time on Chrome OS, it automatically starts a
tutorial which does the rest of the educating process.

> I am a cognitive scientist and usability is very important aspect of design thinking for me.

Thank you for applying it here. I hope other sighted users with an
interest in screen readers are reading along as we dive in.

> But if you think the app is now nice and ready and feedback is not needed, okay for me.

Feedback is always welcome. Misunderstandings might arise but can be
corrected, as we are doing here.

> I just told you all in the group that the first contact with the app was very very bad and frustrating.

That's an important observation. Maybe there is indeed a way in which
screen readers can be made more intuitive for sighted people wishing
to help screen reader users.

> But hey, I wish you all get helped with the app. I focus on some other solution now. Sorry for my feedback

I'm sure noone was offended by your feedback, and I hope neither were you.
Best,
Felix

[Mika Juhani]

Hi!

Thank you for your constructive comments. Let us live in peace with each other. Sorry if my bad language was too bad.

With a good feeling forward :-)

With best regards,

Mika

[Henk Abma]

Hi,

I actually thought that development of the extension has ended quite a while ago. Nowadays, Chrome works with the accessibility layers available on the used OS, so there is no longer a place for ChromeVox on those other OS-es. With ChromeOS being the exception, since ChromeVox is the only screenreader available for that platform.

So, like Felix said, on Linux you’d try orca, On Windows you could start off with narrator and on Mac use VoiceOver.

With kind regards,

Henk.

Met vriendelijke groeten,

Henk.

Op 26 feb. 2021 om 15:30 heeft Mika Juhani <hermann....@gmail.com> het volgende geschreven:



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[David Tseng]

Hi Mika,

You're probably not the first person to have the jarring experience of turning on a screen reader and become confused and horrified. As ironic as it might sound, the whole point is to keep reading everything on the screen, in excruitiatingly vivid detail. If you're not prepared for it, its volume, its sheer verbosity, you can quite reasonably become overwhelmed.

Though controls to stop and close might help you, as you yourself turned off the extension in chrome://extensions likely (and eventually uninstalled it), every screen reader more or less works this way, including Orca.

The simple fact is that if you're completely blind, assistive technology / screen readers are there to keep providing feedback. Just as your visual display doesn't sometimes work, likewise a screen reader doesn't just sometimes talk.

I felt it important to write this little note just so that the perspective though maybe quite divergent to yours, is articulated and something you can come to understand. It is a very different experience for sure!

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[Sandi Jazmin Kruse]

Hi, i will say this very short and right to the point, chromevox, is
so far the screen reader that has worked the best for me, and i have
my fingers in any other pie, as well from time to time. If I read
something and have a sighted person next to me they can quickly see
what I am marking on the screen, or what is sometimes more important,
what I am reading .
That aside the whole community around the screen reader seems more
geekish, at least some of us, and well i like that.
Keep it up and you will most likely find an amazing flock of people
who will do their best too answer and help you out, if we can




/sandie



On 2/26/21, 'David Tseng' via ChromeVox Discuss

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[gary-melconian]

Do agree with ken on this one. 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/chromevox-discuss/CAMTadK5R8X1FuZROGrLYG3raWeEMXLT3cE3yTJXUOL3xeP17%2Bg%40mail.gmail.com.