Regarding Padmashali caste

[Yasoda Jivan dasa]

Namo Namah 

Respected Vidvaj-janas,

I seek your learned insights on the caste known as Padmashali, which is predominantly found in regions such as Telangana, Karnataka, Maharashtra, and Gujarat. Traditionally, their primary occupation has been weaving, which has led some to categorize them as belonging to the Śūdra varṇa. However, the community itself does not accept this classification and instead claims Brahminical heritage.

The Padmashalis have numerous gotras such as Atri, Kaushika, and others, which are commonly associated with Brahmin lineages. Furthermore, most of them trace their ancestry to Mārkaṇḍeya Ṛṣi, a revered sage in Vedic literature. According to a regional legend upheld within the community, Lord Gaṇapati once pronounced a curse upon their lineage, relegating them to the Śūdra status for a duration of 5,000 years into the Kali Yuga. It is believed that after this period, they will be restored to their original Brāhmaṇical standing.

In line with this belief, many Padmashalis today identify as Padma Brāhmaṇas. They perform sacred thread (upanayana) ceremonies and follow various Brahmanical rituals and samskāras, which reflect their aspiration and cultural alignment with Vedic traditions.

Given these facts, I humbly invite the reflections and scholarly opinions of the learned assembly regarding:

1. The historical and scriptural standing of the Padmashali community in relation to the varṇa system.

2. The validity of their claim to Brāhmaṇa status, either by lineage, conduct (guṇa-karma), or regional tradition.

3. References, if any, from śāstra, Itihāsa-Purāṇa, or modern historical sources that might support or critically examine their position.

Your scholarly input on this matter would be most valuable.

[bharat gupt]

Nothing surprising. In aapaddharma a group of a higher jati or just a person of a jati often adopted an occupation of lower Varna. This downwards movement has always been there.

Bharat Gupt
Former Faculty, Delhi University,
Trustee and Executive Member
INDIRA GANDHI NATIONAL CENTER FOR THE ARTS
(Ministry of Culture), New Delhi

Vice Chairman,NATIONAL SCHOOL OF DRAMA

mobile:+91- 98100 77914
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[Nagaraj Paturi]

Dear Yasoda Jivan Dasa maharaj,

Pranams. 

1. The historical and scriptural standing of the Padmashali community in relation to the varṇa system.
   
   

1. By 'scriptural' standing , if you mean Dharma Shastra, Smriti, Sutra standing, take it from me , not just the jaati of Padmashali , no jaati names or things related to those jaatis are available in any of those texts. 

   
   
   

1. References, if any, from śāstra, Itihāsa-Purāṇa, or modern historical sources that might support or critically examine their position.
   
   

1. Itiihasa purana texts from the traditional Sanskrit sources too do not cover the jaatis like Padmashali . 
   
   But there is a whole gen re of oral regional language folk literary texts called Jaati Puranas which articulate the claims of the Jaatis connecting their origins to Vedic , Itihasic and Puranic narratives, characters and narratives in them. 
   
   Indica organized a whole symposium on Jaati Puranas. 
   
   Full playlist : https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLplXz64H2WtH79DPZ2c_9o3acB5EJXrtB
   
   In Telugu , where Padmashali jaati is highly prominent there are oral epic narrative texts like Bhavana Rishi Puranam and Padma Puranam in folk style performed through folk performing arts . 
   
   But interestingly , there is a text called Padma Puranamu in classical Telugu composed in classical meters in a classical narrative kavya style , which is different from the Sanskrit Purana called Padma Purana. 
   
   
   

1. The validity of their claim to Brāhmaṇa status, either by lineage, conduct (guṇa-karma), or regional tradition.
   
   

1. This 'validity' is an unnecessary and unjustfiable question because there is no scale or basis on which the 'validity' can be decided. 
   
   But if you are interested in the rationale from which such claims are made ,  may I provide the following material from the existing studies regarding this :
   
   Such claims were given the name Sanskritization by an Indian Anthropologist of yester years called M N Srinivas. 
   
   His view of Sanskritization is that these Jaatis made these claims in imitation of Brahmins with a desire for higher social status that Brahmins enjoy. He opines that Yajnopaveeta Dhaarana etc., found among them is part of such an 'imitation. 
   
   He was exemplifying the five sculpting artisan communities calling themselves as Viswa Brahmins for this theorization. 
   
   I disagree(d) with MN Srinivas in this theorization. 
   
   There is evidence to show that the sculpting artisan communities required the study of Vedas and Agamas and sthaapatya shaastra in a Vedic way through Vedic initiation for their participation in the temple sculpting and architectural work. 
   
   Even today , the sthaptis hail only from these jaatis and they have been undergoing Vedic initiation and have been studying Vedas and Agamas and sthaapatya shaastra in a Vedic way for centuries , if not for millennia , generation to generation. 
   
   So their Brahmin way of life is organic and not an artificial imitation as felt by MN Srinivas. 
   
   Viswakarma as the sculpture and architect of the universe is a great beautiful concept available in Vedas and the sculpting artisan communities viewing themselves to be inheritors of the work of Viswakarma is equally beautiful and highly justifiable. 
   
   As Viswakarma is a prajaapati and is thus Brahma, viewing themselves as originating from Brahma from that perspective , is not unjustified or invalid. 
   
   In the same way, the weaving community too , on account of its role in the aagamic and other Vedic practices, views itself as originating from the sculpting figures from the Vedas , viewing their art of weaving as a kind of sculpting. 
   
   

   

   https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Devala_Maharshi.jpg

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Nagaraj Paturi

Kulapati | Vice-Chancellor, INDICA

 

 

 

[Yasoda Jivan dasa]

Thank you, Nagaraj Paturi ji, for your insights.

I would like to share that I belong to the Padmashali community, and our gotra is Kaushik. Within our community, there is a growing movement encouraging individuals to pursue Brahminical initiation and lifestyle.

A well-known tradition among Padmashalis speaks of a divine episode in which Lord Ganesha is said to have placed a curse upon the community, declaring that it would remain socially and spiritually degraded for the first 5,000 years of Kali Yuga. According to this narrative, that period has now come to an end, signifying the community's return to its original Brahminical identity.

Inspired by this belief, many within our community are reasserting their sacred heritage and  Vedic principles. I would be grateful to hear your learned perspective on this story and about the mentioning of the community in any of the old historical records.

Warm regards,

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