Baby/check stay

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Blair Clark

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Jul 14, 2021, 8:01:54 PM7/14/21
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Hello group members,

I have never used the baby stay on the forward section of our mast. We are planning a return trip to Cape Breton which is about 160 nautical miles each way with average offshore of ten to twenty miles.

As we all know the ocean can be foggy and calm or clear and 20 to 30 knots with larger seas and swells. unless not forecasted and caught outside I would not plan to be out in heavier.

I would appreciate thoughts on proper use of check stay and whether our group feels it is helpful or necessary as it is a bit of an inconvenient wire in the Center of foredeck.

Thanks

Blair
C&C34+

cene...@aol.com

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Jul 14, 2021, 11:19:27 PM7/14/21
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As I understand it, the baby stay adds a measure of stiffness to the mast, and pulls the mast forward from its attachment point, usually against the tension provided by the aft running check stays.

All together, this stiffens the relatively 'bendy' masts of the later C&Cs and prevents (or minimizes) any fore and aft mast pumping in a seaway with swells, etc. Such pumping could lead to a mast that is bowed aft--not a good situation.

I do not go offshore with my 36 XL/kcb, which had an adjustable/removable baby stay. The baby stay was a PITA to tack going to weather as it would catch/damage the headsail and was another PITA to remove and tie to the mast so we could fly a kite. I removed it permanently as my spreaders were not angled aft but I still use the check stays that run aft to help stiffen the mast on upwind legs.

OTOH, if your mast is more like a telephone pole, it is not going to be bent by a baby stay. In that case, especially if your spreaders are not angled aft, it may not be very useful.

I did save the baby stay hardware just in case I venture offshore--in which case I would probably reinstall it. My mast is pretty bendy and in a seaway I would feel better if I could control the bend as I stiffened the mast..

FWIW,

Charlie Nelson
Water Phantom
1995 C&C 36 XL/kcb
 


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Jack Huttner

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Jul 15, 2021, 9:16:09 AM7/15/21
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My 1995 wing keel 36plus has no backstays. I looked at a few 37/40s rigged with them. I’m surprised to hear that some 34/36s have them.  Maybe the taller mast configurations of the XL and R?

I’ve ocean sailed three boats with back stays. Tensioned them on broad reaches on the windward side to mitigate mast pumping. None of these boats (2 Swans, one Bristol cutter) had baby stays. 

IMHO the baby stay is a tuning feature with extremely limited application. If you’re not racing and exquisitely tuning your rig, it is irrelevant. Perhaps it was something one of the designers insisted on and the marketing team thought it signaled the boat was “for connoisseurs”.  

I installed a hydraulic backstay adjuster and use that regularly to tune the main and Genoa, leaving the baby stay in a settled (unchanged) tension state. Have not seen the need to further flex the mast. 

Mine is rigged with a snap shackle and run to a clutch on the cabin top. When I use my assym or whisker pole, I remove it and secure the shackle to the mast. I had put a pvc pipe around it on my 30 to mitigate the clew from getting snagged on tacks but haven’t yet done it on Sheratan. 



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Regards,

Jack

Blair Clark

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Jul 15, 2021, 9:39:55 AM7/15/21
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Thank you for your feedback.

As a follow up I have an adjustable manual  pulley operated backstay which is single rod rigging from mast head to become split wire to turnbuckles on either side of transom. The pulleys pull a plate which constricts the angle of the wires to tighten.

I think this is a common option.

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Scott Milligan

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Jul 15, 2021, 9:59:47 AM7/15/21
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I have a rather stiff mast with a baby stay but no check stays or running back stays. The baby stay gives me a nice forward bend in the mid point of my mast thereby flattening somewhat the midluff section of the main. It also prevents mast pumping and in the end improves the boat’s upwind performance. It is a PITA for jibing with a whiskerpole.
I didn’t use the baby stay for a couple of years but now I use it all the time except downwind.
Scott 
SV Pepper 
1990 C&C 34+ WK

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On Jul 14, 2021, at 8:01 PM, Blair Clark <blairc...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello group members,
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cenelson

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Jul 15, 2021, 10:11:37 AM7/15/21
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Sounds good. I have a hydraulic back stay on my 1995 36 XL—don’t know if it was standard or an option.

When I had the baby stay, I could really put a bend in my mast. Of course my main sail was made with this in mind. 

Further, my baby stay deck mount was on a 3’ track and was adjustable fore and aft to help with the bend.

As is the case with most sailboats, making a change (remove baby stay) made my main sail at the time difficult to trim since it was built with the potential bend in mind and I no longer had a way to bend the mast!

In addition to the pumping fire and aft that a baby stay can counteract, if your main sail was built with the baby stay considered, you may find it to be more difficult to trim since it was cut considering the baby stay.

FWIW,

cenelson

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Jul 15, 2021, 10:31:22 AM7/15/21
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Got it. 

I think it was either added just in case or more likely because it was because it looked cool, giving these racer- cruisers a hint of their racing pedigree.

My sailmaker actually suggested getting rid of if since with spreaders athwartship (not angled aft) he saw no reason for it. Plus it was a PITA for tacks and then had to be moved to the mast to use a kite or whisker pole.

Charlie
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