Re: [CESI List] Digest for cesi-list@googlegroups.com - 1 update in 1 topic

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Jakki O Donovan

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Jun 25, 2023, 5:57:51 PM6/25/23
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hi There
I remember an email a long time ago from Keith Gregg about taking qualifications to the teaching council to get teach computers certification.
Any chance I could get a copy?
or find out info about this
thanks
Jakki

On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 8:19 AM <cesi...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Jake Byrne <jake...@gmail.com>: Jun 23 02:26AM -0700

Hi all,
 
*One week* remaining to apply for the *Postgraduate Certificate in 21st
Century Teaching & Learning* at Trinity College Dublin (30th of June)
1 year part-time - 30 ECTs - level 9 - approx. €400 in total
 
*Apply Here*
<https://www.tcd.ie/courses/postgraduate/courses/21st-century-teaching-and-learning-p-grad-cert/>
 
*More Information Here*
<https://www.tcd.ie/education/courses/postgraduate/postgraduate-certificate-in-21st-century-teaching-and-learning/>
 
For the testimonials from alumni check out the twitter feed:
https://twitter.com/TA21PGCert/media <https://twitter.com/TA21PGCert/media>
 
Please get in touch if you need more information or have any questions.
 
Kind regards,
 
Jake
On Thursday, 8 June 2023 at 17:28:39 UTC+1 Jake Byrne wrote:
 
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Jakki O Donovan 
Creative Designer | Graphic | Educator | Illustrator


     

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Audrey Byrne

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Jun 25, 2023, 7:16:05 PM6/25/23
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Hey I just finished a computer science and software development course in Nci .. level 8 . It was 60 ECTs, I’m assuming that would be enough to qualify with teaching council to teach LCCS ?

Audrey

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Fiona Dunlea

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Jun 26, 2023, 3:10:55 AM6/26/23
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Morning all.

Firstly I spoke to a lady in PDSTCS and she told me you do not need to have CS registered with the Teaching Council to teach it. If you are registered for another subject schools will be happy with that.

But of course we all want our qualifications recognised but where CS is concerned the TC have outsourced the assessment of qualifications and for the additional fee of €100 this 3rd party company can scan your qualifications and tell you you are not qualified enough to meet their criteria.

I escalated my complaint within the TC and spoke at length with a lovely guy called Dylan. It seems to me they just have not thought all of this through and there is a complete disconnect with PDSTCS.
I get that it’s a relatively new subject but right now you’ll have to literally give blood to get CS registered and it is an absolute disgrace.

To give you my background I did a BA in Computers and Maths, then a HDip in Education and from there went straight into IT in a Software Development company. We did systems for Trading rooms globally so I got the most incredible experience in various roles from getting under the bonnet with Developers to implementing systems onsite. I’ve since launched a number of eComm businesses and developed an eLearning site for The Gaelic Players Association that was live for 5 years for a Leadership training programme.
I returned to Teaching Maths about 6 years ago as of course it was perfect with a family. I also taught IT skills to TY’s including showing them how to build a Shopify website.

I type all of this to highlight how even with all those qualifications and experience Dylan was to revert within a day, it’s been 2 weeks and the TC have failed to give me an answer.

Apologies for my long response but can anyone who got registered (I believe 30 odd teachers) advise how they were successful?

Also if you are on Twitter please follow this v interesting thread : 




On 26 Jun 2023, at 01:16, Audrey Byrne <audre...@gmail.com> wrote:



Mar

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Jun 26, 2023, 4:40:36 AM6/26/23
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Hi Fiona,

I'm registered as a computer science teacher with the teaching council. I have a postgrad and M.Sc in computing in education and was previously registered to teach Computer  Studies with the teaching council. When the subject changed to computer science I naively thought my subject would be updated as the criteria specifications were the same with the teaching council, but no ,I had to pay again and have my qualifications assessed again- it took 8 months.

Marcella



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Laurence Cuffe

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Jun 26, 2023, 4:45:43 AM6/26/23
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My understanding is that it is not only the number of ECT’s involved, but also there have to be a specific set of modules/topics covered.
I signed up for the Higher diploma in software development with DCU with a view to getting certified for CS, but it turns out it would not be sufficient. Essentially they seem to want a full undergraduate degree in CS.
So here we go from the teaching council website:
60ECTs of CS.

(a) To meet this requirement the degree must include the study of modules in all of the following areas: 

Essential areas1: 

1) Software Engineering and Project Management (may include software design and development systems analysis, design process, testing) 

2) Programming (including algorithms and data structures) 

3) Computer Systems (including hardware or architecture) 

Optional areas: The study must also include a minimum of 2 of the f ollowing areas: 

4) Web development 

5) Animation/games/multimedia development 

6) App development 

7) Robotics 

8) Embedded systems 

9) Modelling/simulation 

10) Data analysis 

11) Databases 

12) Machine learning/AI 

(b) Practical assignment work must be completed throughout the degree course (e.g. programming assignments). 



Its worth reading the fine print on course offerings at this time, because the phrase
“Can lead to teaching council registration” may mean that the CS content of that specific course will not be sufficient, and that you will have to do further modules or courses in CS.

The teaching council as I understand it, also want the modules to be part of a complete degree, so if you are missing one of the topic modules, and take it separately, I don’t think that would wash.
Best
Laurence Cuffe


On 26 Jun 2023, at 08:10, Fiona Dunlea <fidu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Morning all.

Firstly I spoke to a lady in PDSTCS and she told me you do not need to have CS registered with the Teaching Council to teach it. If you are registered for another subject schools will be happy with that.

But of course we all want our qualifications recognised but where CS is concerned the TC have outsourced the assessment of qualifications and for the additional fee of €100 this 3rd party company can scan your qualifications and tell you you are not qualified enough to meet their criteria.

I escalated my complaint within the TC and spoke at length with a lovely guy called Dylan. It seems to me they just have not thought all of this through and there is a complete disconnect with PDSTCS.
I get that it’s a relatively new subject but right now you’ll have to literally give blood to get CS registered and it is an absolute disgrace.

To give you my background I did a BA in Computers and Maths, then a HDip in Education and from there went straight into IT in a Software Development company. We did systems for Trading rooms globally so I got the most incredible experience in various roles from getting under the bonnet with Developers to implementing systems onsite. I’ve since launched a number of eComm businesses and developed an eLearning site for The Gaelic Players Association that was live for 5 years for a Leadership training programme.
I returned to Teaching Maths about 6 years ago as of course it was perfect with a family. I also taught IT skills to TY’s including showing them how to build a Shopify website.

I type all of this to highlight how even with all those qualifications and experience Dylan was to revert within a day, it’s been 2 weeks and the TC have failed to give me an answer.

Apologies for my long response but can anyone who got registered (I believe 30 odd teachers) advise how they were successful?

Also if you are on Twitter please follow this v interesting thread : 

Fiona Dunlea

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Jun 26, 2023, 4:47:41 AM6/26/23
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Marcella thanks so much for this, that’s pure maddening that is and the cynic in me would say it’s a money racket!! 🙄

Fiona

On 26 Jun 2023, at 10:40, Mar <marcellac...@gmail.com> wrote:



Fiona Dunlea

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Jun 26, 2023, 4:51:01 AM6/26/23
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Thanks Laurence, this reads like my CV but still insufficient so feeling pretty cancelled here 🫣

Met a CS teacher recently who also lectures in CS in a college and even he couldn’t get registered, like is it any wonder Teachers will go with other subjects instead??

On 26 Jun 2023, at 10:45, 'Laurence Cuffe' via CESI-list <cesi...@googlegroups.com> wrote:



Keith Michael Gregg

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Jun 26, 2023, 5:37:55 AM6/26/23
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Hi, I was mentioned here. It's about nine or ten years ago that I submitted stuff to teaching council. At that time Cs wasn't a subject and the short course in coding was just in pilot stage. I needed transcripts and at that time I think it was €200 to have my hdip in web computing and my MSc in web technology assessed (my dissertation was on art teachers and those with an art or design background being a good fit for the skills void). For TC, You need transcripts and also course/module descriptors from the college. They also need to be the official documents and not copies. The only exception is if they list your course on their " this meets the criteria" list for the subject, then you don't need to have it screened. It took about 10 weeks to go through and I was registered at second level for it/ICT. I teach further education now so I didn't look at upgrading it, but aside from that, everything I learned is out of date and I don't think I'd be able to teach it now as I'm out of the loop. As you mentioned, if you're established in a school they can more or less have you teach anything. I would only go to the bother of your looking to change schools or are yet to have a CID. 

One last point is that you can have any qualification level 8 or above added to your list of eligible subjects under route 3 - further education, without qualification assessment. This may be attractive to principals due to supposed teacher shortages, and it could be a stop gap. I hope this helps

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Alan Gaul

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Jun 26, 2023, 7:18:30 AM6/26/23
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Hi all,

As an addendum to Laurence's reply, for those who are not aware, the Teaching Council subject requirements for all subjects are given in this document:


I am not sure about Computer Science, but it is generally acceptable to take on some 'top-up' modules outside of your primary degree to complete their list of requirements, I took on an additional module to become qualified to teach Maths as I had not studied one of the essential areas in my degree, and I know of others who did something similar for Science. 

However, it is important that your primary degree includes the study of Computer Science as per the following guidelines:

1.

(a) Applicants must hold a degree-level qualification, with Computer Science studied up to and including third-year level or higher (or modular equivalent).

(b) The qualifying degree must be equivalent to at least Level 8 on the National Framework of Qualifications (NFQ) and with a minimum pass result in all examinations pertinent to the subject of Computer Science.

(c) The qualifying degree must carry at least 180 ECTS (European Credit Transfer System) credits (or equivalent) with the specific study of Computer Science comprising at least 60 ECTS credits (or equivalent).


Unfortunately, the Teaching Council is very picky when it comes to assessing qualifications. It can be difficult to provide them with module descriptors if you completed your degree some time ago, as they may not be readily available, especially if there are no digital records. Official transcripts and a letter on university headed paper or an official stamp may be needed for them to accept your module descriptors.

I hope some of this helps.

Kind regards,
Alan

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